Pole/~Scape records-dub pioneers-or-?

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What are your thoughts re Pole? I really like some of his work...other stuff just seems messy, no melody, inacessible noise. What are your thoughts?

turner, Tuesday, 31 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

got Pole 2, can't really get into it (also trying still with Luomo and Maurizio as well). for all my talk of liking abstraction and music with spaces in it, i'm finding this stuff a bit of a challenge. i haven't heard the other pole records (actually bought Pole2 by mistake, was supposed to be buying a Burger Ink record)

gareth, Tuesday, 31 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Pole2 is the weakest of the three releases, and funnily enough it's always the one I see for cheaper. Pole3 is best b/c most dublike. Actually that's a good rule of thumb for all this minimal tech-dub stuff: the more dub, the better. I haven't heard much of the other Scope work bar Kit Clayton, who on cursory listen is similar to Pole at his best. A quick squiz of Pole's Scape Mix cd just released sounded interesting too - heavy on the jazz influence that some of the newer signings apparently bring to the fore (I wouldn't know).

How Gareth could be unhappy with either Maurizio or Luomo is beyond me, as both are utterly brilliant. I bought Jamie Liddell's "Muddlin Gear" on a discount whim today... now that's an album that's hard to get into. I'm not sure if I ever will.

Tim, Tuesday, 31 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Ah yes Pole, predictably I love it. I have Pole 1 and 3. Both very good and quite different albums. 1 = bit darker, 3 = bit dubbier. Nice interpretation of the Basic Channel template. It's big city music innit?

Omar, Tuesday, 31 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

saw him in rome last year he was completely drunk and not abe to give a good performance just wishy washy dubby techno

francesco, Tuesday, 31 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

This reminds me that I do need to get on the ball and pick up the third Pole record. So far, ~scape is batting 1.000 with me. The two label comps are great, as is the Jan Jelinek record. That said, I doubt the label will ever be on the level of the aforementioned releases of Burger/Ink, Luomo, Maurizio, or the Basic Channel label. Not exactly a knock from where I'm standing.

Andy, Tuesday, 31 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Concur w/ Tim, Pole 2 is the weakest, Pole 3 is the best, for the reasons he mentioned. Pole 1 is very different than the other two, though, fewers beats, more meandering structure & more abstract ambient than dub. I also like the Pole vs. Four Tet EP a lot -- one original each & one remix. It's an odd combination, those two, but two of the four tunes are exceptional.

The first ~scape compilation is very good. My favorite ~scape artist by a long shot right now is Jan Jelinek, whom you should consider if you like Pole. Similar in some ways, but with a warmer, more inviting sound. Like Omar says above, Pole is big city music, but Jan Jelinek reminds me more of sunlight in the countryside. With static crackles and deep bass.

Mark, Tuesday, 31 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Gonna disagree with the consensus here and say that I like Pole 2 the best - first one a bit too abstract, third one a bit too much like a 'straight' dub alb, the second one the best balance of dub and glitch. But do wonder where Pole will go from here. The Maurizio 'tin' one of all the all-time great single artist comps - but haven't heard any new Maurizio for ages (full-time moguls these days?) Anybody know what the 'Rhythm + Sound' alb is like?

Also want to put in a good word for the two 'Macro Dub Infection' collections that Kevin Martin compiled for Virgin, and esp. the early Porter Ricks tracks gathered together on 'Biokinetics' - 'aquatic dub' at its finest.

Andrew L, Tuesday, 31 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

The Rhythm and Sound disc is quite great -- kind of a midpoint between Maurizio and Basic Channel but rather sedate and straightahead dub that still sounds like an Von Oswald production. Tikiman's vocals are complementary, spooky and minimal.

Like everything released thus far on Kompakt, each of those Chain Reaction/Basic Channel tins are priceless. Biokinetics is one of my all-time electronic faves, right up there with E2-E4. Too bad Andy Mellwig's Continuous Mode record is so bland (kinda like later Porter Ricks, no?). That's been the year's biggest disappointment for me.

Andy, Tuesday, 31 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Rhythm + Sound = allright, but not really as great as Maurizio/Basic Channel IMHO. The vocal tracks are ace, but I was a bit dissapointed by the versions, they're just straight instrumental versions without any dub-fuckery, a bit of echo wouldn't have hurt a bit. My other favourite 'tin' is by Various Artists...it's just so hazy. :)

Omar, Tuesday, 31 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Pole 2 is the bestest of the three, for reasons already mentioned.

It's also the cheapest of the three cuz it's a CDEP/double 12".

