Taking Sides: EPs vs LPs

The EP (as i used to know and love) is probably dying off now with the advent of CD singles, remixes and mp3 downloads...

'Search: LPs made of EPs'

michael said 'broadcast'
i said 'beta band'

:-)

Correct. My post was misunderstood, because I was (as usual) unclear. The story I heard was that Kate Bush wanted to release what is now side two of Hounds of Love as an EP, The Ninth Wave. Her record company didn't think this was a good idea, since albums sell better than EPs. So, the album is actually two EPs (Hounds of Love and The Ninth Wave), but they have never been available separately. Similar situation with 3 EPs (i.e. never been available separately). Any other examples? And not just "part one," "part two," etc (e.g. Double Bummer by Bongwater). I get the feeling that Chris Knox likes screwing around with these sorts of things. Like, putting a new single, EP, and album all together (Duck-Shaped Pain...), and there's Songs of You and Me (two mini-albums).

I'd be interested in knowing y'all's reactions to the EP/mini-album as a legitimate 'aht' form. Many of my favorite albums are EPs. Everything's kept short, sweet, simple, and they are usually cheaper. And are often more focused works than LPs. Their short length gives them a special allure, as in they are smaller and cuter but definitely cooler. Idunnoifyacatchmydrifthere. Like they are puppies as opposed to the big dawgs.

I am least prone to become bored (good for the ADD nation) when listening to EPs. You can listen to them over and over and it won't seem like a tiring experience. You don't have to press the skip/scroll button as much if looking for a particular song, and so on. That is as good a case as I can make for these cuties. LPs are usually too long and drawn out, and often fail to set a steady mood. EPs have the potential to be more powerful and cause more impact but also to leave you hungry for more.

WHAT'S YOUR MALFUNCTION?! Um, sorry...

Some examples:
The Clean- Boodle X3
Pixies- Come On Pilgrim
Beat Happening- Jamboree
Misfits- Walk Among Us
Replacements- Stink
Circle Jerks- Group Sex

PS- Is there a band out there that has released ONLY EPs and is consistently excellent?

Exactly. 'Cause there simply aren't that many that are flat out great or indispensable. What are we waiting for?! Let's make some EPs!!

EPs = less filler. And how many albums would benefit mightily by cutting 1/3-1/2 the songs?

Another example of an EP comp is Curve's Public Fruit and Donovan's Pye recordings, and also, the Kinks.

Other notable one-offs:

R.E.M. -- Chonic Town
Pavement -- Major Leagues
Alkaline Trio -- For Your Lungs Only
Josh Rouse / Kurt Wagner -- Chester
Will Oldham / Rian Murphy -- All Most Heaven

How about Spilts:

Tortoise / The Ex
Centro-Matic / Vermont
My Morning Jacket / Songs: Ohia

The Angry Samoans! (Even their one "album" was maybe 20 minutes long!)

Best one I can think of in recent times: The John Wilkes Booze

• joan is right. Only the best makes it onto eps. In nz, it was the bands one chance -- no room for excess just to sell albums.


• and these eps were cheaper and thus more impressively worthy of a gamble or maybe some positive discrimination.


• 12" eps were the best fidelity you could get then, counter-balancing the lo-fi diy "chris knox with his 4 track" sound, admittedly sounding good anyway (heavier "rock" bass meant those eps did really rock).


• and the "stones"/chills/verlaines/sneeky fealings double ep delivered lo-fi as "as good a sound as the great Exile on Main Street", and as good a look too btw, by handily taking a swing at the growing (majors) record plant intransigence with regard to allowing the locals to have normal colour 12" sleeves (cf: all the majors regular "stars" with their funky "cover art").

mogwai - ep+2
boards of canada - in a beautiful place out in the country

Jesus, just off the top of my head, let's see: Scratch Acid, Butthole Surfers (their first 2), Flaming Lips (their debut -- considered by me if by nobody else), Meat Puppets (debut "album," not so much In a Car), White Zombie, Mission of Burma (yep), Minor Threat (first THREE EPs - -hey, so they're really another EP only band, right?), Circle Jerks, Anthrax (*I'm the Man,* still not very good). Big Black (Racer X, but the two before were pretty good too), Leather Nun (a couple), the Fiends, Phuture, Green River, Halo of Flies (a few none of which I've heard for years), Laughing Hyenas, the Puddle, Rudimentary Peni (though admittedly I knew them mainly from the *EPs of RP* album), Scientists (Blood Red River), DNA, Teenage Jesus and the Jerks (who had two), maybe Three Johns (I forget how long *Atom Drum Bop* was but I bet under 25 minutes), maybe Nerf Herder (ditto for their first two albums), Vox Pop, probably Pussy Galore (a couple), U2 (*Under a Blood Red Sky* -- also one of the only bands ever whose best record is a live record!), the Specials (*Ghosttown*), Red Cross aka Redd Kross (debut and *Teen Babes from Monsanto*), possibly the Nomads, possibly Young Gods, Pere Fucking Ubu (*Datapanik in Year Zero*).

If I really put some time into this, the list would be a lot longer.

And by the way, with Angry Samoans, one of their two very short "albums" (*Inside My Brain*) was originally an even shorter EP; only seven or so years after its original release were more tracks added.

Well, sure. Some of the ones I mentioned could be considered as such, subjectively speaking.

I also hear some people praise, as an example, Chronic Town as REM's best, which I don't agree with at all, but HEY, whatever floats yr boat!

