Latest Best Buy mailer:http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?type=category&id=pcmcat81900050045
From:http://sakistore.blogspot.com/
Pick one:
1. A bad dream that returns every time you close your eyes, no matter how many pages of your book you read in the middle of the night to try and shake it from your mind.
2. A portrayal of the myth of Sisyphus, doomed for eternity to roll his boulder to the pinnacle of a mountain with great exertion only to have it roll back down into the valley so he could begin again. Forever.
3. Real life karma in action, actually visible to the naked eye, where past acts affect future lives and where sins are punished into eternity until a lesson is learned from them enabling you to move on.
4. A manifestation of Martin Luther King, Jr's quotation about the Arc of Justice. "The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice."- Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.
We have been here before, and it was awful. In the 90's, labels hungry for sales (and who isn't?) rushed into deals with Best Buy, and other big box chains now since defunct, that allowed Best Buy to sell below cost with a minimum amount of pain, if any, and then make money off the folks lured into the store on their toasters and TV sets (now iPods and Xbox). Soon, indie stores all over America started going belly up. Pier Platters. Go!. Final Frontier. Rockaway. On and on and on. Remember, this was when file sharing still consisted of a chrome C90 without the holes punched.
After freeing much of America of their indie retailers, the accountants for Best Buy and the others realized the age old maxim, you can't make up for a negative margin with volume. Their margin was hurt even more when the returns started piling up. Millions of dollars of returns. Why? Because of their size, they were and are unable to pick and choose what might sell at their stores. They have no in-store culture to support indie music sales in knowledgeable floor staff, in-stores, magazines, a comfy couch, upcoming show listings, or a cool kid behind the counter to play the new stuff and talk with customers not only about what's new that week, but what's coming out next month and recommend that cool record by the Slits you might really dig if you like Bloc Party. You like Antony? Check Jeff Buckley or Van Morrison or Current 93's "Earth Covers Earth." At Best Buy, the single most frequent employee comment is "When's my next break?".
The combination of poor buying in huge quantities and their lack of ability to sell through eventually lead to so many returns that Best Buy stopped carrying indie music almost entirely. The huge racks at Best Buy that had housed music were suddenly empty, and then shortly they were gone, slowly to be replaced over the next few years by discounted DVDs and video games.
In the wake of this prolonged disaster lay cities all over the country without record stores, labels either driven to bankruptcy or crippled for years by 50+% returns on titles for which bands were already paid and saddled with enormous pressing plant bills, and a public who had finally realized that maybe music wasn't worth what it always had seemed. Maybe $16.98 was too much for a CD. Maybe $8 was the right price. That's what the labels and their complicit artists were telling them. And this dent in the collective music consciousness came at the dawn of broadband internet service and file sharing. If it wasn't worth $16, maybe it wasn't even worth $8. Maybe free was the way to go. If the stores, labels, and bands don't value their music enough to sell it at a decent price, why should the music fan feel any differently about it? So the whole industry had unwittingly conspired over three to four years to torch the value of an album at just the right time for the Best Buy shell game/Ponzi scheme to collapse in on itself, leaving an opening for Napster to tap the wired music junkie on the shoulder and take advantage.
Fast forward through rampant unchecked file sharing/piracy, MAP, oops! not MAP that's illegal, RIAA lawsuits against music fans, the boom of iTunes and Spitzer investigations of price fixing.
Why are we going back there again? Voluntarily even? Why are labels AGAIN selling to Best Buy at rock bottom prices and then buying into coop programs (billable back to the Artist of course) that allow Best Buy to break even selling their cds so cheaply-not only below retail cost, BUT BELOW DISTRIBUTOR WHOLESALE COST? At prices even below the album price on iTunes and others! So now you're all devaluing not only your packaged goods but your digital ones as well. If it's worth only $7.99 with package at Best Buy, why is it worth $9.90 at iTunes? Consumer answer: IT'S NOT.
When a distributor can buy your stuff with tax at Best Buy cheaper than from you directly, something is wrong. Very wrong.
