What do you new skool drum and bass loathers this of this 'un?

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Klute - Hell Hath No Fury, dubplate.

http://www.bachelorsofscience.com/kluteisdaman.mp3

Luuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuush.

― Cliff =C= (OnoSendai), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 05:29 (twenty years ago)

this = think....err. : /

― Cliff =C= (OnoSendai), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 05:31 (twenty years ago)

i think i can stop hoping for a "hidden rooms vol 4". it'd already been a bit downhill since "hidden rooms vol 2" and "casual bodies" ... then there was his "commercial suicide" album ... i guess he couldn't work up the courage to follow the reinforced guys (nucleus + paradox, sonar circle) towards the logical conclusion of steely + blank breakstep workouts so he opts instead for trying to re-make the nu era album or something (exact same cop-out move that polar did) (i guess maybe teebee blew up doing jump-up/2step hybrid rehash robbed the whole certificate 18 crew of their confidence in experimental d+b jams?)

and now ... reborn as peshay, circa 1995? sorry, but this seems like a retreat.

i'm going to go listen to "silent weapons" and think of what could have been ...

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 06:04 (twenty years ago)

er - i meant his albums on his "commercial suicide" label.

first, there was "lie, cheat & steal" - not such a bad title but would've been better for a big beat album)

then there was the boldly titled "no ones listening" - jeez, what a sucker title. way to out-dork the IDM-dorks. big up the massive!

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 06:08 (twenty years ago)

you need some of this

now, this is the real back to the future ...

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 06:15 (twenty years ago)

"i'm going to go listen to "silent weapons" and think of what could have been ... "

I adore this track! Vahid is that album you've posted the pic of similar?

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 07:14 (twenty years ago)

no, not really. it's much more of a no-u-turn update. acutally, it's like an update of all the tricks on "torque" compilation. it's got spooky samples and death-ray mentasms. it's got these alternating breakbeats w/ lots of space in between (4 bars of chopped amen / pause / 4 bars of chopped think! / pause) that sound like the stomping of infernal walking war machines. it's got the backwards phased drum samples that make you feel like you're being sucked into the mothership ...

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 08:14 (twenty years ago)

That sounds amazing too!

But "Silent Weapons" and stuff like it (Dom & Roland's "Elektra", Teebee's "Black Rain", Source Direct's "Computer State" etc.) is my probably my second favourite type of D&B, and i always wish there was more of it.

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 08:27 (twenty years ago)

You mean Techstep 2.0 basically yeah?

― Sociah T Azzahole (blueski), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 08:50 (twenty years ago)

No, only a very select few tracks meet my description - I think significantly all these tracks emerged only as or after the 2-step beat was taking over, i.e. they indicated a direction for the music whose development was already foreclosed.

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 08:57 (twenty years ago)

If you call blatantly ripping off old Ed + Op (albeit with a far weaker production value) tunes in the '05 then yes, Kryptic Minds are indeed bringing us "back to the future." AMAZING Robo Cop masturbation fantasy tune titles too, definitely NeXT LeVEl,man.

― Cliff =C= (OnoSendai), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 10:50 (twenty years ago)

shit i dont know, i just can't seem to take jungle breaks very seriously these days. i like the rest of the production though, esp the piano.

pppp

― pppp, Wednesday, 24 August 2005 16:25 (twenty years ago)

ok, first of all, when i said "torque", you shouldn't get the idea this is ed rush + optical. i'd say what's exciting about this album (this set of EPs) is that it's taking off from the work trace + nico did for no-u-turn. instead of focusing on those "wormhole" / "virus" basslines over unchanging endless 2step breaks, leon switch + kryptic minds are bringing some serious drum science back into the mix. so NO, i don't think it's a blatant rip-off of ed rush + optical - it's all much more "amtrak" or "mad difft methods" than "to shape the future".

