Velvet Underground Trainspotting Question

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A couple years back a friend of mine gave me the deluxe banana album reissue with the stereo and mono mix. Last weekend I hooked up my hi-fi and decided to listen to it again. I've managed to misplace the mono disc and so put in the stereo version.

On Femme Fatale the Lou back-up vocals ("she's a femme fatale") are barely audible, it might as well not be there, and on Sunday Morning there's a guitar part that's missing (during the swirly instrumental break I swear there used to be a chugging "lead" or whatever you call it over top the backwards sounding bit). Anyway, the question is: Is this supposed to be like this or have I botched the hook up of my stereo and have only one channel playing through both speakers?

laurence kansas (lawrence kansas), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:03 (twelve years ago) Permalink

test your stereo with white light/white heat. If either the music or the story are missing from "The Gift" then your stereo is mono.

The Argunaut (sexyDancer), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:25 (twelve years ago) Permalink

argh, I don't have white light/white heat

laurence kansas (lawrence kansas), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:28 (twelve years ago) Permalink

Go out and buy white light/white heat. test your stereo with it. If either the music or the story are missing from "The Gift" then your stereo is mono.

Sonny, Ah!!1 (Sonny A.), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:34 (twelve years ago) Permalink

before quibbling about stereo/mono differences, you might want to check that one out.
it's good.

The Argunaut (sexyDancer), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:35 (twelve years ago) Permalink

You probably don't have "The Murder Mystery" either, but if you did, you could check whether you had different storylines coming out off either speaker.

Ken L (Ken L), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:35 (twelve years ago) Permalink

Wait, you can use the first few seconds of "Sunday Morning" - the glockenspiel or what-have-you is on the right channel and then the bass comes in on the left.

Ken L (Ken L), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:37 (twelve years ago) Permalink

Or just check the wiring...

W i l l (common_person), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:39 (twelve years ago) Permalink

One of your speakers is out of phase i.e. you have the wires in the wrong way round.

MGrout, Monday, 28 February 2005 16:42 (twelve years ago) Permalink

could be! I just threw the wires back there without any regard at all.

laurence kansas (lawrence kansas), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:44 (twelve years ago) Permalink

are you sure you're a trainspotter?

The Argunaut (sexyDancer), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:45 (twelve years ago) Permalink

Behind my receiver is a dark and lonely place- I'll have to do this by candelight because I have no flashlight. All of you will be in my prayers!

laurence kansas (lawrence kansas), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:53 (twelve years ago) Permalink

not even a spelunker!

The Argunaut (sexyDancer), Monday, 28 February 2005 17:18 (twelve years ago) Permalink

Agunaunt, I am defined by what I am not. My secret is out!

laurence kansas (lawrence kansas), Monday, 28 February 2005 17:28 (twelve years ago) Permalink


laurence kansas (lawrence kansas), Monday, 28 February 2005 17:28 (twelve years ago) Permalink


UPDATE: My speaker wire was connected to the right main and right remote outputs. I fixed the problem.

I'd like to thank everyone who was with me from the beginning, without your help this project may have never been completed. I'm confident that with the teamwork displayed in the last couple of days our dream of sending an ex-member of the Velvet Underground to the moon will soon become a reality.

golden ears kansas (lawrence kansas), Tuesday, 1 March 2005 14:07 (twelve years ago) Permalink


The Argunaut (sexyDancer), Tuesday, 1 March 2005 14:11 (twelve years ago) Permalink

I thought that was Everett?

mark grout (mark grout), Tuesday, 1 March 2005 15:00 (twelve years ago) Permalink

I go to school with J0hn C4le's daughter, 3d3n; she is kind've a twat.

Ian John50n (orion), Tuesday, 1 March 2005 15:29 (twelve years ago) Permalink

ian wins "post of the day" so far.

peter smith (plsmith), Tuesday, 1 March 2005 15:31 (twelve years ago) Permalink

Who's the mom, B3+53y J0hn50n?

Ken L (Ken L), Tuesday, 1 March 2005 15:39 (twelve years ago) Permalink

No, some other silly tart, Rise?

Dadaismus (Dada), Tuesday, 1 March 2005 15:40 (twelve years ago) Permalink

four years pass...