And even better, I have heard that Best Buy is not only planning on targeting 10-20 of the hippest titles, but greatly expanding their indie offerings. That's great! They've set this up for a complete repeat of the mid-late 90's. Drive the final nail in the coffins of the remaining independent retailers, at least those savvy enough to have staggered through the first round and survived unlike their bankrupt counterparts across the country. Mortally wound the labels and their thin margin distributors with staggeringly high return rates a year or two or three down the road. Leave the bands without stores, labels or distributors to support them. And then, finally, when the bean counters with the short memories at Corporate figure out that it's not working for Best Buy, again, they slash their music sections back to a Top 40 and go back to ignoring it. Except this go round, it is entirely possible that there will not be enough of an independent music industry remaining to survive and bounce back. What's left? A rush to cash in on high volume for a few frontline hip titles leads to the elimination of the entire culture that nurtured the baby bands to the point where anybody even paid attention to them in the first place. Where they were suddenly cool enough to move out of the zines and blogs to get featured on the OC or VW commercial or the latest Farrelly Brothers movie, and then get big enough where it actually seemed to make sense to somebody that this might really sell at Best Buy. Cash in now and simultaneously salt the fertile earth that allowed it to happen in the first place, killing any chance of it happening again.
Worst case scenario? Fear mongering? Maybe. Except probably not. Because WE'VE ALREADY BEEN HERE. Sisyphus HAS rolled this rock up this very same god damned hill. Unlike Sisyphus, however, we are not doomed to hell for eternity to feed the Best Buy monster that will eventually eat us. We have choices. And we have history, RECENT history, from which to learn if we will only heed it.
And here is the saddest thing to me. Everybody in management at Touch and Go, Caroline, Secretly Canadian, even Matador, and yes Best Buy, has been at this long enough to know better. The difference is that Best Buy doesn't care. It doesn't have to. It will be around in 10 years selling, uh, whatever, HD HUDs for wireless iPod video and other consumer electronics, and if this unsavory practice continues, you and we will not be. And I guarantee you that if they even notice, nobody at Best Buy will care.
"He gives the American people the finger and barks out: 'I got mine, fuck you! Every crumb for himself.'"-William S. Burroughs "The Western Lands"
In the meantime, I'll head by Best Buy Stores #323 and #814, (aren't those great names!) on the way home tonight so I can buy their stock on titles we carry, give the kids who come in an empty shelf to look at hopefully driving them to an indie store and putting them off from the hassle of returning for future sales, sell them where we can and then return them to you at a profit.
Thanks for a great Tuesday. Thanks for your foresight. Your check's in the mail.
Patrick Monaghan, PresidentCTD, Ltd./Carrot Top Records, Inc.
FOLLOW-UP POST:Wednesday, January 25, 2006Can I Go Home Now?
Wow. What a weird day. Heartening in many aspects, a bummer in others, and pretty overwhelming on all fronts.
Thanks to everybody who has flooded the Inbox here. I'll get back to all of you as soon as I am able but rest assured that you have been heard.
Thanks to Mac (and Paul for the email and phone call) at Merge, Nick (and Ben and Paul for the emails) at Secretly Canadian, Windy from Stormy, and everybody else for writing well thought out and reasoned responses to all of this and posting their comments here. If you have not read their thoughts, please do so on the comments links below and please feel free to leave your thoughts as well. I've finally got it set up so you can do that. Sorry if you tried earlier and it didn't work.
I think that our point of view on this was made pretty well in my initial letter/post, but there are a couple of points I'd like to try to clear up.
First, nowhere in our letter do we accuse anybody of selling to Best Buy directly at a lower price. What is happening, and perhaps many people didn't understand the mechanism here, is that coop dollars are being used by a gigantor retailer to offset their loss when a piece is sold below cost. Tons of stores do coops. In fact, many are partially kept afloat by the extra dollars that coop dollars bring in. In exchange for cash or free cd's ("cleans"), retailers promise "Price and Position" to labels. Releases are featured at end caps or other high visibility parts of the store, titles are usually put on sale for the time of the deal, and a picture and of the record and sometimes a blurb runs in the paper. Sometimes a listening post is included for customers. 90% of those listening posts are bought, not put there by the grace of the store owner. Usually (but not always), the bigger the store, the more this is true. There's your lesson on the Coop Monster.
