I have had it up to here waiting for the Beatles catalogue to be remastered

getting better is no picnic either

In one part George is playing a Strat with the ugliest "psychedelic" paint job lol

Own a rep for only Own a rep for only $25K.5K.

ums I h8 that bebopalula thing but whatev, it was a weird time

apologies for guitar nerd bullshit but...

Like, as the legend goes, the whole reason they had to play weird honky European instruments was because due to holdover wartime rationing, it was very difficult to get the decent-quality American instruments being made at the time. They wanted Strats and Teles (again, so the legend goes) like American musicians and the Shadows were playing at the time, but they simply weren't available.

Once it became possible to just send Mal out to pick up some Strats or Teles or whatever, they were already too spoiled and famous and rich to "properly" appreciate them (again, so the legend goes).

BUT at the same time, they made some pretty frking indelible music with the allegedly subpar instruments (and decidedly underpowered sound reinforcement) they had, so.

Maybe Stratocasters should have been illegal in 1980s America - force all those young glam shredders make do with horrid Sears guitars or whatever, maybe they would have made better music and the world would be a better place

xp Sorry, that didn't quite work...

Paul definitely has his offenses, but easily 75% of John's songwriting output in 64-65 would qualify at a minimum for Songs where the singer/protagonist comes off as a serious dick without meaning to

TS: "Run for Your Life" vs. "Jealous Guy"

Like, I'm not even sure he would have denied being a serious dick

"this woman wouldn't sleep with me bc she had to work in the morning so i fell asleep in her tub and then set her house on fire"

speaking of, it was interesting in pt 3 (i think?) where john was doing a song called "road to marrakesh" that seemed to be a precursor to "jealous guy"

"you won't see me" is part of that vibe too but i think it's a really amazing lyric and is basically paul's "no reply"

top two beatles songs

1. no reply
2. you won't see me

xpost

this is the early version of Jealous Guy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGAw_k3maXs

I enjoyed seeing them play around with a Stylophone. I was like, I have one of those, I could totally make a Beatles album.

It's a bird... It's a plane... No, Beatlemaniacs, you know better, it's the Beatles' new album, in wild STYLOPHONIC SOUND! Yes, the four lads have been working hard all year, and they say it's all for you...

xpost - cajun - that's the one! though in get back they call it "road to marrakesh" because he changed the opening line

yes Jealous Guy dates back to the Esher demos for the White Album (on the deluxe version it's called Child of Nature, alternately later called Road to Rishikesh / Marrikesh)

Yup

It's kind of a great Beatles trivia question, or it was at least.

The other big "woops, I'm a dick" song is of course "Getting Better."

I used to be cruel to my woman
I beat her and kept her apart from the things that she loved
Man I was mean but I'm changing my scene
And I'm doing the best that I can

Well then! Glad we got that sorted!

Anyway now let's talk about peace and fun coats and stuff

The Stylophone bit was great, so endearing seeing them enthralled by this new musical gadget (xposts).

In one part George is playing a Strat with the ugliest "psychedelic" paint job lol

Ha yeah someone had obviously seen Clapton's 'Fool' SG and had a go at their own version.

he "plays" (I guess, holds) that guitar in the I Am The Walrus section of magical mystery tour as well

Like, as the legend goes, the whole reason they had to play weird honky European instruments was because due to holdover wartime rationing, it was very difficult to get the decent-quality American instruments being made at the time. They wanted Strats and Teles (again, so the legend goes) like American musicians and the Shadows were playing at the time, but they simply weren't available.

Once it became possible to just send Mal out to pick up some Strats or Teles or whatever, they were already too spoiled and famous and rich to "properly" appreciate them (again, so the legend goes).

BUT at the same time, they made some pretty frking indelible music with the allegedly subpar instruments (and decidedly underpowered sound reinforcement) they had, so.

They really only had crap instruments until they went to Hamburg, and even then, John somehow got his hands on a Rickenbacker. George bought a Gretsch Duo-Jet from a sailor in Liverpool who'd brought it back from the US (his guitar on Please Please Me), and only switched to a Gretsch Chet Atkins because the Duo-Jet got stolen. Paul had the weakest instrument, that anemic-sounding Hofner bass. The moment they were able to get decent amps, George and John got Vox AC-30s in 1961 or '62, but EMI's restrictions meant they couldn't turn them up to Hamburg/Cavern levels in the studio. They actually stuck with various Vox amps through much (most? all?) of Sgt. Pepper and parts of the white album. George and John got Epiphones in 1966 (which John kept; not sure about George's). Paul and George were both given Rickenbackers in 1964, but Paul didn't like how heavy the bass was, and didn't really mess with it until 1965 ("Think For Yourself"). George was given the second Rickenbacker 12-string ever made, and later bought another one (a slightly different model). Paul had a Fender Esquire in '66 ("Taxman" solo), and George got his Strat around then ("Nowhere Man" solo). George and Paul got baked one night and painted their guitars; George kept the psychedelic paintjob, while Paul later stripped his Rickenbacker, but used that bass at least through '76, and probably later.

Ringo's Premiers sounded amazing on Please Please Me. He only bought Ludwigs for the finish. Coincidentally or not, Please Please Me has by far the best drum sound on a Beatles record until 1966.

So the upshot is that, starting in 1961-62, George, John, and Ringo all had great instruments (and Paul bent his Hofner to his will). While they would later sometimes use Fenders or Gibsons, that was a change in sound rather than quality.

(Sorry, that was long.)