you listen to tracks like "deserts of the real" or "neptune" (robocop? masturbation?) and you've got these wild sections that cut against the momentum of the tracks - "deserts of the real" goes through four false starts, where the breakbeats roll for a second or two and then get filtered and sucked into pure white noise. sure, not every track is as straight-up crazy as those two but even the fairly functional tracks seem to have reversed the reigning logic of techstep - for once, the basslines seem to following the beats (which pull a pretty good trick of holding on to 2step's chopping block functionality while also sounding chopped-to-fuck at times) ... i haven't heard anybody really freak techstep like this since the "enforcers vol 2" era of early sonar circle, alpha omega, etc

the other thing about these guys is there amazing sense of cinematic space - listen to a track like "lost world". the mournful strings + synths, the sound effects, the leagues of reverb on the bassline, it all just open sup these vast empty spaces in my imagination - i'd say what they're doing with production isn't so much following the lead of ed rush + optical (even if their drum programming seems inspired by early no-u-turn) but instead synthesizing the approaches of amon tobin + technical itch.

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 18:13 (twenty years ago)

the thing about that klute track is you could tell people "this is an old rave tape from 1995" and nobody would even bat an eye. they would be like, "what, was this guy behind the ball? still doing logical progression in 95? where's the bass?" ... obv leon switch + kryptic minds are taking their inspiration from a similar era but there is just no way you could confuse their "deserts of the real" or "neptune" w/ 90s (or even last year's) techstep ... i will YSI some tracks, later ...

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 18:20 (twenty years ago)

oh yeah, the other big reference point for leon switch + kryptic minds is DOM & ROLAND.

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 18:21 (twenty years ago)

Please do!

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 18:21 (twenty years ago)

"neptune"
"deserts of the real"
>"lost world"

i dunno. maybe i'm a wee bit over-impressed, or over-excited, because i've always liked dom + roland and technical itch ... my friend kevin put it to me like this when he made me buy tech itch's "diagnostics" in 1998 - he said you gotta listen to it like it's rob hood or jeff mills or something - the beats only change on a minute-to-minute basis, and they intentionally use the most fucked, lopsided, obtuse, uninviting structures - all so that you can let yourself revel in the surface textures of the beats, the thick grains of distortion and so on - they push you away before they suck you in. maybe i'm just excited to find out i can like techstep again.

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 18:31 (twenty years ago)

sorry

"lost world

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 18:32 (twenty years ago)

I misread that as "Desserts of the Real" and I was like GREAT TITLE! D'oh!

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 18:35 (twenty years ago)

Neither Lost World link is working :(

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 18:36 (twenty years ago)

Is Cliff=C= HUNTA-D?

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 19:02 (twenty years ago)

The character of the bass especially reminds me of Panacea's Low Profile Darkness, but without so much distortion on the percussion. And anything that gets close to that sound is, to me, a very good thing.

― Brian Miller (Brian Miller), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 19:06 (twenty years ago)

here let's try again: "lost world"

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 19:38 (twenty years ago)

WTF is wrong with this thing?!?! ok, last try : "lost world"

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 19:40 (twenty years ago)

ta-da

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 19:40 (twenty years ago)

I think "Deserts of the Real" is a great title anyway. I assume they're quoting The Matrix but I'm gonna pretend to myself that it's a Lacanian reference.

Dunno about Diagnostics Vahid. I picked it up recently and I know exactly what you mean wrt the good aspects but it's still pretty oppressive mostly. The first track is good though!

I bang on about this endlessly but I still think Industry struck the perfect balance on this front.

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 20:15 (twenty years ago)

Haha it's the Matrix. It's even sampled in the track.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 20:19 (twenty years ago)

i like the d&r album better than the tech itch album too. less oppressive, more spacey right? i remember the tech itch album having killer drum programming though.

klute's kind of lost me with the past two albums except i liked the second disc of lie, cheat, and steal. this track is good though. i love when he drops the super-melodic stuff.