Vic Funk, Tuesday, 31 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

i think that's an accurate perception. i really liked the first cd, especially the first track (can't recall the title) which is just like a dark night, moon shining on snowbanks. beautiful. some really excellent stuff on there, not as much of an obsession with everything sounding like dub-as-heard-by-the-echo-box. the first pole 12" on din, i think, is pretty nice too. works at 33 or 45.

never bought the 3rd cd, i was already sick of the yellow 12" so i didn't bother; plus the fact that the 'clicks and cuts' (ugh) thing was becoming somehow codified, rigid and very formulaic. see also chain reaction, who started plunging downhill (excepting vladislav delay) when the '2nd phase' of the label started (fluxion, etc). waah.

your null fame, Wednesday, 1 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I like the Pole/Oval stuff and a lot of the Clicks and Cuts Stuff. Is the Fluxion stuff really that bad?....was thinking of investigating the Chain Reaction stuff....really looking for stuff along the lines of Plastikmans' Consumed LP....any suggestions?

David, Friday, 10 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Fluxion isn't really bad, it just isn't that spectacular. Still pretty good minimal techno record with a summer feel (sort of reminds me of surf, beaches, waves, etc).

Recommendations?

My favourite is the album by Various Artists. Should also be the one that comes in the neighborhood of Consumed (I think).

'Hong Kong' by Monolake is very good. As is the Portis Ricks CD on Chain Reaction (also with some Consumed-like tracks).

Omar, Monday, 13 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Is the Porter Ricks CD called Biokinetics and are the chain reaction cds those metal tins that are really hard to get the cds out of?.....anyone here have any thoughts on Oval...I quite like his new harsher sound, what do you think his next step should be...and thanks for the recomendations....

David, Monday, 13 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Yeah, Biokinetics. And yeah those bloody metal tins, I recommend not clicking yr CD's back in, almost ruined my Porter Ricks album.

re: Oval. I only have Systemisch, which nowadays doesn;t sound that radical, even sounds pretty these days. Haven't heard their new stuff though, could not finish that David Toop article in The Wire a couple of months ago with Oval et al. Just could not be bothered.

Omar, Monday, 13 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

New Oval alb ('Commers') is superb, logical culmination of that 'harsher' sound, even though I sort of miss the 'stuck CD' vibe of 'Diskont' etc. Some of the tracks on 'Commers' really remind me of 'Metal Machine Music'. Would be interested to know just how much of the music is software 'process' and how much of it is Markus Popp - could we all make music that sounds like Oval if we had Popp's program, or is there a great deal of editing etc. involved? Recent Microstoria alb also terrific - mining the same guitar sound/electronic treatment area as Fennesz w/ v. different results.

Andrew L, Monday, 13 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I always group Oval in with Autechre - they did all the back breaking work in pushing this sort of music forward, but they never stick around to make it, um, enjoyable. Inventive? Yes. Intriguing? Certainly. Strangely evocative? Quite often. But enjoyable? Rarely.

Tim, Monday, 13 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Thanks for all the help...managed to pick up a few basic channel 12" and I dig 'em.

David, Sunday, 19 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Not enjoyable? Hmph. Sez you, Tim.

Josh, Sunday, 19 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I do like Autechre, Josh. I just don't think they're enjoyable. Maybe "pleasurable" is more accurate.

Tim, Monday, 20 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

three weeks pass...
Beige is the best ~scape artist to me so far. cool yall!

Dallas, Sunday, 16 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

four years pass...
~scape is putting out dance music now! real actual danceable dance music!

...


sellouts

ferzaffe (flezaffe), Monday, 17 July 2006 22:20 (seventeen years ago) link

i don't like the sound of those much tbh. i like pole1 most. pole2 is very good but only if you listen to it at 33 rather than 45.

jed_ (jed), Monday, 17 July 2006 22:36 (seventeen years ago) link

seven months pass...
dunno if I could eat a whole one but new Pole album Steingarten sounding oddly colourful and bouncy (for Pole) almost Mouse On Mars-ish (but nowhere near as frantic or unpredictable)

fandango, Saturday, 10 March 2007 02:41 (seventeen years ago) link

two months pass...
What is it with nü-ILM, with every new release being ignored? So did anyone get 'Steingarten'? I was tempted just for the cover alone, but an in-store spin left me a bit cold. I have a feeling it could be a grower. Thoughts?

baaderonixx, Wednesday, 16 May 2007 12:34 (sixteen years ago) link

I guess his previous album left many fans disillusioned. Did the new one sound different from it? Actually I thought Pole was a bit of grower too - the rapping was admittedly lame, but other than that it had some nice moments.

