the tubs

london band who mix jangle, british folk, and (to my ears) a dash of goth rock, fronted by a singer with a chesty baritone reminiscent of richard thompson. i've been compulsively listening to their debut dead meat (which many are calling the #1 album 2023) since i first heard it back in january. the strength of the songwriting, genuinely beautiful singing, and darkly hilarious yet poignant lyrics keep me coming back again and again. they're former members of joanna gruesome but that's by no means a neccessary or sufficient "riyl" (i haven't cared for any of the other bands in that scene)

https://media.pitchfork.com/photos/63d179aa77b003fc6028ec6b/1:1/w_320,c_limit/The-Tubs-Dead-Meat.jpg

music video for "wretched lie"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zh0P086hPU

"sniveller" - one of my favs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQBEipOR3do

Yeah I really like this record! It did prompt me to listen to some other related bands (I already knew Porridge Radio). I quite like Ex-Void too, but the Tubs are my faves of what I've heard.

def one of my favorite rock albums of the year, and "sniveller" is the one . it was bothering me for a long time about what band they reminded me of, and i've decided that they're a janglier version of the wedding present

*the one that stands out most

definitely one of the best indie rock records of recent years

they just have great tunes, great lyrics, love the sound of this record

I think it sounds quite a lot like Sugar (I also think somebody else might have pointed this out before?)

Anyway, great bunch of lads, glad this is getting attention.

Really enjoyed this album as well, thanks to rolling punk thread I think. The vocals, the songwriting, the performances, glorious frisson. glad to hear they’re good people too :)

Xpost I think I brought up Sugar stuff like "If I can't Change your Mind" which the Tubs remind me of

This is probably my album of the year, thus far. It sounds perfect, it's sadly relatable. It's so good.

I think it sounds quite a lot like Sugar (I also think somebody else might have pointed this out before?)

interesting, 'a good idea' by sugar is one of my fav songs but i would never have thought to compared them to the tubs in a million years

janglier version of the wedding present

this is closer but still not quite it, right?

for a band that has pretty easily identifiable influences, there doesn't seem to be anything else that hits that tubs-ey sweet spot

i feel like in terms of uk jangle the songwriting is top shelf--maybe only a close second to the smiths tbh

count me in: #1 of the year, has been since the first time i heard it, pre-release.

I'll throw The Bats in (tho in general their jangle reminds me more of semi-recent Aus stuff than Flying Nun).

singer reminds me of the lad from the Stars of Heaven

probably depends how you define "janglier" but struggling to see how it's possible to be janglier than the Wedding Present

I have to say he sings like Richard Thompson to the point where I’d say it sounds like an impression, not an inspiration.

according to this interview it's neither an impression nor (conscious) inspiration

So far, the Tubs’ most frequent comparison is Richard Thompson, because of Williams’ resonant “chest voice.” Although Thompson wasn’t a conscious influence, Williams grew up around folk music, as his mother was a folk singer and his parents hosted folk and country shows in Cardiff for musicians like Alasdair Roberts and Victoria Williams.

“I thought [folk] was kind of uncool, but I think I’ve bounced back into appreciating that stuff — and it’s definitely informed the way I sing and use trills,” Williams says. “I didn’t realize until every review came out that I sound a lot like Richard Thompson, but it’s not a bad thing cause I stan Richard Thompson.”

https://www.spin.com/2023/03/the-tubs-dead-meat-interview/

owen williams strong wkiw energy from interviews... love him

“I think you can only access moments of earnestness or sentiment if they’re in the context of humor or facetiousness or pettiness, and I think that tends to be more true to life and my feelings,” Williams says of his lyricism. “And I like inserting gross details about my life and my mental health.”

Williams describes his experience with OCD as a complicated one—sometimes it gives him manic energy that’s helpful for creativity, and sometimes he’ll spend weeks convinced that he’s going to die of cancer.

“People who have OCD, there’s a real clownish element to it, because you’re essentially making the same mistake over and over and being ridiculous in kind of a comical way,” Williams says of his obsessions. “I think that gives you a lot of good material to work with, because you’re suffering profoundly, but it’s actually quite funny. You’re like fucking Mr. Bean or something … I do think that trope of the suffering artist is bullshit, but at the same time, it gives you stuff to write about.”

“There’s an implication that we’re crazy record collector nerds who’ve said ‘We’re going to combine Felt and glam rock and whatever,’” Williams says. “It just all comes out, and we don’t really talk or think about it. I don’t even buy records. I don’t have enough money. We just download things.”

The album is only 26 minutes longs, but for some reason they decided to leave (potential highlight) The Name Song off of it?

