Awesome Audiophile Snake Oil

what devices do you have hooked up to your kenwood?

in - TV, blu ray, turntable, CD, bluetooth receiver for phone/streaming

out - Polk loudspeakers

you could disconnect the cd player from the receiver and connect it to the dinky little amp to see if it's better than the receiver. or if you buy the dinky little amp with bluetooth you could stream directly to that and see if it sounds better than your receiver.

alternatively, and i don't know if this will work, you can keep everything as is except run a set of RCA cables from the "rec out" jacks of the "video 1" or "video 2" sections on the back of your receiver to the RCA inputs on the dinky little amp. and of course switch the speaker wires from the receiver to the amp. that might allow you to retain the input-selection capabilities of your receiver while offloading the amplifying job to the dinky little amp. if you think it sounds better, obviously.

would an amp like that be adequate for powering these speakers?

I'm not ready to ditch the Kenwood quite yet, but I think I'd replace it with a more modern receiver/amp before I'd replace the Polk speakers

the kenwood is 2x80W, the fosi audio claims to be 2x50W. i think it should be fine for normal listening volumes but you won't know until you try.

your polks are supposed to be relatively sensitive (90db @ 8 ohms) so that helps.

The subwoofer has stereo rca ins and a coaxial in. The receiver has a single subwoofer jack of indeterminate type.

generally subwoofers will have two rca ins but the manual will tell you that using just one is fine. if the receiver has a single rca out, you can usually do one-to-one. if you're worried about that working at it is rca, then you can get a single-to-dual splitter and connect it up.

there might also be some setting to actually enable subwoofer output, or a crossover knob on some part of the setup that's way off.

yes, I have screwed up connecting a subwoofer several times. welcome to my blog

I did one rca out from the subwoofer jack to the subwoofer L in and enabled subwoofer on the stereo, but didn't get any signal. I may test more thoroughly, but either way would need to get a dedicated subwoofer for the stereo, which I expect would actually work.

Here's the set I have, I think there's a good chance that it only operates with all the pieces connected. Power comes from the subwoofer, but all the controls are in the right speaker.

https://www.amazon.com/Edifier-Bookshelf-Subwoofer-Bluetooth-Wireless/dp/B077Y6PHKQ/ref=sr_1_20

those edifiers take the full audio signal in through the subwoofer and then send the signal to your L/R speakers. i think the subwoofer is where the amp is housed too.

lol @ using s-video and uh a VGA connector? some sort of serial port? for the l/r speakers.

https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/91+pV7-Jv4L.jpg

try running rca cables from the "rec out" rca jacks on your receiver instead of the subwoofer out. i think the rca jacks on your edifier subwoofer are looking for a full audio signal not just a subwoofer signal. also make sure you've selected the right input on your edifier control pa thingy (looks like it's either "PC" or "AUX")

yeah, the connectors to the r/l speakers are ridiculous

I might experiment with some of this stuff, I did indeed forget to change the input selection for the speaker, but I'm also not sure that is possible without the righthand speaker connected because that's where the control is.

well, at the very least you could see if you can run the edifiers setup with L/R speakers attached with signal from the "rec out" of your receiver. that way you'll know if you could use an external amp like the fosi amp off your receiver if you so choose.

Off topic kind of but damn speaker stands really do help huh? My set sounds so much better after moving my q acoustic bookshelf speakers off the bookshelf

I connected the subwoofer out to the edifier aux L channel. Set subwoofer to on in the receiver and turned the output volume all the way up. I was able to get a low rumble when the receiver was in test mode, but nothing noticeable when playing music. I also tried the Video out and got nothing from that, I don't think it works unless you select the Video input on the receiver.

use VIDEO 2 and put the receiver in monitor mode per the below

https://i.postimg.cc/XYnGXwXN/Screenshot-2024-02-07-at-3-30-28-PM.png

use VIDEO 2 and put the receiver in monitor mode per the below

https://i.postimg.cc/XYnGXwXN/Screenshot-2024-02-07-at-3-30-28-PM.png

sorry, these are better instructions:

https://i.postimg.cc/52F44yS9/Screenshot-2024-02-07-at-3-37-25-PM.png

your receiver is old enough that it has a mode where you can use it in conjunction with a tape/MD deck to record stuff to a tape/MD, so it has the ability to pass-through audio signal outwards from the VIDEO 2 REC OUT jacks. but now, instead of using hooking up those jacks to a tape/MD deck, you're hooking up those jacks to your edifier and feeding it the audio signal. make sense?

