Debut albums

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I'm transcribing a Gregg Allman interview today, and he said this, which really struck me: "On first records you get a glimpse into people's weaknesses." I guess he means that the process hasn't been streamlined, that artists are still searching for their voices, that the record labels make minimal investments into the recording process. For him this is undoubtedly a good thing (he prefaced this by saying that debut albums are always the best, then cites Elton John and Jackson Browne as examples), and I think that I agree. Any thoughts on this? Care to give some examples and what weaknesses they reveal?

― Yanc3y (ystrickler), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 18:25 (twenty-three years ago)

Pretenders I
Joe Jackson - Look Sharp!
The Cars

..weaknesses? I can't think of any.. See later records for weaknesses.

― dave225 (Dave225), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 18:29 (twenty-three years ago)

Ummm... Thanks for naming some albums, Dave.

― Yanc3y (ystrickler), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 18:33 (twenty-three years ago)

There's something about his comment that made me think of Music From Big Pink, but I'm having trouble getting my jumble of thoughts about it into something coherent. Some fractured thoughts: It's certainly their strongest (although the self-titled disc comes close) and the album where the every-man-for-himself-all-at-once approach works best (primarily: "I Shall Be Released," "Tears of Rage" and "The Weight"), but it's also easy to see why this would be doomed from the start (Robbie Robertson, egos, Robbie Robertson's ego). There's also this whole issue of striving for simultaneous anonymity and transcendence -- the gimmick of not knowing who's who, etc., along with the hype of being Bob Dylan's band. The nature of the press dictates that there must be a star, and Robbie was the first to grasp that and the one to truly take advantage (all the while pushing the Band's two real geniuses -- Danko and Helm -- back into the shadows). It's like the Band's modes of success and failure were one and the same, and in retrospect it seems obvious that this would soon crumble. All of which makes it an even more interesting document, I think...

― Yanc3y (ystrickler), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 18:44 (twenty-three years ago)

The fourth album is the best one.

― Adam A. (Keiko), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 20:04 (twenty-three years ago)

...for everyone! assuming they make it to four albums that is (nb I am just kidding)

― M Matos (M Matos), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 20:19 (twenty-three years ago)

Apparently on the back cover of 'Too Fast for Love' the 'big hair' was photographically superimposed on them afterwards

― dave q, Tuesday, 18 February 2003 22:08 (twenty-three years ago)

very often 1st albums are the best. especially for bands who don't evolve too much. good examples are the tindersticks, belle and sebastian and roxy music. everything which made those bands great was there already in their first albums. the roxy's first is so full of ideas, so unfocussed. it's my favourite of theirs.

― alex in mainhattan (alex63), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 22:14 (twenty-three years ago)

A less-known choice that also comes to mind: Calla's first. I consider it their best, partially because you can hear an internal debate in the band between going rock or glitchy electronic. There's an ongoing negotiation between the guitars and the beats (often programmed, sometimes drummed) that only gets resolved in the subsequent releases (they lean toward the rock side, although the amazingly great remix album puts another chink in the armor). And with Calla, I think the debate is idealogical as well as musical: they had just moved to NYC from Texas, and I think there was an equal urge to reflect the mood of their former haunt and their new one. Their music is very geographic in that sense -- buildings and fields collapsing on each other, ending up with something like tumbleweeds in Times Square (tumbleweeds would also describe the reaction to the album). Too bad it's now out of print.

― Yanc3y (ystrickler), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 22:23 (twenty-three years ago)

My Aim Is True reveals Elvis Costello's soon-to-be-tackled weakness: Clover.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 22:26 (twenty-three years ago)

good point alex. i guess that means that not evolving equals continuous exposure of weaknesses. this then means that later albums can only be "less" (sorry, it's late and i'm struggling to find words/expressions in a non-native language), compared to debuts. so the gregg allman comment only applies to bands that hit the creative jackpot first time round, not to bands that go through an extended period of searching for an ulimate "form"/style before they make their best album. this may apply to, and this just pops up now, radiohead for instance. and then there's artists that keep evolving, going from one (crystalised) from/point to another. (bowie, i think)

― willem (willem), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 22:34 (twenty-three years ago)

from/point should read form/point...

v. interesting arguments on Calla (wonderful debut!!), yanc3y. have u ever interviewed them about the influence of a geographical context on their music? (because it looks like your pretty well-informed...)

― willem (willem), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 22:37 (twenty-three years ago)

Yeah, I've talked to them about it. They said it wasn't conscious, but when I mentioned it, they agreed that it was there. And it still is, as Televise shows.

― Yanc3y (ystrickler), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 22:39 (twenty-three years ago)

this may apply to, and this just pops up now, radiohead for instance.

Whose fourth album is their best!!

― Adam A. (Keiko), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 22:48 (twenty-three years ago)

And it still is, as Televise shows.
yep, but my "geographical" thoughts on that album are that they have to move again... (it's not bad, has some good moments, but a bit meh overall)

― willem (willem), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 23:04 (twenty-three years ago)

Well, shit, Moby Grape's first album is the best first album ever. Because they could never top it. Also, it wasn't perfectly produced. So, imperfectly rendered great ideas. And, no one "style" took precedence. Too many cooks.

As far as classic rock albums that classic rock fans don't even know about, it's the best too. "Hey Grandma" puts down chicks in granny dresses...so, very modern in that sense, I don't see scenester girls wearing anything too flattering these days, do you?

But, Big Star's "#1 Record" even more interesting, as a great debut whose (relative) excesses would be pared away on an even better second album, which was totally flawless...

― frank p. jones (frank p. jones), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 02:34 (twenty-three years ago)

Hearing bands' weaknesses on their debut album?

Talking Heads' 77. I think David Byrne actually hits a real note like 3 times on that album.

(...I must point out, though, it's one of my favorite albums, and I'm in no way knocking it. I am a particular fan of how one can hear the group grow and improve drastically over their recording career...DB's voice in particular.)

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:24 (twenty-three years ago)

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