Tuomas, Wednesday, 16 May 2007 12:45 (sixteen years ago) link

no rapping on the last one.

baaderonixx, Wednesday, 16 May 2007 12:56 (sixteen years ago) link

i love Steingarten.
no idea how it compares to the one with rapping on it, but the new one is brilliantly deep and beautiful.
ta for the nudge - off to dig this out now as well as use the cover as desktop (high quality image came as a nice extra on the promo copy - along with all sorts of extras)

mark e, Wednesday, 16 May 2007 13:32 (sixteen years ago) link

YSI the jpg?

baaderonixx, Wednesday, 16 May 2007 13:53 (sixteen years ago) link

since i posted this i have come to find out that i've bloody lost the fragger. will dig out the cd and sort you out.

mark e, Wednesday, 16 May 2007 13:56 (sixteen years ago) link

I guess I'll have to give this a listen then.

Tuomas, Wednesday, 16 May 2007 13:59 (sixteen years ago) link

as promised

[url=[Removed Illegal Link] Cover for Steingarten [url]

3Mb JPG file.

mark e, Thursday, 17 May 2007 08:48 (sixteen years ago) link

sigh.

Cover for Steingarten

mark e, Thursday, 17 May 2007 08:49 (sixteen years ago) link

The image “http://www.ireallylovemusic.co.uk/art/pole_coverart.jpg” cannot be displayed, because it contains errors.

am0n, Thursday, 17 May 2007 13:38 (sixteen years ago) link

!??! weird .. off to upload again ..

mark e, Thursday, 17 May 2007 13:44 (sixteen years ago) link

ok checked, very strange as i get the same error if i click the above link, but, if i right-mouse click, save the image locally - then that opens fine. sorry but i have no idea as to the reason.
save it locally, and then sit back admire the sheer beauty.

mark e, Thursday, 17 May 2007 13:48 (sixteen years ago) link

Mark R - the image I stored above is a 3Mb high quality image, so perfect for desktops as per request earlier.
i didn't want to add it to the thread as an image as it would probably blow the thread out of sync.

mark e, Thursday, 17 May 2007 13:57 (sixteen years ago) link

i love Steingarten (as i said in my p4k review) -- have been really rather disappointed at the absolute lack of attention paid to it. it's miles better than the last, no comparison, really. a lot of people have complained that it's too dry or arid, but i think once you dig into it, it's shockingly fertile... like tiny little wildflowers shooting up from cracks in the pavement. lovely record.

pshrbrn, Thursday, 17 May 2007 19:06 (sixteen years ago) link

this record sucks.

Display Name, Thursday, 17 May 2007 20:05 (sixteen years ago) link

I shouldn't be so curt about this record. I gave it a listen in the shop and the thing that immediately struck me about this record is that the pressing sounded awful. In 2007, you can massage computer audio and make it sound pretty decent, especially when you have access to the mastering facilities that Stephan Betke has. It sounded very harsh and angular.

The other thing is that it just kind of seemed like a relic of the past. The grooves on the record seemed a bit forced. Perhaps I would find myself enjoying this record if I were to give it more play but I am just not interested in this sort of record right now. I bet it is nice if you put it on in the background and kind of ignore it.

The cover is breathtaking. The artwork is probably 75% of the reason I walked across the store and pulled it from the wall rack.

Display Name, Friday, 18 May 2007 00:57 (sixteen years ago) link

i drove home with this playing yesterday.
it's a nearly new car, and the stereo system a lot better than i have ever had before, and so to have this big fat digital dubby bass sound bouncing all over the place was just wonderful, which made me appreciate the music all the more.
maybe the vinyl is different sounding to the cd - as i think the production is just hugely impressive, but then again, that could have just been the improved listening environment.

mark e, Friday, 18 May 2007 09:37 (sixteen years ago) link

two months pass...

I finally got this last week, and it is pretty good. At first I was kinda distracted by all the distorted synth sounds, because they reminded me of rock guitar, which I hate. But after a few listens they did begin to build up a to an interesting and consistent soundworld. I think this is much better attempt than the previous album to create a fuller yet unpredictable Pole sound. It does sound kinda cold and detached, but I think that's the point. Despite a few recognizable Pole trademarks the sound is very different from the minimal but warm sound he became famous for. The arrangements are kinda similar to Mouse on Mars, yes, but the emotional content ia quite different. I think Steingarten sounds (like the title suggests) sharp and chilly, even cruel at points.

Tuomas, Friday, 20 July 2007 08:37 (sixteen years ago) link

This reminds a bit of the first Kit Clayton album ~Scape put out ("Nek Sanalet" or whatever it's called); the sound is quite different, but they seem to be aiming for similar emotional effect.

Tuomas, Friday, 20 July 2007 08:44 (sixteen years ago) link

I've been wondering about the cover art... Obviously I thought it was painted at first, but the sleeve does say "photography by...". Could it be real? Even if it is, it must be Photoshopped like hell.

