What one track of a notoriously difficult artist would you offer to someone who's curious about said artist?

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Invent or describe your target audience, or not.

― Leeeter van den Hoogenband (Leee), Thursday, 10 March 2005 16:50 (twenty-one years ago)

autechre - "Lost"

― Leeeter van den Hoogenband (Leee), Thursday, 10 March 2005 16:55 (twenty-one years ago)

Half Japanese, "Charmed Life"

― mike a, Thursday, 10 March 2005 17:06 (twenty-one years ago)

this is a good idea for a thread!

― jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 10 March 2005 17:07 (twenty-one years ago)

Venetian Snares, "Dollmaker"

― Patrick Allan (adr), Thursday, 10 March 2005 17:29 (twenty-one years ago)

Anthony Braxton, the marching-band track at the end of "Creative Orchestra Music 1976"

― Douglas (Douglas), Thursday, 10 March 2005 17:31 (twenty-one years ago)

Mia Doi Todd - "Digital, Version 2.2"

― darin (darin), Thursday, 10 March 2005 17:39 (twenty-one years ago)

Are we looking to try and win the target audience over with a good, representative track or trick them with something unusually accessable?

That said, John Zorn's Naked City - NY Flat Top Box, played to my Mom.

― Graeme (Graeme), Thursday, 10 March 2005 17:44 (twenty-one years ago)

"graeme i'ave always wanted to hear this john zorn fella, i heard he blows a mean horn"

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 10 March 2005 17:55 (twenty-one years ago)

as an entre to can (difficult for most non-ilxors, mind you...), i suggest "paperhouse". i feel like once someone has digested "paperhouse", they can basically handle most krautrock.

― peter smith (plsmith), Thursday, 10 March 2005 17:58 (twenty-one years ago)

(douglas's really smart!)

argh, xpost...

John Zorn: I.A.O. Music In Sacred Light, i'd say
(and, mebbe, The Gift - as the trickxy one)

...Graeme's pick's goot, too

― t\'\'t (t\'\'t), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:00 (twenty-one years ago)

Or "Oh Yeah" (xpost)

― Patrick Allan (adr), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:02 (twenty-one years ago)

"Jackie," by Scott Walker. After that, anything, even Tilt, would appeal to anyone unless they're nuts.

― toothy philanthropist, Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:04 (twenty-one years ago)

"Diddy Wah Diddy" by Captain Beefheart

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:10 (twenty-one years ago)

yep, good call alex nyc!

― t\'\'t (t\'\'t), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:13 (twenty-one years ago)

the cover of 'My Sharona' on the new Polysics album

― Lee F# (fsharp), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:15 (twenty-one years ago)

OH WAIDAMINNIT - alex nyc, wot'd yers killing j. pick be then?!

― t\'\'t (t\'\'t), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:15 (twenty-one years ago)

(aaaah, me silly - killing j. aren't diffikkult, they're "easy", sren't they? :)

― t\'\'t (t\'\'t), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:17 (twenty-one years ago)

Are we looking to try and win the target audience over with a good, representative track or trick them with something unusually accessable?

Either one, though let's try to be nice to them unsuspectin folk!

Also, "difficult" should be in scare quotes.

― Leeeter van den Hoogenband (Leee), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:18 (twenty-one years ago)

I personally don't consider Killing Joke a "notoriously difficult" band to get one's head around, but if you insist --- I'd say "Change". Everything one needs to know/get/grock from Killing Joke is all there -- the relentless groove, Geordie's signature guitar, Jaz's apoplectic doom-mongering....etc.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:18 (twenty-one years ago)

richard marx, "hazard"

― chuck, Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:25 (twenty-one years ago)

part one or part two?

― Lee F# (fsharp), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:26 (twenty-one years ago)

>I'd say "Change". Everything one needs to know/get/grock from Killing Joke is all there -- the relentless groove, Geordie's signature guitar, Jaz's apoplectic doom-mongering....etc<

Heh, yeah Alex, this is exactly why they disappointed me ever since -- everything they've done since "Change"/"Requiem" struck me as a lesser and lesser copy of the one great idea they'd started out with. (So their second album was their second best album, and then their third one, and pretty soon after that I kinda stopped paying attention.)

― chuck, Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:28 (twenty-one years ago)

aaaa-right-a, chuck...

would you suggest the guitar for sonny sharrock, then?
also, which'd be your pick for sun ra?

― t\'\'t (t\'\'t), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:32 (twenty-one years ago)

For Royal Trux, the song I'd pick's "Turn of the Century" and the album is Accelerator. Either one of those should work.

― toothy philanthropist, Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:37 (twenty-one years ago)

for sun ra, mebbe something off of blue delight. you get the flavor, but you know, it won't scare anyone out of the room.