and again, your edifier's gonna want a full-spectrum audio signal from two RCA jacks, not the bass-only signal from your receiver's subwoofer output jack.

i also don't think adding a sub to your polks is going to give you that 3d-ness and imaging you're chasing. but it's fun to experiment!

xps Heez also spikes can make quite a difference if you’re able to use them, particularly for louder listening

actually Moodles looking at your Polks I would for sure pop a sock in the ports, and spikes may well be of help as well. I think with that widely spaced an array of speakers, being close to them is going to break up any imaging cues anyway. You might need something more compact for your room size. What were those Pioneer bookshelf ones designed by some audio guru? Also stuff like the smaller Missions and Acoustic Research can be great value used.

I'm totally going to crash the thread and ask whether I should have my KEF Concorde floorstanders on spikes or little stands? I was bequeathed them and they're fucking gorgeous things. I've always wondered if I should elevate in some way. These badboys: https://www.radiomuseum.org/r/kef_concord_a6243.html

stands on spikes if you can!

OK, amazing - thank you! Guessing I'd have to have those made?

Loving this knowledge. Dear 龜, mattkkkkk et al, please come to my home and show me how to tweak my stereo

This^^^

Those vintage Kefs look pretty amazing. I know someone that has vintage Klipsch speakers that are like pieces of furniture.

I have vintage Kef 104ABs and even if cosmetically 6/10 they still look and sound amazing (on little vintage Apollo hi fi stands with wheels which might be acoustically uncool but sure is handy for vacuuming)

Those vintage Kefs look pretty amazing.

They're like having a pair of warm menhirs in the room. In amazing nick too. I've always had a sneaking suspicion I'm not using them right. I shouldn't be allowed nice things.

I'll look up some Apollo stands, emsworth.

OK, after much fiddling with wires, I have determined that the monitor out does kind of sort of work. I was able to get a signal to the Edifier speakers when the input was set to Tape (which is the main input I use for the bluetooth connection from my phone) as well as Aux (which is for my turntable). Monitor does not work for CD/DVD, which is what I use for the TV and Blu Ray player. So it might be feasible to add a separate amp, but I'd have to use the kenwood amp for TV. This leads me to wonder if there are any little amps like the ones linked that are good for multi component systems. I can't seem to find any receivers designed just for managing multiple sources that don't have their own dedicated amp.

As for the Polks, they may well be too big for the room (I sit maybe 11 feet away from them), but I'm holding on to them for now. they sound good, I just think there may be ways to make them sound better. Is the suggestion to fill the front port? There is no rear port. I could see that being an option if I added a sub, but for now probably need the bass response. The speakers don't sit flat on the floor, they have feet that raise them about an inch, but perhaps could go higher?

Father in law has some old KEFs from the 80s, i adore them. Anything you play just seems to slowly fall out of them like a wooly old sock. I don't know if I'd like them as my only system but i get my fill when I'm up in Toronto

i bet monitor out was intentionally disabled for the CD/DVD input to prevent illicit taping of copyrighted music and movies!

you can use a passive rca switcher like this one. but down this path lies madness. and you don't even know if you like that amp yet.

i think all i can glean from your setup is that your receiver is 20+ years old and your TV probably is too. at the risk of throwing you another curve ball, you could also consider getting a modern receiver with some sort of DSP (digital signal processing) which is what your edifier has as well and might be contributing to the imaging/3D effect you like. that'd cost a bit more than a $50 amp but might tick more of your boxes.

i wouldn't change the speakers out.