This seems as good a place as any to ask this question ... has anybody bought that new VU seven inch singles thing that Sundazed just put out? I don't really want to buy it, BUT: the mix of "I Heard Her Call My Name" is apparently vastly different. Would like to hear this ... mp3 anywhere?

tylerw, Saturday, 10 October 2009 00:16 (eight years ago) Permalink

haha I was wondering which thread to revive to discuss the "Nuns Are On The Seawall" blog...

i.e Velvets bootlegs S/D

the 'Ultimate Mono and Acetates Album' has some of those singles but not all. it does have the mono WL/WH which is really different at least on Lady Godiva's Operation, I guess I should listen to it. that may be the version of "Call My Name" you refer to.

also loving:

the Pre-VU Preview, all the demos of early 60's Reed/Cale pop music
Problems In Urban Living (Cleveland 68)
CDs from a certain minimalist composr who shall remain anonymous

sleeve, Saturday, 10 October 2009 00:24 (eight years ago) Permalink

Yeah, I've got that Ultimate Mono Acetates thing -- from what I understand, this mix of "Heard" is unheard until now? Less of Lou's guitar, more of the band. Or something ... But anyway -- yeah! Pre-VU is crazy, really incredible. Drop in some references to methamphetamine and "Do The Ostrich" could be on White Light/White Heat, easy. Crazy that, according to the Unterberger VU Day By Day book, there's a solo version of "Heroin" recorded during the Pickwick era. Probably sounds similar to the versions on the 1st disc of "Peel Slowly" but I'd still love to hear it.

tylerw, Saturday, 10 October 2009 00:30 (eight years ago) Permalink

I've got it on order, will let you know...

Mark G, Saturday, 10 October 2009 13:23 (eight years ago) Permalink

Someone over on the Velvet Forum sez: "the mix of I Heard Her Call My Name is insane. At first I thought that there was a mistake in the pressing as Lou's opening vocals ("here comes count down...' ) are way down in the mix and actually sound muffled. Then they pick up a little with 'Ever since...'. Sterling's guitar is up and so it Cale's bass. For the first 30 seconds or so it sounds like a kind of lo-fi garage sound and then later the sound gets bigger with more of the impact we know. But overall the balance is restored so that you can hear Sterling's lovely rhythm guitar work and Cale's bass, which is really great. Cale's bass sound is amazing on this mix and then also makes you realised how low the bass is in the mix on most of the White Light LP."

tylerw, Saturday, 10 October 2009 16:02 (eight years ago) Permalink

Little bit annoying that they're putting out all of this collector-bait stuff these days and not putting out unreleased stuff. Or barely any unreleased stuff.

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:16 (eight years ago) Permalink

A while ago, I did my own mix of "Heard Her Call My Name" with less Lou and more of the band just for fun, anyone can do it

The Prince's choice: making a brush. (Tom D.), Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:19 (eight years ago) Permalink


tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:20 (eight years ago) Permalink

From that Velvet Forum, here's a list of uncirculated VU stuff that seems to actually exist.

-The demo tape Cale took to England
-Summit High School tape
-Bizarre footage
-Delmonico´s tape
-Boston Tea Party footage(any news on this, by the way?)
-La Cave 68 tape
-Hippodrome 68 tape
-Nelson Video tape 70
-Rhode Island School of Design, Providence, Rhode Island
-May 11, 1965 Pickwick Studios, near Long Island City, New York
-Donald Jackson VU footage
-Danny Williams VU footage
-The Primitives tape
-Ronald Nameth Vu footage
-Matrix Tapes
-Seattle 69 tape

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:22 (eight years ago) Permalink

I don't know how to do that! (xp)

-The demo tape Cale took to England

I'd be surprised if this still existed! Very! The Matrix Tapes is what we want!!!!!

The Prince's choice: making a brush. (Tom D.), Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:24 (eight years ago) Permalink


what the hell is that? a 304-page hardback book, yeah, but what about the single with it?

hate it when Amazon has no info about the product.

and hey that Seattle 69 show is on the Nuns Are On The Seawall blog, it's listed as Retinal Circus. first new show (to me) to surface since the Gymnasium.

sleeve, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:24 (eight years ago) Permalink

!!! Had no idea ... Thanks! Is it good?

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:27 (eight years ago) Permalink

more from that Velvet Forum:
-the full Gymnasium tape
-the cale/sterling/reed rehearsals from cale loft 1966
-uncut recent Factory 66 tape

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:30 (eight years ago) Permalink

here's a list of uncirculated VU stuff that seems to actually exist.

i'm still hoping that footage of them on Upbeat! shows up somewhere. Lots of clips from that show are in circulation, but considering they made a handful of appearances i'm surprised nothing's around. About one of the shows: "The Velvets performed live on the Upbeat TV show in June 1968 (not June 1967). Moreover, contrary to Sterling Morrison's recollection, they performed a blistering, buzzsaw version of Run Run Run. Their rendition of Run Run Run went beyond their alloted time: thus, Upbeat cut away to a commercial while the Velvets were engaged in feedback frenzy with Lou's back to the camera."

city worker, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:32 (eight years ago) Permalink

that would be awesome. There was some comment (I think from Moe Tucker) that she couldn't believe, with all the cameras the Warhol crew had going all the time, no one just filmed a straight ahead version of one of the EPI shows.