― tricky (disco stu), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 20:32 (twenty years ago)

thanks for the tunes, vahid! torque is my favorite d&b album = i am all over this shit.

― tricky (disco stu), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 20:37 (twenty years ago)

"deserts of the real" = baudrillard

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 20:45 (twenty years ago)

I just can't comprehend how you can rail on this Klute tune for sounding too old skool whilst praising these dated tech step tunes for sounding fresh. Tech Itch has put out the same damn record for years now. Not saying I don't enjoy them from time to time, but it gets tiring. Although he is engineering the new Goldie album, I wonder how that will turn out.

― Cliff =C= (OnoSendai), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 21:58 (twenty years ago)

And by the way,I'm not HUNTA-D.

On the other hand, I'm also in SF. :)

LOWER HAIGHT MASSIVE BUMBACLAAAAAAATZZ

― Cliff =C= (OnoSendai), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 21:59 (twenty years ago)

ok, cliff! i think it's only fair for you to tell us how this klute tune isn't old skool, especially considering i spent 500 words trying to explain why i think the defcom sound represents a significant and worthwhile update on techstep.

also instead of saying "i just can't comprehend", which makes it seem like you didn't even read what i posted, why don't you tell me exactly which sentences / structures you failed to comprehend.

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 22:02 (twenty years ago)

I think the most significant update on the tech step sound has been the neuro stuff coming out by the likes of Noisia and SPOR. The atmospherics are there, and all the production techniques you listed are used to better effect.

Noisia - The Tide
http://www.breakbeat.is/playfile.m3u?f=1399

SPOR - Back From the Void
http://www.dogsonacid.com/system/play.php/MTc1NF80MTYwNTkxYjY2NjExLm1wMw==.m3u

― Cliff =C= (OnoSendai), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 22:22 (twenty years ago)

ALLOW DIS

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 22:29 (twenty years ago)

seriously, noisia are very good, too. SPOR only has like, six tracks out? seven? so i'm not really making judgements yet.

i still prefer kryptic minds, because, if anything, i generally prefer when people err on the side of "function" rather than on the side of "atmospheres" ... sorta i guess why i slightly prefer nucleus+paradox or sonar circle to the inperspective sound, or why (in general) prefer creative wax to looking good records (though the earliest LGR are un-fuck-withable)

but i'm with you, noisia is great.

― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 22:33 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, SPOR is a new guy, pretty young too.

I saw him play the other week in SF and he dropped some pretty amazing stuff, most of which were his own productions. Wasn't all typical reece-y fodder either, sounds like he samples some live drums.

The new Paradox tunes are nice too,lovin' Twelve Bits. The Amiga never dies, I guess :)

― Cliff =C= (OnoSendai), Wednesday, 24 August 2005 22:43 (twenty years ago)

No so sold on the Klute track (nice tinkly piano bit, but otherwise nothing great--grrr hate those "welcome to the next level" samples and then nothing happens. . . thanks) but I've never been a real fan of his so take it with a grain of salt. Vahid's neo-techstep is pretty good so far. Not sure about the this couldn't have been released 10 years ago comments (whoever named Panacea as the obvious reference was right on--but Panacea kind of stopped making tunes like this after the first album so it's nice to see folks pick up from there), but it's it's done very well (some nice stop/starts, good atmospherics, some real tension here.) I can't tell on the Noisia track as the 64kps thing is really making it sound crappier than I think it's supposed to sound (and I can't get the SPOR track to play.)

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Thursday, 25 August 2005 00:07 (twenty years ago)

one month passes...

first off, i wish there were more threads like this one.
the link to the tune is a great feature.
that said, the song itself doesn't do much for me.
the leon switch tracks, however, are wicked.
the breakdowns in "neptune" are fully METAL. topnotch headbanging jungle.

― m0stly clean (m0stly clean), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 15:19 (twenty years ago)

everyone should buy the welcome to violence comp, btw. i'll probably be stumping for it in my next column.