I have not seen the text of the deal with Best Buy. Our titles do not sell well enough to appear on their radar. However, these sorts of deals are pretty standard around the industry with a little variation. The difference in this instance is that by now, everybody knows or should know that Best Buy does not use their coop dollars in the manner that most other stores do. They are (in)famous for predatory practices and lowballing titles, and in this instance, they really lowballed. So even without selling to Best Buy at a lower price than everyone, what has essentially happened with the coop is that a large bucket of money was put in the corner that nominally had nothing to do with the pricing of the record on the invoice from ADA or RED or whoever. But for anybody in the chain of action (from artist to label to distributor) to claim surprise when that weird bucket of cash that just happens to be sitting in the corner is used by infamous lowballer Best Buy to offset their losses on selling it below wholesale cost, well, it seems a bit disingenuous to us here. Forgive our cynicism on that point, but we're from Chicago where the City That Works feeds itself on mysteriously appearing, large buckets of cash. But here only the Mayor can pretend he didn't know what it was for. (I'm shocked. Shocked!!) In the instance of the Best Buy coop, it may not be ruled illegal under US law, but that does not mean it is not wrong.
It also seems somehow to have been inferred that I was suggesting that selling these titles at Best Buy for $7.99 for one week was somehow going to kill the music industry and put every indie retailer out of business, perhaps by this Sunday. I didn't and obviously it will not. The first round of the Best Buy Merry-Go-Round (pre-MAP), happened over the course of about 3-4 years in the mid-90's. It didn't happen in one week, or one month, or even in one year. But over the course of their spree of lowballing titles and stocking large amounts of indie music, the momentum grew. Stores started dropping. Millions of dollars of returns started happening from Best Buy. You may be able to debate the direct causation of indie store closures to Best Buy pricing, but the correlation is there. What you cannot debate is the hit that every label and distributor who put titles into Best Buy's expanded music section took when the stuff just didn't sell. Pick a reason for it not selling. But it didn't. And it came back. And it hurt. A lot. And payment terms were extended and then extended again. And people went away. Labels went away. Distributors went away. (Remember Feedback? Say what you want about their management team, but their biggest customer was Best Buy and they got pounded into the ground...with the music publishers putting in the final dagger.) And now I hear that after 5 years Best Buy is again "committing to music" and expanding their music section. Great.
Labels and distributors may not tell retailers what prices they can set for their artists' work, but they can choose to play or not play the coop game with them on a case by case basis, based upon all the available information that they can muster and the short and long term ramifications of their behavior. And while labels may not be abandoning indie retailers, they can kill them just the same. Giving them water while you salt their ground will still kill them no matter how much water you pour on their poisoned earth. At some point you're wasting your water. And all that will be left is the Label and the Gigantor. Then try and grow your little bands.
So the whole point of this exercise for us is to raise some consciousness on this issue, perhaps with a spur from somebody who has been there before, has seen and felt the pain, and fears for the good of the industry that we've all helped build, big distributor down to 16 year old intern paid in records. Tons of people before us have busted tail for no money so people could hear music that wasn't filtered by the major labels and their work has led directly, for better or worse, to what we have today. And dysfunctional and dazed thought the system may be, it still mostly works. And some of those people, people who I have admired from the moment I became aware of them, are a part of this mess with Best Buy. When we started CTD, one of our rules was to always examine what the people at Revolver, Mordam, and Touch and Go were doing. We did not commit ourselves to emulating them, but rather to a constant course of study and questioning of their actions and the reasons for them because they were run by people of wisdom and experience, people with their values in the right place who still managed to succeed in an otherwise abysmal hell hole of an industry. In our early years, we said over and over "If Touch and Go (or Mordam or Revolver) is doing something, then we'd better damned well know why and then decide if we should follow suit or not." And if we chose to go a different way on something, then it would not be in ignorance, but in understanding, followed by making as educated a decision as our pea brains were/are capable of making.
It pains me, pains me, to be spending my time and energy on this, questioning people for whom I have serious doubt that I could hold in any higher esteem. Some of the players in this I can mentally write off as long ago Lost Causes, succumbing to the natural way of things and growing to a point where they are beholden to others to an extent I can only imagine. Several here are not Lost, not even close, but their behavior is nearing that of the Lost. My hope is that this will at least stir some discussion in indiedom on all levels. Of course labels will still do what they will do, but at least it will not be in ignorance, their own or anyone else's, but in plain view. And others can take actions based upon those decisions that are plain to see for everyone. And perhaps, not probably, but perhaps by dragging this ugly step child out from under the stairs, the basis for future decisions for large labels and distributors will change as the ramifications of their actions are taken into account, if for not other reason that for good old self-interest. And no one can say that they didn't know. That they weren't warned.