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:37 (eight years ago) Permalink

Is it good?

here's wl/wh:

it's a soundboard!!! the only one I know of besides those Matrix tapes. as a result the vox are too loud and the guitars a bit subdued, but the overall recording is much clearer. I still think Problems In Urban Living (Cleveland Oct. 68) is my favorite live boot, love the guitar sound on that.

sleeve, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:47 (eight years ago) Permalink

that's a flac btw

sleeve, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:48 (eight years ago) Permalink

Already downloading from The Nuns site ... So weird that this stuff just keeps showing up. One thing I'm super interested in (that hasn't seen the light of day afaik) is a studio version of "Beginning to See the Light" with Cale.

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:50 (eight years ago) Permalink


The Prince's choice: making a brush. (Tom D.), Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:51 (eight years ago) Permalink

those Velvets Forum trainspotters mean business man.

sleeve, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:52 (eight years ago) Permalink

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:54 (eight years ago) Permalink

But yeah, the "Beginning" with Cale is mentioned in the Unterberger book - recorded at the "Mr. Rain" session apparently? With "fuzz bass"? There was talk of it appearing on a projected WL/WH "deluxe edition, I think. Which never came out obv.

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:55 (eight years ago) Permalink

LOL, yeah, obv.

The Prince's choice: making a brush. (Tom D.), Thursday, 15 October 2009 16:01 (eight years ago) Permalink

But ... maybe now that this singles set has come out, there's a chance of more VU material coming out officially? I think I read that Lou wasn't into having any more live stuff come out.

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 16:03 (eight years ago) Permalink

Hmmm, so I'm listening to this "Retinal Circus" VU show -- and I'm pretty sure some of these takes are the same as appear on Live 1969. Haven't a/b'd them or anything. It's an uncut tape of the show, though, which hasn't circulate as far as I know ... I think that those songs were thought to be from the Matrix, wonder what the deal is! MYSTERY. Sounds great, anyway.

tylerw, Friday, 16 October 2009 21:08 (eight years ago) Permalink

yeh, the wh/wh posted above is the same as the version on the live 69 album

zappi, Friday, 16 October 2009 21:21 (eight years ago) Permalink

er wl/wh

zappi, Friday, 16 October 2009 21:21 (eight years ago) Permalink

Yeah, same w/ "heroin", "what goes on", "new age" so far. it's funny to hear these songs w/ audience applause -- on 1969 they cut off almost immediately, sort of giving the impression that the VU was playing to barely anyone. But here they've got a totally enthusiastic crowd. And why not, considering the godlike awesomeness of this "What Goes On."

tylerw, Friday, 16 October 2009 21:26 (eight years ago) Permalink


Οὖτις, Friday, 8 January 2016 21:01 (two years ago) Permalink

Waka sampling heroin


Anyway, it's not a three, it's a yogh. (Tom D.), Friday, 8 January 2016 22:07 (two years ago) Permalink

“From my collection, Super Rare Tape..VELVET UNDERGROUND 7 X 1/4 PRODUCTION STEREO TEST TAPE 4T - 7.5 ips.1967 VELVET UNDERGROUND & NICO...SMS/MGM-VERVE RECORDS...INCLUDES REED & CALE'S DELETED 2ND VERSION OF "HEROIN;" MUCH DIFFERENT MIX WITH CALE VOCALS, PIANO, FUZZ GUITAR & NO tested, leader'd, excellent hi-fidelity, non smoke home,..always stored in cello sealed bag...”
never even heard of this alternate "heroin"

tylerw, Monday, 11 January 2016 15:22 (two years ago) Permalink


shit like this is gonna keep turning up for the next 50 years, isn't it?

sleeve, Monday, 11 January 2016 15:27 (two years ago) Permalink


tylerw, Monday, 11 January 2016 15:28 (two years ago) Permalink

wow $750 seems a bit cheap for something like that

﷽ (diamonddave85), Monday, 11 January 2016 15:30 (two years ago) Permalink

yeah, considering how much that acetate went for...

tylerw, Monday, 11 January 2016 15:34 (two years ago) Permalink

two months pass...