― strng hlkngtn (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 15:45 (twenty years ago)

Welcome to Violence?

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:23 (twenty years ago)

or Welcome to Violence!

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:26 (twenty years ago)

the former.

― strng hlkngtn (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:33 (twenty years ago)

psyche.

― strng hlkngtn (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:33 (twenty years ago)

warning: if you get nothing out of post-98 dnb, dont bother.

― strng hlkngtn (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:34 (twenty years ago)

Hehe I love that Kaos is involved in both albums (dnb is the new thrash metal!) So is this similar to the stuff Vahid posted above?

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:41 (twenty years ago)

I forgot to ask did you ever get a hold of the Intune Ragga Mix? Did you like it?

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:42 (twenty years ago)

no, something closer to that is the tech freaks comp from earlier this year. (i think leon/kryptic are on it. but so is paradox.) basically it's just torque on roids. welcome to violence has an amazing first half (the depth these guys have on their productions as a matter of course is kind of astounding..."made in two months" more like) and kinda peters into two-step okayness towards the end.

xpost: the thing KK wrote about? i did! it's okay. not much mash-up really, pretty rolling. i'm more happy that it exists as much as anything.

― strng hlkngtn (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:43 (twenty years ago)

Yeah it's good, but it does kind of peters out at the end. Get the Chopstick mix (21 Murda Shots) if you can find it. It's a similar vibe, but generally better stuff. Great vocals.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:46 (twenty years ago)

It's funny how split down the middle nu-ragga-jungle guys are between hyper-fast-amen-mash-up-bizness and rolling-early-dancehall-vibe-stuff. I gotta admit in my old age I am gravitating more towards the later, but I often wonder when I am listening to it who plays this stuff out?

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:48 (twenty years ago)

it's weird because people bitch about kompakt and stuff only "existing on the internet" but the ragga jungle stuff sometimes really does feel like a "scene" that exists only on the net.

― strng hlkngtn (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:50 (twenty years ago)

Haha I wouldn't go that far, all those guys have nights in various cities (Toronto, Montreal, Atlanta) that are at least reasonably successful. But yeah clearly something like ragga-jungle.com has helped turn it from a bunch of little regional scenes to a global underground of a sort.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:54 (twenty years ago)

atlanta, eh?

― strng hlkngtn (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:55 (twenty years ago)

i gotta say the ragga-jungle thing is something i can take or leave most days.

― strng hlkngtn (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:55 (twenty years ago)

i have yet to hear a nu-ragga track (except maybe some of the soundmurderer stuff) that really pips any of the classix.

― strng hlkngtn (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:55 (twenty years ago)

whereas i have heard plenty of leftfield shit from the last few years that totally stands up on its own merits.

― strng hlkngtn (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:56 (twenty years ago)

Eh the more breakcore/mashed up end of it, I'm usually pretty non-plussed about (although there are some really good things on Mashit! and Rewind) but I really like the more rolling live-vocal end of ragga-jungle (even if I can't quite figure out if anyone other than aging junglists like me who are too exhausted to dance to 170BPM choons would ever want to dance to it.) It seems like a totally different animal than 94-96 to me, probably not close to as good, but still interesting in its own way.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 17:01 (twenty years ago)

it IS interesting. i think i can see how there could be a point of intersection between it and the more raggafied mainstream shit of late (shy fx, potential bad boy on ganja, etc.)

― strng hlkngtn (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 17:03 (twenty years ago)

you'd have to pitch the mainstream stuff down a few steps, obv. but they do thank shy and (i think) ray keith in the booklet, so who knows.

― strng hlkngtn (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 17:04 (twenty years ago)

Well we can hope the Intune thing leads to more legit and widely available mixes (with actual ya know tracklistings and shit.) I wish Debaser had curated the Intune one, actually, maybe he'll do a sequel.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 17:10 (twenty years ago)

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