The press pics that are on the disc are great too. Dude looks way different than I thought he would.

Tuomas, Friday, 20 July 2007 12:19 (sixteen years ago) link

its real - coworker found photos of the 'original' - and to be honest - its not that much photoshopped !
unfortunately - can't find the pictures now ..

mark e, Friday, 20 July 2007 12:24 (sixteen years ago) link

It is real!

http://www.neuschwanstein.com/

(x-post)

Tuomas, Friday, 20 July 2007 12:25 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.econ.armstrong.edu/cra/neuschwanstein_01_370.jpg

xpost - beat me to it !

mark e, Friday, 20 July 2007 12:27 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.new7wonders.com/downloads/GERMANY/Neuschwanstein.jpg

Though judging by this pic there has been quite a bit of photoshopping done for the cover.

Tuomas, Friday, 20 July 2007 12:27 (sixteen years ago) link

six months pass...

I noticed that ~scape has released remix album of Steingarten. I'm tempted to buy it, but I don't know that much about the remixers. Has anyone heard this, is it good?

Tuomas, Sunday, 20 January 2008 13:34 (sixteen years ago) link

I'm a bit disappointed there's no Burnt Friedman remix on this. His remixes of Pole tunes on R were superb.

Tuomas, Sunday, 20 January 2008 13:36 (sixteen years ago) link

yeah, it's very good - all solid at least, some great - mr sherburne has a positive remix in a new wire, i think

lucas pine, Sunday, 20 January 2008 23:24 (sixteen years ago) link

uh, review*

lucas pine, Sunday, 20 January 2008 23:25 (sixteen years ago) link

one year passes...

It recently dawned on me just how many times I have listened to 'Loop-Finding-Jazz-Records'. And with the exception of Pole 1/2/3 and the Staedtizism comps I hardly own anything else on ~Scape.

So POX ~Scape Records anyone? I'd really welcome any recommendations you might have.

Oh, also, some of you might be interested in the Boomkat 14tracks.com compilation of Jelinek productions: http://tinyurl.com/krksnf

Barnaby, Hardly, Tuesday, 28 July 2009 14:35 (fourteen years ago) link

I've never actually listened to this guys records, but I had the pleasure of hearing Pole on the Fabric Room 1 system earlier in the year, and it was one of the most sublime live shows I've ever heard.

Chewshabadoo, Tuesday, 28 July 2009 14:58 (fourteen years ago) link

five years pass...

Hey, new Pole album due later in the year, here's some clips from same

https://soundcloud.com/pole-original

Ned Raggett, Monday, 20 July 2015 18:20 (eight years ago) link

two months pass...

The album is out, anyone heard it yet? I didn't know about this new material until someone mentioned it in the other thread, so I'm still waiting for my copy to arrive in the mail. IMO Steingarten was nice return to form after the (fairly bland) hip-hop experiments etc, so my hopes for this one are high. (Or at least higher than they were for Steingarten, which was surprisingly good.)

Tuomas, Sunday, 27 September 2015 17:18 (eight years ago) link

it covers some of the Waldgeschichten material (series of brief eps from late 2000s/2010s).. same sound, though there are several new tracks and it plays as a 'live' set, with tracks transitioning into one another. the production (sound) is brilliant, really clean, upfront, and dry/crisp. the subtle percussive, buzzing, clicking elements are really distinct (not so subtle), and the melodic elements are strong. it's beautiful stuff.

braunld (Lowell N. Behold'n), Sunday, 27 September 2015 17:47 (eight years ago) link

ha i was just the other day wondering when/if he would put another album out. interested to hear this, The Waldgeschichten stuff I heard was very nice. enjoyed Steingarten quite a bit, never heard the hip-hop stuff because it seemed to have gotten unanimously negative reviews..

brimstead, Monday, 28 September 2015 23:36 (eight years ago) link

four years pass...

The new Evan Caminiti record is pushing some ~Scape buttons for me: https://dust-editions.bandcamp.com/album/varispeed-hydra

Barnaby, Hardly, Friday, 3 April 2020 08:38 (four years ago) link

eight months pass...

I'm liking Fading based on some Bandcamp previewing.

https://pole-stefanbetke.bandcamp.com/album/fading

lukas, Tuesday, 8 December 2020 19:57 (three years ago) link

i'm going to skip this one because senile dementia w memory loss runs in my family 😢

the late great, Tuesday, 8 December 2020 20:39 (three years ago) link

i did dig out steingarten remixed a few weeks ago and i really enjoyed it! i can't find my copy of steingarten but i think that's probably my current favorite betke production

the late great, Tuesday, 8 December 2020 20:56 (three years ago) link


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