Moodles yes fill the front port - I have VAF DC-7s which are a midpriced Australian model of similar size to your Polks, I have them in quite a large room and jammed a sock in the front ports, immediately the bass calmed down and everything snapped into focus. No need to raise them (the tweeter should be at ear level) but I would put spike feet on them too. If you have carpet it's no problem, if you have floorboards it's your call, but a sound absorbent rug (+ wall hanging behind, if compatible with your decor) would probably do wonders. A subwoofer is very unlikely to help unless you do something more drastic like cut the bass to the Polks or disconnect the lower drivers.
The Pioneers I mentioned above are model SPBS22LR designed by Andrew Jones - I only know them by reputation.
And brimstead in all truth I don't know shit, I am just a human GPT4 who refracts others' online pronouncements. Although I do enjoy good sound.

that's wild about the amp not allowing you to bootleg the audio off the TV

Spikes on hardwood floors?

Can be done, depends on your tolerance for little holes, or one can get spike cups (reduces the point of doing it!).

I've done it with coins under the spikes. But didn't seem to help much in the room and went back to just stands.

I have a modern tv, but yes, the receiver is ancient and probably the most sensible piece to replace completely rather than the speakers, which are fairly new. I probably will still try a subwoofer first because the receiver is set up for it, and there are some nice reasonably priced options.

I might try the sock thing, but am hesitant about pulling off the nice screens on the speakers. I think part of the issue I have is that I'm getting more boomy midrange rather than true sub frequencies. I think if I add a sub, I can run it at a fairly low volume for low frequency thump, and that will take pressure off the Polks to carry those frequencies, I can cut the bass on those and focus on mids and highs. I've found with the Edifier set that I don't really need the sub turned up particularly loud, just having it there to fill out the frequency spectrum makes a big difference.

I did a little digging into the world of receivers, and wow, what a mess. Am I not looking in not looking in the right place or is it just really hard to find a midrange receiver optimized for music? It's all surround sound av behemoths. I'm under the impression they are not great for basic stereo applications.

new stuff is all garbage imho, go used

some pretty good Rotel and NAD receivers on eBay or whatever at the moment. The Kenwood might fall into that 90s hole where they cut production costs and the cheaper componentry sounded distinctly less good. These days even the cheaper stuff measures up.

i spent way too much money on this lil' doohickey which costs as much or more than a lot of AV receivers, despite being from the 'affordable, made in the USA' comedy brand:

https://www.schiit.com/products/saga-2

does what i need it to do though which is switch from a variety of inputs with a remote and has a preamp included. has a little tube doohickey i don't use. wish there was a cheaper version.

if you don't need preamp/remote functionality this looks pretty solid as an awesome audiophile snake oil unit: https://www.amazon.com/TC-7240-Router-Switcher-Selector-Splitter/dp/B00KDQXITG

then you get to spend way too much time thinking about what separate preamp and amp you want to lust after!

I have a Saga as well that I bought as a backup preamp when I sent my vintage preamp off for service for several months. It was fine, but I kind of agree with sleeve that vintage/used is going to give you way more bang for your buck.

I'm mixing old and new... 80s Kenwood pre-amp into a tiny T-amp in power amp mode. I wouldn't have thought a good pre-amp could help the sound so much. Tempted to test a vintage power amp in the setup but it already sounds so sweet... plus the fact it uses barely any energy.

wondering if "integrated amp" might be a better search term for Moodles browsing anything new, because yeah if you're doing stereo then i think you're wasting your time looking into big home theater "receiver" type things. Only issue might be relatively small number of inputs. Easily fixed with a cheap passive switcher...but yeah

This seems like a fairly solid option for the kind of thing I'm looking for, solid design and sound without going crazy with AV options.

https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/marpm6007/marantz-pm6007-2-ch-x-45-watts-integrated-amp-w/d-to-a/1.html

Pair it with something like this and the Polks, I think that would be pretty good.

https://www.amazon.com/Klipsch-R-100SW-10-Subwoofer/dp/B07FKH9ZDC/ref=sr_1_8

sounds v nice!

Don't know if/when I'd pull the trigger on this, but I think it's getting toward what might work for me. I still want to see what the sub would sound like with the Kenwood first.

definitely. i did a similar half ass rigging up of a sub in my living room for a little while and found it just not worth it.

nice open box deal, but the 12" is probably massive overkill

https://www.adorama.com/us1771735.html

I pulled the trigger on the oversized sub, it was too good a deal to pass up. Assuming it actually works, I'm sure I can figure out how to fit it in without overwhelming the other speakers.