Nick Cave's "Into Your Arms" vs. Billy Joel's "Just the Way You Are"

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Which is worse?

"Into Your Arms" begins with what may be the worst lyrics Nick Cave has ever written:

"I don't believe in an interventionist God
But I know, darling, that you do
But if I did I would kneel down and ask Him
Not to intervene when it came to you
Not to touch a hair on your head
To leave you as you are . . ." etc.

And "Just the Way You Are" is, well, Billy Joel. In the end, I think they are basically the same song, but I give the nod to "Into Your Arms" (as the worse song), which is the more overwrought and earnest of the two.

― Salmon Pink (Salmon Pink), Monday, 22 December 2003 15:29 (twenty-two years ago)

I actually like that 'interventionist God' lyric, if only because I'm still surprised he even tried to do that.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 22 December 2003 15:33 (twenty-two years ago)

Did I say "overwrought" when I really meant "overreaching"? I just find it clumsy and un-musical. He must really like it though, as he insists on doing the song in concert. And, given the very small sample of women I've polled, "the chicks dig it."

― Salmon Pink (Salmon Pink), Monday, 22 December 2003 15:40 (twenty-two years ago)

I really like that part. It's the kind of song I should hate, but... Somehow, the fact that he sang it at Michael Hutchence's funeral makes it even stronger (ie. hearing it as an elegy)

― Baaderist (Fabfunk), Monday, 22 December 2003 15:44 (twenty-two years ago)

I think that those lines from 'Into My Arms' are a little tongue-in-cheek; I think that Cave is just amused by the conceit behind it.

― NickB (NickB), Monday, 22 December 2003 15:52 (twenty-two years ago)

I would like to believe that, but I'm not sure I do.

― Salmon Pink (Salmon Pink), Monday, 22 December 2003 15:53 (twenty-two years ago)

In a massive x-post stylee, surely these are the worst lyrics Nick Cave has ever written?

Let me say this to you
I'll be steadfast and true
And my love will never falter

The sea would crash about us
The waves would lash about us
I'll be your Rock of Gibraltar

Sometimes it's hard
And we're both caught off guard
But there's nothing I would ever alter

The wind could howl round our ears
For the next thousand years
I'd still be your Rock of Gibraltar

The best thing I done
Was to make you the one
Who I'd walk with down to the altar

You'd stand by me
And together we'd be
That great, steady Rock of Gibraltar

Under the big yellow moon
On our honeymoon
I took you on a trip to Malta

And all through the night
You held me so tight
Your great, steady Rock of Gibraltar

Could the powers that be
Ever foresee
That things could so utterly alter?

All the plans that we laid
Could soon be betrayed
Betrayed like the Rock of Gibraltar

The 'Malta' verse is just painful...

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Monday, 22 December 2003 16:18 (twenty-two years ago)

He's been doing that one live too, with a very self-deprecating intro spiel about how he managed to knock it off in 5 minutes flat just for a laugh, and how he knows everyone hates it. I think it just amused him. Then he went and released it as a single.

So I guess that maybe he isn't necessarily 100% sincere about Into My Arms either... but he COULD BE if he felt like it. I think it's part of the literary balancing act between ostensible sincerity and self-conscious playfulness that he's trying to strike these days. Maybe it's all to do with the duality with being in a marriage (which seems to be his major theme) and also observing a marriage as a writer at the same time. BTW, I have to say that I don't really like either song, and prefer him when he's in raptures IN SPITE OF himself.

― NickB (NickB), Monday, 22 December 2003 16:34 (twenty-two years ago)

I don't know much Cave but I like it in the sincere way it's used in the film "Zero Effect".

― Al (sitcom), Monday, 22 December 2003 17:14 (twenty-two years ago)

One of my favorite things about Nick Cave is that I'm not sure when he's being sincere and when he's just sort of dicking around. But when he's on top of his game, it works either way. "Straight to You," "The Ship Song," the entire Murder Ballads album. You don't know whether to laugh or cry, but it doesn't matter. With "Into Your Arms," I'm sort of laughing at him, and not with him. But then, he may be doing the same. The best jokes are told with a straight face.

I notice nobody (including me) is talking about "Just the Way You Are." I can't think of a single interesting thing to say about Billy Joel.

― Salmon Pink (Salmon Pink), Monday, 22 December 2003 17:29 (twenty-two years ago)

One of my favorite things about Nick Cave is that I'm not sure when he's being sincere and when he's just sort of dicking around.

See: His waltz-like cover of Pulp's "Disco 2000" Jesus Christ is that ever creepy.

― ben welsh (benwelsh), Monday, 22 December 2003 22:40 (twenty-two years ago)

This lyric from Just The Way You Are almost makes me think that Billy is the one "taking the piss" as they say....

I don't want clever conversation,
I never want to work that hard.
I just want someone that I can talk to,
I want you just the way you are.

translation: You're dumb, but I'm lazy, so hey we're a perfect pair!

― Matt Helgeson (Matt Helgeson), Tuesday, 23 December 2003 00:20 (twenty-two years ago)

See: His waltz-like cover of Pulp's "Disco 2000" Jesus Christ is that ever creepy.

-- ben welsh (benwels...), December 22nd, 2003.

Perfect example. And I love this song. He is so good at being creepy, isn't he?