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2023/nov/07/gob-nation-music-collective-tubs-suep-ex-void-sniffany-nits-interview?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

Awww lil Max looks so angelic in that photo <3

It is all a bit weird, though, reminds me of that time The Wire did a thing on Brighton poets and I'm sat there like "that's just a load of guys I get drunk with".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FrfC6ka6Qg

The band I immediately thought of was the Roves, another jangle pop band from London who’ve been around a few years but have never managed to catch any buzz, AFAIK.

I love their song "She's a Bauty"

every person i've told to listen to this record loved it

"illusion pt ii" is so great

over and over with it goes
it never ends <3

Looking at the first year-end lists seems to show this band is like every other band on Trouble in Mind, in that they still haven't penetrated rock critics' general consciousness; more proof it's all just based on publicists and promo budgets.

yeah it's a bummer

two other of the best rock records of the year - Sunwatchers' "Music is Victory Over Time" and Melenas' "Ahora" are on Trouble in Mind too, possibly more than I haven't heard. it's def my #1 rock label right now

The En Attendant Ana album is really good too.

i'll check that out thanks for the recommendation

this feels like a boring pick for favorite album of 2023 but it's probably my favorite album of 2023

Trouble in Mind is the best label going. Has been for years, imo - I say that not to say "catch up, dorks" but just to highlight how great it has been and that it's worth digging in to the catalog. so many great bands and great records: FACS, Mountain Movers/Headroom, Omni, Writhing Squares, Salad Boys, Ultimate Painting, Doug Tuttle and on and on and on.

Also, the new Melenas album is such a rad move for them.

TiM is great - run by very nice people too. Bill and Lisa were in Cococoma (really fun garage rock) and Marble Vanity.

I say that not to say "catch up, dorks"

i saw david nance group like 5 years ago playing to like 40 people!!

right! you're not one of the dorks i'm *not* talking to.

haha i know i'm just goofing *feverishly digs though box of indie cred looking for 90 day men ticket stub*

mountain movers are cool but haven't heard some of the stuff you listed. it's remarkable i don't think i've ever heard anything i didn't like from this label.

Killer label. I love that Headroom shit so much. Onyon also very good (along with lots of stuff over the years).

gradavis - Headroom was Alexander's rock band right?

Wonder if the Tubs record will suffer on year end lists due to coming out early in the year. I mean it got a lot of run in the small circles that care about this stuff, but the fact that it came out in January probably plays into it somewhat. Seems like forever ago to me too.

Yeah, Alexander / David Shapiro is in Headroom, as are a number of the New Haven folks. Kryssi Battalene, the lead guitarist in Mountain Movers, is the driving force for it.

This is good stuff. Beyond the jangle element I hear some echoes of the much-missed Royal Headache in the more soulful numbers.

Wonder if the Tubs record will suffer on year end lists due to coming out early in the year

i think it’s more likely the tubs record will suffer from year end lists sucking and being full of terrible music

exactly. i think the January release will hurt it a bit, but the bigger issue (imo) is simply that more and more lists are being generated by younger people who have little to no interest in guitar bands.

i know that sounds very "get off my lawn" but the biggest list-making operation i'm involved in is overseen by a twentysomething who eats up every new goober who comes along with 10 songs of limp, lame bedroom-recorded synth-pop/R&B.

salad boys are really great, going to listen to those other bands you mentioned

Really enjoy Smoke Bellow as a band too.

The Dummy record from last year (I think) was very nice, too. En Attendant Ana is probably my fave pure indie record of 2023. For some reason, the Tubs haven't quite gotten me yet, even though it seems squarely aimed in my direction. I'll give it another go.

That Dummy record is probably my favorite indie rock record of the past few years. I’ll check out your other recommendation.

Oh wait I was thinking of Dumb. Sorry brain fart. I’ll check them both out!

digging En Attendant Ana, great songs and vibe, though I still don't understand the vogue for clicky thin drum sounds among new indie bands

Cosigning the Trouble In Mind / En Attendant Ana appreciation - nice to have a US label releasing NZ stuff like Salad Boys and Guardian Singles.

totally — and aussie stuff, too! this one was killer: https://partnerlook.bandcamp.com/album/by-the-book

salad boys SO great (but i need to dig into some of the rest mentioned tbh)

Yeah every year I'm tempted to subscribe: https://troubleinmindrecords.bandcamp.com/subscribe

Maybe this will be the year.

