Why are people so down on the second Libertines album?

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Are there 'English" reasons I don't understand? To my ears, this is a pretty great album, i think even better than Up the Bracket and the Babyshambles album. I keep coming back to it, especilly while driving or washing dishes. Anyway, what exactly did people dislike so passionately about this album upon it's release? Was it a case of celebrity eclipsing the actual music, or what? I mean, here in the US, it's not like we can't go anywhere without reading or hearing about Pete Doherty's exploits, so maybe it's an 'enough alreday' kinda thing in merry old England? Cuz like i said, I really like this record. Tell me why I shouldn't.

― Roger, Sunday, 4 December 2005 20:24 (eighteen years ago) link

same reason nobody in america likes fun lovin' criminals...

― CharlieNo4 (Charlie), Sunday, 4 December 2005 20:50 (eighteen years ago) link

ha!

they're both shit.

― Leeroy, Sunday, 4 December 2005 21:36 (eighteen years ago) link

I like the second record, but the songs aren't as great as the Up the Bracket songs. The hooks are less catchy and less original. That bayshambles record, though I've only heard it once, isn't so hot. It misses the Libertines drummer.

― dan. (dan.), Sunday, 4 December 2005 21:42 (eighteen years ago) link

dan what are you talking about, the Babyshambles record is great

― Banana Nutrament (ghostface), Sunday, 4 December 2005 22:12 (eighteen years ago) link

I love the second album. The middle stretch is a shambles, but an attracive shambles (babyshambles?). "Can't Stand Me Now" and "What Became of the Likely Lads?" would be masterpieces by, ummm, the Futureheads.

I reviewed it here: http://www.stylusmagazine.com/review.php?ID=2307

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Sunday, 4 December 2005 22:22 (eighteen years ago) link

I agree. The second album is pretty great.

― bkjj40a (bkjj40a), Sunday, 4 December 2005 22:52 (eighteen years ago) link

"I no longer hear the music" is ironic, thesedays.

― mark grout (mark grout), Monday, 5 December 2005 09:14 (eighteen years ago) link

Why dont oeple liklr yje soemd Libetyomes alnum>>>>I yjimk bnevcaise oeopkle ate SYUOID and a bunch oif atsehiles!!@ Seriouskly,m UI amn rge feeatest artitt ever abd gus us the secoind0gretest akbum bever even uif U ghad ti carry Gay Katrk.

Aksdoim that butch Jatre can gi aeay abnd bnecer cine acj, Igm U nuss ger, Has abnytine git any craxk?

― Pete Doherty, Monday, 5 December 2005 09:39 (eighteen years ago) link

(Hey, even Pete doesn't like the 2nd Libertines album) IRL.

― mark grout (mark grout), Monday, 5 December 2005 10:01 (eighteen years ago) link

Occasionally, I like a Big Mac. But if people were constantly telling me the Big Mac was the most exciting taste sensation in the World, and then I tried one, and it was just a Big Mac, I'd be pretty fucking disappointed.

― Amity Wong (noodle vague), Monday, 5 December 2005 10:06 (eighteen years ago) link

No I can't understand it either. There may be some purists who unfavourably compare Music When The Lights Go Out to the superior Legs 11 demo, or miss the swagger and the joy of Up the Bracket, or wish it had included All at Sea or Never Never...but but but.. this album is a thing of rare beauty. The cover alone is fabulous. The last great British band who'll make you laugh and cry all in one sitting. What the public have got against the Libs is purely down to Pete's new-found celebrity because WE ALL HATE CELEBS.. They are all so desperate to vote him out of the house of fame, they cannot hear the poetry of his words or the web of sound he spins.

― Dr X O'Skeleton, Monday, 5 December 2005 10:30 (eighteen years ago) link

See this is what I'm talking about.

― Amity Wong (noodle vague), Monday, 5 December 2005 10:33 (eighteen years ago) link

What the public have got against the Libs is purely down to Pete's new-found celebrity because WE ALL HATE CELEBS..

no we don't we hate celebs who are celebs for entirely spurious and dull reasons like going out with a "super" model or taking crack cocaine. there is ABSOLUTELY NO WAY any red-top (or any other publication other than Dis/NME) would give a shit about Doherty, were it not for the above.

england's most famous musician can't play, write or perform music. what a pathetic situation.