I personally like the EP format, but then I consider brevity a virtue in general. I've been thinking a lot about it lately because i wanna start putting out records next year and I like the idea of EPs, but it seems like they're unwise in the marketplace, for the reasons mentioned already (usually more expensive per amount of music compared to full-lengths), and because with downloading is rampant enough as it is, I'm sure people would feel even less guilt about DLing instead of buying an EP as they would an album.

plus there's the matter that EPs just typically get less attention and sales, so any song you put on there is effectively somewhat demoted to b-side status, even if it's topshelf material. I have respect for people who do have the balls to put their best shit on EPs - Grand Buffet's last 3 releases have all been EP's, and the format really works for them.

Sidenote: Hey, Al! How's it goin'? Heh heh. Sorry 'bout not answering that ol' H. Lavoe thread a while ago. I kinda forgot about it until recently and I've been too lazy to bother digging it up. I'm sleepy though, so I'll procrastinate one more time for good times' sake. Tomorrow can wait! BTW, what kind of music are you planning on recording? Will you be producing it yrself? Is it gonna be a home-made endeavour?

another thought: I think maybe the bad reputation of the EP owes to the fact that a lot of bands only make them before working up to their first album, and even then end up recycling/re-recording the EPs' better tunes for the LP. granted, EPs are probably a good place for alternate versions and remixes and the like, but still, i think those practices have lowered the stock of the format.

And yes, I agree with ya on the issue of degradation of EPs.

Lilys-Brief History of Amazing Letdowns

µ-ziq & The Auteurs: "µ-ziq Vs. The Auteurs"
Aphex Twin: "Donkey Rhubarb" (if only for the Philip Glass track)
Gorodisch: "Thurn & Taxis"

Cocteau Twins (several - Love's Easy Tears, Sunburst and Snowblind, Aikea Guinea, the two EPs that were released in successive weeks).

Pale Saints, Half-Life.

yeah, here's some more to add to CDs that were made of combined E.P.s:

Cocteau Twins - Tiny Dynamine / Echoes In A Shallow Bay
Birthday Party - Bad Seed / Mutiny
Dif Juz - Vibrating Air

also, back in the terribly exotic 60's - some albums were split into (also released as separate) EPs as extra (pricepoint) option:
for example many of the early Beatles albums were also released as 2 individual EPs
and Magical Mystery Tour was originally a double EP...!
most exciting one is probably the "Long Tall Sally" EP, since although it's mostly covers, these were some of the least otherwise-available/anthologized Beatles releases ever: "I Call Your Name" is the original here and joins many of their b-sides as pleasantly underplayed Beatles tracks - if such a thing is possible today.

60's EPs were mainly 7", while 80's (UK indie stalwart) EPs were mostly 12"...
10" EPs seem less common, but add to the fun of an unsung though varied length-format

so what separates an EP from a mini album?
usually an EP has (bare minimum) 3 or 4 tracks
but once you hit 5 or magic number 6 you're headed for mini album turf

Ice Cube released the "Kill at Will" EP after "AmeriKKKa's Most Wanted". It has remixes of the album tracks and only a few new songs, but these include two of his best, "Dead Homiez" and "The Product".

Aren't there a lot of undie rap EP's? Company Flow, Anti-Pop Consortium etc. It's probably true that mainstream rappers rarely do these, however.

Also, I think the CD age has changed the definition of an EP. Nowadays there can be even 40-minute EP's, whereas in the past that would've been an LP. Nowadays it has more to do how the artist views a certain recording. If I remember correctly, there is even 60-minute Juan Atkins EP...

Hey, get this -- one of them is in this great Texas weird band called Crevice who I've been interviewing over the past week. I don't think the current music would be your thing, Chuck, but you might appreciate their spirit (they recruited a guy who breaks Barry Manilow records so they 'could sound better').

Most popular all-EP band ever: The Honeydrippers, whose *Volume One* went to number 5 on the Billboard album chart in 1984, and then they never released a *Volume Two.* (Rob Sheffield has said that this ALWAYS happens with bands who name records *Volume One*, but even despite similar supergroup the Traveling Wilburies -- who jumped right to *Part Three,* as I recall -- I'm not sure I believe him.)

i loved those immense underworld ep's, but when you hear them now they're sort of repetitive. i think *pearl's girl* is the ne plus ultra of that style, it's 60+ minutes of semi-remixes, semi-new songs that all wind up sounding kind of alike.

autechre had a nice ep-lp-ep pattern going for a while. until they went totally haywire right after *ep7*, which i think is also 60+ minutes and mostly great.

ha ha! i'm still waiting for white (rob) zombie to do *la sexorcista: volume 2.* and if el gran silencio don't do *super riddim internacional vol 2* i'm gonna have some harsh words for them. and cookies.

I secretly love the pearl's girl EP. bought it like 5 years ago and still listen to it constantly - for reasons I can't really pin down.

The Blasters, Over There: Live In London.

The recent Wire EPs were really good, too.

who's done hip hop EPs?

The Pack
Young Berg
Kurtis Blow

ice cube
pete rock & cl smooth

lots and lots of artists

Digital Underground.

who's done hip hop EPs?

Cool Kids (allegedly, though it's actually 10 songs in 33 minutes, which used to be called an "album")

Can anyone name an EP that could be considered a band's best work?

Ugly Kid Joe, As Ugly As They Wanna Be (the first RIAA-certified multiplatinum EP, apparently.)

Can anyone name an EP that could be considered a band's best work?

Badly Drawn Boy. Take your pick: EP1, EP2, EP3, and EP4. All about a billion times better than any of his albums.