― Salmon Pink (Salmon Pink), Tuesday, 23 December 2003 04:26 (twenty-two years ago)

I love Rock of Gibraltar :( as much for the music as for the lyrics really, but it's one of the stronger points on NOCTURAMA (for whatever that's worth).

when I was first getting into Nick Cave I thought "Into My Arms" (and "The Weeping Song" and a bunch of other stuff) seemed pretty embarassing, but i gradually grew to love that side of him more than any other.

― Adrian (Adrian Langston), Tuesday, 23 December 2003 04:29 (twenty-two years ago)

"Six Inch Gold Blade" vs "Stiletto"

― dave q, Wednesday, 24 December 2003 16:40 (twenty-two years ago)

I had happily forgotten all about that Billy Joel song, goddamn it. What a piece of crap.

I really like that Nick Cave song, whether it's tongue in cheek or sincere. Probably a little of both.

― Gear! (Gear!), Wednesday, 24 December 2003 18:57 (twenty-two years ago)

I never want to work that hard.

I have NEVER been able to hear what he is saying in that line. Thanks. I kind of like this song, though oddly enough knowing what this line is could turn me against it.

― Rockist Scientist, Wednesday, 24 December 2003 19:00 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm sure "Just The Way You Are" is still better than anything by Nick Cave though.

― Rockist Scientist, Wednesday, 24 December 2003 19:01 (twenty-two years ago)

I had "Into My Arms" played at my wedding. I wouldn't play any Billy Joel.

― anthony kyle monday (akmonday), Wednesday, 24 December 2003 19:22 (twenty-two years ago)

"Into My Arms" is one of my favorite Cave songs.

― Sean (Sean), Thursday, 25 December 2003 05:19 (twenty-two years ago)

one year passes...

Into Your Arms was the first song I heard by Nick Cave. This is what they call a "misdirection".

― Cunga (Cunga), Monday, 3 October 2005 04:28 (twenty years ago)

I don't mind it, but then I hear something like "City of Refuge" off of Tender Prey or something, and it rocks the paint off my walls so righteously that "Into My Arms" sounds like something even June Carter would write off as insufferably twee piffle.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Monday, 3 October 2005 14:14 (twenty years ago)

The point of Teh Boatman's Call is not exactly to rock. I mean, c'mon, yes, it's THAT Boatman.

Worst lyrics Nick Cave's ever written? This is madness. The infelicity of the first line pays off shrewdly in the rest of the stanza, whose ironies work miracles whether you, er, believe in them or not.

Also, it's pretty.

Al sorta OTM - it's the best thing about Zero Effect. But then, Zero Effect was... not good. Not the worst product of Hollywood nepotism ever, but... not good.

― rogermexico (rogermexico), Monday, 3 October 2005 22:21 (twenty years ago)

obv. "Into My Arms" shows "Just The Way You Are" the back of its pimp hand.

― rogermexico (rogermexico), Monday, 3 October 2005 22:24 (twenty years ago)

The best/worst line Nick Cave has ever written is:

I saw the cow/the cow was brown

― Jordan (Jordan), Monday, 3 October 2005 22:30 (twenty years ago)

Nick Cave could release an entire album of Dan Folgerberg covers and he would still get a pass because he's NICK CAVE.

― jsoulja (jsoulja), Monday, 3 October 2005 22:36 (twenty years ago)

Musically, Joel gets bonus points for the Fender Rhodes overdose.

― Nag! Nag! Nag! (Nag! Nag! Nag!), Monday, 3 October 2005 23:13 (twenty years ago)

jsoulja OTM. Fuck, If Nick Cave had written Tell Her About It, it would still be better than Just he Way You Are. Now I'm trying to imagine Billy Joel singing Loverman....

― when something smacks of something (dave225.3), Tuesday, 4 October 2005 00:57 (twenty years ago)

Into My Arms is nowhere near the travesty of cocktail-lounge-hell that Joel's piece of tripe is. And I like Billy Joel, I think he's a good storyteller when he wants to be. Just The Way You Are is one of the worst
examples of Joel's writing, whereas Into Your Arms really isn't an example of bad writing, for Nick, or in general. The song itself is a simple study of faith & love, where devotion works on two levels, both in religious love & secular love. Just The Way You Are just kind of blows.

― VegemiteGrrl (VegemiteGrrl), Tuesday, 4 October 2005 02:47 (twenty years ago)

I love the Nick Cave song. There's something so melancholic about it. Sure the lyrics might sound a bit dumb on their own, but most lyrics do. Yet they make a perfect combination with the music & timing & voice.

― salexander (salexander), Tuesday, 4 October 2005 04:23 (twenty years ago)

I'm less concerned with Billy Joel's track. With the fleeting exception of Glass Houses, Billy has never really pretended to be anything he isn't, nor has he had to live up to some past semblance of hip (though why he started to dress like the fifth Ramone towards the end of the 80's never made much sense to me). There was never a "fall from grace" or seizmic stylistic shift in his oeuvre. Cave, meanwhile, went from a bedraggled, frightwigged junkie hellion obsessed with murder and damnation to a sharp-dressed, torch-songin' crooner besotten with acute romantic histrionics.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Tuesday, 4 October 2005 11:51 (twenty years ago)

"I don't believe in an interventionist God" is sometimes the best opening line in any song.

― Come Back Johnny B (Johnney B), Tuesday, 4 October 2005 12:02 (twenty years ago)

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