― CharlieNo4 (Charlie), Monday, 5 December 2005 10:36 (eighteen years ago) link

If you've lost your faith in love and music the end won't be long, chum

― Dr X O'Skeleton, Monday, 5 December 2005 10:38 (eighteen years ago) link

you're right of course. i don't even listen to music anymore, just the clicking of crickets.

i'm not here to play mybandsbetterthanyourband, "chum". but i'd genuinely like to hear any libertines/babyshambles fan argue successfully against my point, above.

look at drug-fuelled musicians throughout pop history: from Hendrix and the Beatles to Dylan, VU and Bowie, from the Mondays/Roses to...well, even to Primal Scream and Spiritualized...there's a huge, huge world of difference between these folks, and Doherty.

― CharlieNo4 (Charlie), Monday, 5 December 2005 10:46 (eighteen years ago) link

what exactly?

― Dr X O'Skeleton, Monday, 5 December 2005 10:48 (eighteen years ago) link

-- Amity Wong (noodle_vagu...), December 5th, 2005.

substitute "rancid hardy's french fries" for "big mac" and then you'll have a more accurate metaphor.

― latebloomer: The Corridor (Yes, The Corridor) (latebloomer), Monday, 5 December 2005 10:50 (eighteen years ago) link

Plenty of fast food metaphors, presumably from people who wouldn't recognise decent food if it hit them on the head

― Dr X O'Skeleton, Monday, 5 December 2005 10:53 (eighteen years ago) link

What's interesting to me, Dr O'Skeleton, presuming you're not taking the piss, is that you use the same rhetoric to defend the Libs that the NME does. And it notably doesn't engage with what they actually sound like. Metaphors aside, their a reasonably good band doing nothing of note in a not-very-interesting genre. With a couple of near-great singles, maybe. It's this gap between my perception and the florid but unspecific praise - "the last great British band"? please - that generates the hatred.

― Amity Wong (noodle vague), Monday, 5 December 2005 10:59 (eighteen years ago) link

Metaphors aside, their a reasonably good band doing nothing of note in a not-very-interesting genre. With a couple of near-great singles, maybe.

And there we have it.

Craig, are you going to defend Babyshambles too?

― CharlieNo4 (Charlie), Monday, 5 December 2005 11:03 (eighteen years ago) link

OK, fair enough. Don't read the Enemy and don't usually have any enthusiasm for those it hypes. It's the Libs sound that I love, a messy, rowdy punk revival with a deeply melodic undertow. Who but Doherty writes pop songs with augmented chords? Who else writes such quotable lyrics, morrisey and jarvis aside? Who else actually sounds like they mean it, maan?

― Dr X O'Skeleton, Monday, 5 December 2005 11:10 (eighteen years ago) link

I thought Pete had lost it with the Babyshambles singles, but was proved wrong when I heard the album - they just make more sense in that format. There'll probably never be another band like the Libertines, but I'll happily defend Babyshambles.

― Dr X O'Skeleton, Monday, 5 December 2005 11:13 (eighteen years ago) link

Down on the album? It seemed to get a pretty easy ride as I recall.

As for people critical of the record, I always thought it was because of the weak songwriting and half-finished feel of the album. A lot of strumming and mumbling. They seem to have left the hooks and the passion back on Up the Bracket.

― Swamp Thing (Swamp Thing), Monday, 5 December 2005 15:10 (eighteen years ago) link

Metaphors aside, their a reasonably good band doing nothing of note in a not-very-interesting genre. With a couple of near-great singles, maybe. It's this gap between my perception and the florid but unspecific praise - "the last great British band"? please - that generates the hatred.

-- Amity Wong

1000% OTM

― fandango (fandango), Monday, 5 December 2005 15:19 (eighteen years ago) link

thirteen years pass...

Trapped in a pub where this utter shite is being played.

― Freddie Starr (Hitler in shorts) (Tom D.), Monday, 22 April 2019 18:02 (five years ago) link

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