huh, so there is a VU exposition coming to Paris in March through August (link in English), at the Cité de la musique

looks cool! there's some kind of museum exhibition (it's in the space where the big Miles Davis exposition was a few years back, which was rad). and also several concerts in the space, including Television playing Marquee Moon, and John Cale playing the first VU album, with Etienne Daho, the Libertines, Animal Collective, Lou Doillon, Nick Franklin from Lemon Jelly, and Mark Lanegan.

also there are conference talks and debates on the band, musical workshops around the work of the band for both kids & adults, experimental film "experiences"

I am so there.

droit au butt (Euler), Friday, 11 March 2016 17:34 (one year ago) Permalink

I had a great time relaxing in the "mini EPI" room at the Andy Warhol / Ai Wei Wei exhibition in the National Gallery of Victoria the other month. Was enjoying the art and then stepped thru a door into a room full of beanbags and all four walls projecting Factory footage, Chelsea Girls, VU rehearsals, screen tests, coloured dots, Malanga with his whip, et al. And a great mix of VU obscurities played loud. My wife had to come back and get me after half an hour.

MatthewK, Friday, 11 March 2016 21:43 (one year ago) Permalink

yeahhh that sounds like fun

tylerw, Friday, 11 March 2016 21:50 (one year ago) Permalink

tylerw, Tuesday, 15 March 2016 14:20 (one year ago) Permalink

two months pass...

pretty damn solid attempt to bring lou's live vocal to the studio instrumental of guess i'm falling in love

tylerw, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 15:30 (one year ago) Permalink

This works really well. Kinda thinking of this as the definitive version now (especially since they used the '80s mix).

Montgomery Burns' Jazz (Tarfumes The Escape Goat), Wednesday, 18 May 2016 15:40 (one year ago) Permalink

yeah, even though it occasionally slips up, that pretty much fits with it being from the WL/WH era. and the twin Sterling guitar solos sound cool too!

tylerw, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 15:43 (one year ago) Permalink

Oh, I tried that once, it sounded godawful, but technology has moved on from me using a 4-track portastudio..

Mark G, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 15:55 (one year ago) Permalink

yeah it's by no means perfect, but pretty listenable. maybe the closest we'll get!

tylerw, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 15:56 (one year ago) Permalink

Yeah, not bad. I guess they slowed down the studio take.

Basically, I tried editing in individual Lou snippets. It was rub. Packed it after 20 seconds worth. Oh, and then I tried singing it myself. mmm, no.

Mark G, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 15:59 (one year ago) Permalink

I think even Lou would have loved that one.

Mark G, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 16:00 (one year ago) Permalink

five months pass...

No idea where to post this but I thought this might be a good spot:

Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Sunday, 23 October 2016 04:28 (one year ago) Permalink

eight months pass...

what's the longest version of sister ray, the matrix version?

just another (diamonddave85), Wednesday, 28 June 2017 14:35 (six months ago) Permalink

pretty sure, yeah, 38 minutes? the La Cave version mixed w/"Murder Mystery" is only 28.

sleeve, Wednesday, 28 June 2017 14:39 (six months ago) Permalink

Disc 3, "Complete Matrix Tapes", 37 mins.

Mark G, Wednesday, 28 June 2017 14:41 (six months ago) Permalink

The Scratch Orchestra apparently did a 45 minute version of "Sister Ray" at a concert in '69/'70 - even longer than the Velvets were doing themselves at the time...

― The Return of the Thin White Pope (Tom D.), Tuesday, 19 January 2016 21:58 (one year ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

From John Tilbury's biography of Cornelius Cardew.

weird echo of the falsies (Tom D.), Wednesday, 28 June 2017 15:45 (six months ago) Permalink

now THAT is some trainspotting

sleeve, Wednesday, 28 June 2017 15:45 (six months ago) Permalink

I think I said it at the time, I read it so you don't have to.

weird echo of the falsies (Tom D.), Wednesday, 28 June 2017 16:05 (six months ago) Permalink

(don't think this record actually exists, but haha, what if it did!)

tylerw, Thursday, 6 July 2017 14:02 (six months ago) Permalink

three months pass...

I... kinda want it

niels, Thursday, 19 October 2017 21:26 (two months ago) Permalink

re: disco dazzler - no "in the light of the miracle", no credibility

bob lefse (rushomancy), Thursday, 19 October 2017 21:51 (two months ago) Permalink

one month passes...

Watching college football with the folks and heard a VU song come on during a commercial break, did a little research and learned that Syracuse has rights to "Head Held Up High" from alumnus Lewis Reed. This wasn't the exact commercial but was available on the 'tube:

Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Saturday, 25 November 2017 18:46 (one month ago) Permalink

Uh... lol, sorry about that.

Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Saturday, 25 November 2017 18:47 (one month ago) Permalink


Modern Zounds in Undiscovered Country (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 25 November 2017 21:05 (one month ago) Permalink

one month passes...

Spent an afternoon at the library going through some newspaper microfilm - managed to unearth an EPI review from a show in my hometown, Nov 12 1966. Vaguely dismissive in all the best ways - "I guess the whole thing would be pretty wild if you'd just swallowed some LSD but I don't know much about that."

whitehallunity, Tuesday, 26 December 2017 21:06 (three weeks ago) Permalink

that's amazing, great find

sleeve, Tuesday, 26 December 2017 21:08 (three weeks ago) Permalink

yeah, I was pretty pleased with myself, haha, especially cause it gives some partial setlist confirmation, namely that they did 'Black Angel's Death Song'. Now if I could only dig up a tape...

whitehallunity, Tuesday, 26 December 2017 21:20 (three weeks ago) Permalink

assumed thiw as revived due to this, the provenance is a bit dubious, but the tracklist compiles a fair amount of stuff in one place which is nice

there's another forthcoming box set this spring which also promises this 1969 album, not sure if the tracklist will be the same

akm, Tuesday, 26 December 2017 23:55 (three weeks ago) Permalink

that's the same as the "1969" disc in the recent 3rd album boxset, iirc

sleeve, Wednesday, 27 December 2017 00:00 (two weeks ago) Permalink

plus studio extras from the White Light White Heat 45th anniversary (side 4, which is actually 1968 with Cale not 1969 with Yule but w/e)

attention vampire (MatthewK), Wednesday, 27 December 2017 00:52 (two weeks ago) Permalink

It looks like that new Vinyl box Universal is pushing is a straight port of the Sundazed box. I also saw that stand-alone 1969 collection in a shop the other day. I think it was an RSD thing put out by Universal Music, so genuinely not dubious.

Never Learn To Mike Love (C. Grisso/McCain), Wednesday, 27 December 2017 02:41 (two weeks ago) Permalink

Actually, scratch that about the box sets. The Sundazed Box is the first three albums and Chelsea Girl in Mono, with a single stereo LP of selected 1969 studio recordings. The new Universal Set is a limited edition featuring the four original albums plus Chelsea Girl in Stereo, in addition to the double LP of 1969 studio cuts.

Never Learn To Mike Love (C. Grisso/McCain), Wednesday, 27 December 2017 02:49 (two weeks ago) Permalink

You know 'albumsthatneverwere'?

Might want to toddle along there right about now...

Mark G, Wednesday, 27 December 2017 12:55 (two weeks ago) Permalink

new universal box sounds great but it's fucking overpriced IMO. I'd rather pick up the sudazed box and have mono and then scrounge up the double 1969 elsewhere (or buy that shuga one that just came out; although I hear there are quality issues with it)

akm, Wednesday, 27 December 2017 15:20 (two weeks ago) Permalink

Mark G OTM

Lyudmila Pavlichenko (dandydonweiner), Wednesday, 27 December 2017 21:29 (two weeks ago) Permalink

is there a good VU book?

scoff walker (diamonddave85), Tuesday, 2 January 2018 18:43 (two weeks ago) Permalink

I like Richie Unterberger's White Light/White Heat: The Velvet Underground Day-by-Day

Brad C., Tuesday, 2 January 2018 18:54 (two weeks ago) Permalink

yeah, a great resource. the NY Art coffee table book is nice as well.

tylerw, Tuesday, 2 January 2018 19:01 (two weeks ago) Permalink

The Gerard Malanga one is a good intro, but we're well past that stage now, right?

Mark G, Tuesday, 2 January 2018 20:38 (two weeks ago) Permalink

yeah definitely good stuff in Up-Tight (and great photos in the original version) — skews a bit too heavily on the warhol years, but that's to be expected, I guess.

tylerw, Tuesday, 2 January 2018 20:41 (two weeks ago) Permalink

Yeah drag that later reprints of Uptight get rid of so many of the photos. Do the same ones appear in Unterberger, been a while since I looked in that.
THey kind of epitomised cool for a while there so good to have photos of them.

Stevolende, Tuesday, 2 January 2018 20:52 (two weeks ago) Permalink

awesome, looks like i'm gonna be picking up unterberger's

scoff walker (diamonddave85), Tuesday, 2 January 2018 21:19 (two weeks ago) Permalink

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