― scott seward (scott seward), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:39 (twenty-one years ago)

For Magazine, "Shot By Both Sides" will work like a charm.

― Jena (JenaP), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:42 (twenty-one years ago)

for sonnie sharrock, i'd play somebody something off of a herbie mann record. if that's allowed.

― scott seward (scott seward), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:42 (twenty-one years ago)

maybe you could play magazine's version of i love you you big dummy to get someone into beefheart.

― scott seward (scott seward), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:43 (twenty-one years ago)

ha! smoov move, scott! (re: sharrock)

― t\'\'t (t\'\'t), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:44 (twenty-one years ago)

Hell no, for Sun Ra you just play them "Nuclear War"! It's totally a novelty rap song! My kids think it's hilarious. (Actually, I couldn't tell whether t\'\'t was being sarcastic or not. Not that I care, really. And yeah, I'd recommend *Guitar* for Sharrock. It's pretty!) (Though who knows, some stuff he did with Herbie Mann or somebody might be more accessible for smooth jazz dudes) (And if I was trying to concince metal fans, probably I'd pick something off Last Exit's *Iron Path* instead.) (Or wait, aren't he and Whitney Houston on the same Material track? Or just the same Material album? Whatever..)

― chuck, Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:44 (twenty-one years ago)

Boredoms - Circle

― dronez are not ours to eat, dronez are not ours to wear (smile), Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:47 (twenty-one years ago)

or "yellow brick road" or "the past sure is tense" for Beefheart.

― toothy philanthropist, Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:48 (twenty-one years ago)

Nah, Beefheart = "Too Much Time" off of *Clear Spot*, which could almost be a Tyrone Davis of Johnny Taylor song or something.

Except I don't necesarily think Beefheart (or Sharrock or the Boredoms or Sun Ra) are "difficult." At leat not to the kind of people who listen to Beefheart/Sharrock/Boredoms/Sun Ra kinda stuff.

So: Celine Dion - "Unison"

― chuck, Thursday, 10 March 2005 18:54 (twenty-one years ago)

"graeme i'ave always wanted to hear this john zorn fella, i heard he blows a mean horn"

That's uncanny, I can almost hear her speaking. I believe her exact words were "I hear he fuckin' kills on alto sax."

― Graeme (Graeme), Thursday, 10 March 2005 19:12 (twenty-one years ago)

Hmm...hard to say whether Muslimgauze was difficult, but his back catalogue is daunting to say the least. I'd recommend "Fakir" off of Zul'm, though -- that album and song was the first I'd heard of his work, and it really captivated my attention, so it might do the same for others.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 10 March 2005 19:15 (twenty-one years ago)

I feel like playing a Clear Spot or Spotlight Kid track might only be good for getting someone into 70s Beefheart. If you wanted to get them to give Trout Mask Replica a chance the track to play would be either 'The Blimp' or 'Moonlight on Vermont.'

― Graeme (Graeme), Thursday, 10 March 2005 19:16 (twenty-one years ago)

Bob Seger - "2+2+=?"

― chuck, Thursday, 10 March 2005 19:17 (twenty-one years ago)

"Plastic Factory"! I think that might be the first Beefheart track I ever heard. Yeah, anything from Safe As Milk is good tho. And "Moonlight in Vermont" def the first track I really "got" from Trout Mask. I'd play "Blind Willie" from Sharrock's Guitar, great melody, and it crops up like 10 other places in his discography.

Derek Bailey -- I'd play the duet with Buckethead from Company91.

― Stormy Davis (diamond), Thursday, 10 March 2005 19:21 (twenty-one years ago)

(bob seger more "difficult" than sun ra, sharrock or beefheart, huh? :)

― t''t, Thursday, 10 March 2005 19:24 (twenty-one years ago)

uh, yeah -- read the post where i mentioned celine dion.

― chuck, Thursday, 10 March 2005 19:29 (twenty-one years ago)

(obv. point being, it depends who's doing the difficulticating.)

― chuck, Thursday, 10 March 2005 19:31 (twenty-one years ago)

and ILMers express their inability to listen to bob seger all the time!

― chuck, Thursday, 10 March 2005 19:32 (twenty-one years ago)

What track would be Yoko Ono's? Anyone?

― darin (darin), Thursday, 10 March 2005 19:41 (twenty-one years ago)

"Walking on Thin Ice"? "Kiss Kiss Kiss"? (Or some suckass thing she did even later?)

― xhuxk, Thursday, 10 March 2005 19:48 (twenty-one years ago)

For Yoko? I find that "Why" does the trick if anything is going to.

― Douglas (Douglas), Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:23 (twenty-one years ago)

It got my attention in a hurry, anyway.

― Douglas (Douglas), Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:24 (twenty-one years ago)

Pere Ubu - Not Happy .. Oh, that's for someone who's NOT curious about Pere Ubu.
Otherwise - I Will Wait.