Thanks Tarfumes for your superior nerdery

Someone mentioned this way upthread, but it was really interesting seeing the Fender VI bass in action in Get Back. It's such an odd instrument that I've heard about much more than I've ever seen. I guess the first time I noticed one was in a TV clip of Cream playing "Strange Brew" where Jack Bruce is miming playing one - which confused me initially bc I thought it was a guitar. Still seems counterintuitive that you could get bassy tones out of those narrowish strings.

wow, great post Tarfumes. i know zero about this stuff, but it adds some texture to my fandom.

Indeed, booming post, Tarfumes.

I first saw the Fender VI in that same Cream video and thought they were just using a regular guitar for the lipsync which insight I posted on this borad, promoting a tough love teaching moment from one (ex-)ILX0R, at which point I learned my lesson, or that lesson at least.

How all the Beatles took the Stylophone and made crazy sci-fi flying saucer sounds on it, having a laugh.

And then Billy takes it to the side and proceeds to actually play "Old Brown Shoe" on it.

Yes, I noticed that. Because, he could.

the whole reason they had to play weird honky European instruments was because due to holdover wartime rationing, it was very difficult to get the decent-quality American instruments being made at the time

You actually couldn't buy American guitars in Britain during the '50s. The ban was only lifted in 1959.

https://www.ajournalofmusicalthings.com/when-it-was-illegal-to-buy-american-guitars-in-britain/

Paul's loyalty to Hofner basses is kind of odd, still plays one primarily to this day.

Though maybe he gets really high quality ones with good hardware/pickups custom made that look like the old one.

Trying to find my own BASSMAN sticker... Bet the rest of the band would be very impressed.

I sort of understand his attachment to Hofners: it was the first bass he ever played, so anything else just isn't going to feel as comfortable and familiar. And he's not getting any younger, so a lighter bass makes the most sense now.

Even in Get Back, I think there's a moment in the second part where John asks him why he doesn't use one of the better ones and he says he's sticking with it 'cause it's lighter'.

Never thought about that, that he was playing the Rick for a while before he went back to the Hofner.

Then again I recently looked at the history of John Entwistle's basses and was surprised at the times he was just playing a Precision, like on The Rolling Stones Rock and Roll Circus.

I have a VI and it’s *cool*, all my pinky guitar riffs sound like a grand piano

Although I guess it wasn't "just" a Precision.

argh *plinky

I thought a Fender VI was the equivalent of a baritone guitar, like what the country musicians called a tic-tac guitar, used to double the upright bass, or the Danelectro Glen Campbell borrowed from Carol Kaye to play the solos on "Wichita Lineman" and "Galveston."

Glyn John's fashion is off the hook

Until it wasn’t

https://i.imgur.com/6LPmCMt.png

I thought a Fender VI was the equivalent of a baritone guitar

a Fender VI is typically tuned lower than a baritone guitar, a full octave below standard guitar tuning, while a baritone guitar is only a third to a fifth lower

Ah, okay, good to know.

Then again I recently looked at the history of John Entwistle's basses and was surprised at the times he was just playing a Precision, like on The Rolling Stones Rock and Roll Circus.

He ran through most of the major guitar makes throughout his career (he even played a semi-hollow Gretsch bass on one TV appearance). He consistently played Fenders from ‘65 through ‘70 (it’s a Fender Jazz on “My Generation”), but when the halls got bigger, he needed something with more bass that would reach the back rows. So he switched to a Gibson Thunderbird in ‘71, and played that (or sometimes a “Fenderbird” — he put a Precision neck on a Gibson) through ‘74, when he decided he missed that biting treble sound. That’s when he found Alembic, and stuck with them until the late ‘80s. (He also kept adding to his massive amp rig, and was deaf as a post by the time he died.)

Full history here (the go-to site for all your Who gear nerd needs): https://www.thewho.net/whotabs/gear/bass/bass.html

To bring it back to the Beatles, Entwistle was on one of Ringo’s All-Starr tours in the ‘90s, and claimed to have played “Yellow Submarine” more times than Paul McCartney.

Hah! I have no doubt that he did, and probably lots of similar statements could be made.

Responding to (but affirming) minority posts from above: I love Mr. Moonlight because it's so crazy and also because it fits into that category of Beatles songs with lame keyboard solos in the middle (like the cheesy department store stag film piano in the otherwise great "Not a Second Time"). Also John is off the hook on that one.

Even more unpopularly, I totally have a soft spot for the George Martin curry restaurant edition of the Help! album. The title song still feels incomplete to me without the James Bond intro.

Poor John Entwhistle...

JE: Finally. I'll never have to play "Magic Bus" again!

RS: You ready, Johnny? IN THE TOWWWWN, WHERE I WAS BORRRRN....

lol. My favorite Ringo’s All-Stars story was Jack Bruce and Dave Edmunds complaining about learning Eric Carmen’s songs because he “changes chords with every word” or something like that

Re:Anthology discussion earlier, i love the stuff they did on Morecambe & Wise, when they sang Moonlight Bay

someone put up the entire episode which i’d not seen before (Beatles interaction comes at 28:15, but they have a couple of earlier musical numbers as well - that boy & all my loving)

i just love how happy they are to be on the show, you can tell they were big fans

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qw9dJG8GnmY

https://observer.com/2017/08/eric-carmen-raspberries-pop-art-live-interview/
Apparently the current crop of All-Stars is less well-known to us older ILX0rs

If you dig Morecambe and Wise you might like this, which I only recently learned about and is quite amazing. Beatles as Midsummer Night Dream's rude mechanicals:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxXkdYr5JYg

!

I saw Ringo's All Starr Band for the first time in 2019 (I think, maybe it was 18) and it was so much fucking fun. We got Steve Lukather and Colin Hay! I mean I got to hear Men at Work songs with Ringo playing drums. That fucking ruled. Also Ringo did Photograph and Boys and a bunch of other shit you want to hear him sing. It was a blast.