Year-End Lists that include the Tubs:

Aquarium Drunkard (unranked)
Raven Sings the Blues (unranked)
#8 The Observer: Kitty Empire
#11 Fast 'n' Bulbous
#18 Steroegum
#40 Mojo
#59 Piccadilly Records

Vaguely along the lines of the Tubs, nearly everyone slept on this one last year. Jangle/post-punk, but more of a gothy Chameleons vibe:

Thus Love – Memorial (Captured Tracks, 2022)

https://thuslove.bandcamp.com/album/memorial

With the Tubs record in 2023 and my favorite the Ex-Void in 2022, Owen Williams is on a crazy songwriting hot streak.

Fans of The Tubs will love Bigger Than Before, the Ex-Void record.

Every time I see this thread I want to post about how much I love The Tubs’ “Whit Punks on Dop” and I’ve refrained. But now I see that eephus already made a similar joke. Sorry, carry on…

I think I like that Ex-Void album more than the tubs record.

boy/girl harmony vocals ftw.

Wasn’t aware Williams had recorded ‘Wretched Lie’ previously as Cotton Crown, drum machine gives it a Sisters of Mercy vibe.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_60qXXhbL6Q

I paid too much to ship that cassette to my home specifically because I loved that song so much ... pre-Tubs album.

There was a B-side, too: https://gobnation.bandcamp.com/track/crystal-ball

whoa, love this version

Yeah, that is the superior version. Would love to hear a full album of this gothy solo project.

Yeah Tubs are so good but unfortunately every re-recorded song on their album (Wretched Lie, I Don't Know How It Works, Two Person Love) are all inferior to the original. That Tubs 7" is so good and much better than the album I think. Also Illusion Part Two is nowhere near as good as the Illusion on the 7".

It's already over for them!

Not really. But it was disappointing.

idk, as a whole i really like the muscularity of the album, it's urgent and propulsive with the hooks a bit buried in the momentum of the band in a way i find addictive. i think that's the specific aspect of them that most reminds me of early REM. just wretched lie in particular sounds great a little more fragile and gothic

yeah agreed, I like the album version more. I think I've had my fill of nu post punk/goth

I think the album is muscular and propulsive and is even more so on the seven inches. Same songs but played and recorded better.

Dude can obviously write a shit ton of great songs. Why recycle four out of nine songs on the album?

Btw the label that put out the seven inches, Prefect, is so good. I believe Owen Williams was involved with the label at the start but no longer is. Started kind of as a Joanna Gruesome offshoot label with Tubs, Ex-Void and GN. Now there’s other stuff on there. Eggs in particular are really great. Laughing Chimes.

this compilation from last year on Prefect is so good ... so much more consistent than most comps like this, which is maybe no surprise given that it includes a bunch of what i would consider the best jangle-pop bands going right now (Reds/Pinks/Purples, Mt. Misery, Telephone Numbers, Massage):

https://prefectrecords.bandcamp.com/album/14

9 copies left! Friday is Bandcamp Friday :)

for anyone in the US, Jigsaw Records has that, and the new follow-up comp, Two Two Seven, along with the Tubs EP (since shipping from the UK is so steep)

Red/Pinks/Purples are playing a club near my house soon, need to get tix

love the Reds Pinks and Purps, such a consistently good band, would love to catch them someday

Yeah Tubs are so good but unfortunately every re-recorded song on their album (Wretched Lie, I Don't Know How It Works, Two Person Love) are all inferior to the original. That Tubs 7" is so good and much better than the album I think. Also Illusion Part Two is nowhere near as good as the Illusion on the 7".

album versions are all massive steps up from the 7"

xpost Jon you check out Painted Shrines? great album, I think they are related

I had no idea there was a follow-up comp to 14! Thanks for mentioning, bulb.

Jigsaw's physical HQ doubles as a record store, My Vinyl Underground, in Portland. It's small, but probably my favorite record store in the world. Or maybe it's more accurate to say it's my favorite small record store in the world.

also, Mt. Misery is so good. true heirs to the Teenage Fanclub throne.

xpost Jon you check out Painted Shrines? great album, I think they are related

that's the one where it's him from R/P/Ps and the guy from Woods, right? I remember reading about it at one point, but never checked it out, need to add that to my list

The Tubs Arguments of 2024. May we look back on them fondly in the future.

Is there a rolling janglepop thread?

should we start one? there's a lot of good bands doing this right now!

yeah or could we have a mod add on (and rolling nu-jangle rock) just so we don't lose old conversations?

xpost - yep just looked it up it is Glen Donaldson and the Woods guy

as thread OP (if that gives me any privileges) i would vote to keep this as a single-purpose dedicated tubs thread (side projects ok) rather than rename it jangle pop. as an expression of my devotion