― dave225 (Dave225), Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:29 (twenty-one years ago)

what about phish, ryan adams, bright eyes, or dave matthews. impossible, i say

― fingerjoint, Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:32 (twenty-one years ago)

Their jam session on "Chocolate City"

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:33 (twenty-one years ago)

xpost...

nigh everybody ignoring the "notoriously difficult" bit, when convenient, no? ;(

― t\'\'t (t\'\'t), Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:35 (twenty-one years ago)

I would pick "Hot Head" as an intro to Captain Beefheart, but that's because I think all his 60s and 70s material is hugely overrated, and he only got really good at the end.

I'd play "Pinch" for someone who'd never heard Can.

Einsturzende Neubauten, "Kalte Sterne."

― pdf (Phil Freeman), Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:37 (twenty-one years ago)

nobody is ignoring the thread title at all. (again, you're pretending it can be objectively defined, when it can't.)

for ubu, if you're trying to convince a sabbath fan, go with "30 seconds over tokyo" (which sounds a lot like "electric funeral.")

― xhuxk, Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:40 (twenty-one years ago)

neubauten i was going to say the adrian sherwood remix of "yu gung," actually.

― xhuxk, Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:40 (twenty-one years ago)

can, i'd say "i'm so green"

― xhuxk, Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:42 (twenty-one years ago)

faust - "it's a rainy day, sunshine girl"

― xhuxk, Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:42 (twenty-one years ago)

Disco Inferno were frequently inaccessible -- I'd play "Second Language". It seems to link their past, the then-present, and the recordings they hadn't made yet...and it does so very politely and beautifically.

― Ian Riese-Moraine (Eastern Mantra), Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:47 (twenty-one years ago)

Kerosene by Big Black

― kornrulez6969 (TCBeing), Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:50 (twenty-one years ago)

Cap'm Beefheart I always pick Ice Cream for Crow - and if they don't get it, fuck 'em.

― dave225 (Dave225), Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:51 (twenty-one years ago)

faust - happy skinhead
can - she brings the rain (if you want to trick them), i want more (if you don't)
brian eno (ambient stuff)- an ending (ascent)
matmos - california rhinoplasty
flying saucer attack - outdoor miner
vladislav delay - most of luomo's stuff
mouse on mars - send me shivers
sir alice - technotronic
mu - tell you something

obv. debatable degrees of difficulty, but these are all things that someone has labeled, in one way or another, difficult when i played it for them.

― firstworldman (firstworldman), Thursday, 10 March 2005 21:24 (twenty-one years ago)

I just listened to "Paperhouse," and it is the goodness! I'm going to get Tago Mago now; this thread's already starting to pay off.

― Leeeter van den Hoogenband (Leee), Thursday, 10 March 2005 22:59 (twenty-one years ago)

Dude, wait, you're mister psychdrone around here as much as anyone and you hadn't heard Can yet? Away with you (to the record store).

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 10 March 2005 23:01 (twenty-one years ago)

Wait till you hear "Halleluhwah." Jesus Christ.

― space funk, Thursday, 10 March 2005 23:04 (twenty-one years ago)

My secret is I'm a poser.

― Leeeter van den Hoogenband (Leee), Thursday, 10 March 2005 23:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Beefheart, I'd go with "Click Clack" off of "Spotlight Kid" or "Long Neck Bottles" from "Clear Spot." It's Beefheart and not all that adulterated but pretty straightforward.

Bob Seger, I always thought "Main Street" was the best Bob Seger song myself.

That Material song with Whitney Houston is "Memories," by Hugh Hopper and with Archie Shepp, and it's a good one.

Sharrock, I always thought "Who Does She Hope to Be?" off "Ask the Ages" is really accessible, a beautiful song in fact.

I was having a discussion that almost turned into an argument the other day with this guy, we were at a bar and talking about country music. I mentioned one of my favorites, Gary Stewart. He said, "sheet, that guy never could sang, tried to sound like Jerry Lee Lewis." So I was thinking that "Single Again" would be the one to play for a guy like that, what an ace song that encapsulates everything good about Gary.

I still can't find one for Al Hibbler.

― edd s hurt (ddduncan), Thursday, 10 March 2005 23:29 (twenty-one years ago)

"Two Trains" - Moonshake (My relationship with the band ends with Margaret Fiedler's departure)

"Another You" - Swans

"Animation" - Cabaret Voltaire

Tom Waits' first album, I guess..

― Steve Gertz (sgertz), Thursday, 10 March 2005 23:56 (twenty-one years ago)

hey, i just realized nobody has made the obvious john cage joke yet!

― xhuxk, Thursday, 10 March 2005 23:59 (twenty-one years ago)

jandek "nancy sings" or "variant".

the trux song i'd choose would be "liar" or that track of theirs that was in high fidelity

― shine headlights on me (electricsound), Friday, 11 March 2005 00:43 (twenty-one years ago)

bright eyes "the calendar hung itself".

that's pretty much the only song of his i can stand anymore as well

― shine headlights on me (electricsound), Friday, 11 March 2005 00:44 (twenty-one years ago)

Acid Mothers Temple - "Soleil de cristal et lune d'argent"

Actually my secret is that I don't trust music before 1990.

― Leeeter van den Hoogenband (Leee), Friday, 11 March 2005 03:10 (twenty-one years ago)

Syd Barrett - Here I Go

― Deluxe (Damian), Friday, 11 March 2005 09:52 (twenty-one years ago)

Pharoah Sanders -- "Upper & Lower Egypt"
Cecil Taylor -- "Excursion on a Wobbly Rail"
Sonic Youth w/ Lydia Lunch -- "Death Valley 69"
Rahsaan Roland Kirk -- "Bright Moments"
Sun Ra -- "Rocket Number 9"
Ornette Coleman -- "Una Muy Bonita"

― lovebug starski (lovebug starski), Friday, 11 March 2005 10:55 (twenty-one years ago)

DNA -- "Blonde Red Head"

― lovebug starski (lovebug starski), Friday, 11 March 2005 11:17 (twenty-one years ago)

KARLHEINZ STOCKHAUSEN

Instrumental music:
Refrain

Electronic music:
Telemusik

Vocal music:
Atmen gibt das Leben

Piano music - forget it. Orchestral music - maybe not.

― Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 11 March 2005 11:21 (twenty-one years ago)

... that's three tracks... sorry!

Luciano Berio, Sinfonia

― Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 11 March 2005 11:32 (twenty-one years ago)

Merzbow, anybody?

I might go for something offa Tape Dada or Doors open at 8am.

― Ferlin Husky (noodle vague), Friday, 11 March 2005 11:33 (twenty-one years ago)

i sort of had to do this when i made my rap-hating g/f a rap tape to convince her that there would be *some* things in the world of hip-hop she might enjoy. i had to look for the melodic/sensitive/clean-mouthed/ballad-y tracks on various rap albums. songs i can remember being on it:

geto boys - mind playin tricks on me

dmx - slippin

bone thugs - 1st of da month

jay-z - december 4th

tupac - life goes on

notorious big - juicy

rza - love jones

david banner - cadillac on 22's

nas - memory lane

― weasel diesel (K1l14n), Friday, 11 March 2005 12:06 (twenty-one years ago)

Derek Bailey - I'd play the duet with Buckethead from Company 91

We were in the audience for that. You miss the visual splendour of Bailey getting up halfway through the feedback loop at the end, putting on his cap, then donning a homemade Kabuki cloak thing and doing faux-kung fu moves at Buckethead.

― Marcello Carlin (nostudium), Friday, 11 March 2005 12:15 (twenty-one years ago)

Cornelius - 'Star Fruits Surf Rider'
Minotaur Shock - 'The Heart Of All That Is' (Remix of Lucky Pierre)
Plus-Tech Squeeze Box - 'Dough-Nuts Town Map'
Takako Minekawa - 'Spin Spider Spin'
DJ Shadow - 'Midnight In A Perfect World'

― BARMS, Friday, 11 March 2005 12:16 (twenty-one years ago)

Derek Bailey - I'd play the duet with Buckethead from Company 91
We were in the audience for that. You miss the visual splendour of Bailey getting up halfway through the feedback loop at the end, putting on his cap, then donning a homemade Kabuki cloak thing and doing faux-kung fu moves at Buckethead.

-- Marcello Carlin (marcellocarli...), March 11th, 2005

holy shit! oh man, to have seen that...

― Stormy Davis (diamond), Friday, 11 March 2005 19:51 (twenty-one years ago)

Cardiacs - Manhoo

― everything, Friday, 11 March 2005 20:16 (twenty-one years ago)

Since everyone said Captain Beefheart he must not be that difficult, but did anyone say "Tropical Hot Dog Night," his (or, the) catchiest song ever? Whoever you played it for would start spazzing out and forget about difficulty.

John Cage-Indeterminacy

Lightning Bolt-the Faire Folk

― dr. phil (josh langhoff), Saturday, 12 March 2005 04:25 (twenty-one years ago)

Yoko Ono - Death of Samantha
Henry Cow - Beautiful As the Moon, Terrible as an Army with Banners
The Carpenters - Goodbye To Love
Gladys Knight & The Pips - To Be Invisible
The Nits - Soap Bubble Box
Donny Hathaway - theme from 'Maude'

― Cranberry Pantsuit, Saturday, 12 March 2005 04:26 (twenty-one years ago)

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