I've been called the Greek Chorus before, frequently not in a nice way, but in Greek tragedy the Chorus is usually ignored at the protagonist's great peril.
I'm pretty sure I'm right on the present situation, but I sure as hell hope I'm wrong about the future. You know people will ignore the warning sign that you place beside the cliff, but you put it there anyway, just in case somebody looks up and pays attention. And is not Lost.
On a more minor point, I really hope nobody seriously thought I was comparing any of us, or this mess, to MLK or the Civil Rights Movement just because I quoted him. I was no more doing that than I was comparing anybody to William Burroughs just because I quoted him as well, though a good game of William Tell does ring pretty close to our situation here, doesn't it? The point that MLK was making, as I interpret it, was one that I see as parallel to something like karma. That the arc of the universe bends toward the good, toward justice, very slowly, over time. I fear which side of this arc that we are on with this whole mess. That's all.
Metaphors for sale cheap. Below cost even!
Patrick
― hervey kurtzweiler (hervey kurtzweiler), Thursday, 26 January 2006 17:29 (twenty years ago)
hey someone asked about this stuff over at the Merge msg boards, so i figured if i went to the trouble of writing this whole thing i might as well put it here too! thanks mac:
good to know this was posted on a blog -- we thought it was just a personal email that only Merge received...
this is certainly a valid issue to discuss, there are many sides to it and i'd say it's safe to say we're torn about stuff like this.
obviously merge's job is to get our artists' records in as many stores as possible and make them available to as many people as possible who want to buy them.
i think it's also obvious that Merge is a supporter of independent retail & distribution, we spend money (in fact the majority of our retail promotional spending) with them advertising & promoting our records (contrary to popular belief, it's not free to get your records in those racks at the front of the store) as well. while here in NC we're lucky to still have some great independent stores, we know that many smaller stores around the country have closed. i don't think you can lay those closures solely at the feet of best buy, but certainly the 'big box' chains have had an impact on smaller retail, as has The Internet, video games & dvds, gentrification & the corollary rise in the price of real estate....
so as i say, our job is to get our cds into as many stores as possible, and this means chains as well as the independents. why punish some kid who lives in Yakima where the only place he can find the Arcade Fire cd is at a Target? don't make it available to the kid at all? do i appreciate Target giving huge sums of money to the GOP? no. do i prefer to shop at a small local store? yes. not everyone has the option, or the politics neccessarily, to do what Patrick at Carrot Top deems "the right thing."
as for this case in particular, Best Buy purchases the Arcade Fire cd from the distributor ADA at the SAME price any other retailer does. Labels and retail (i learned today) are not even legally allowed to discuss pricing, so Best Buy pricing those cds at $7.99 was completely their choice to lose money on those cds in order to get people in to buy a dvd player or whatever.
when i say i'm torn it's because $7.99 is a ridiculous price that no independent retailer can match, and i think it DOES devalue cds to a certain extent (eg someone walks into a store and sees a cd for an avg $14.99 and thinks "man i've seen cds for $7.99! $14.99 is a rip-off! i'm just going to download it..."). but i do not agree that best buy putting an Arcade Fire cd on sale for a week is bringing down the indie infrastructure.
our retail person here thinks that because Best Buy doesn't stock 90% of what Merge puts out, including back catalog by the same artists they DO carry (spoon might be a good example) that someone who discovers an artist because the "popular" record is on sale at best buy, will then hopefully be driven to find out more about that band and look for the back catalog that they will have to get at a store that mainly sells music.
i also think that the rhetoric of the thing and the talk of "betrayal" is a bit over the top... why would we "cut off" a distributor we've worked with for years who does a good job, just because someone expressed their personal views about a real issue? and is he really comparing indie retail to MLK Jr?
has he not found that quite often at indie stores the hipster clerk is an unhelpful cooler-than-thou jerk? where does he think Merge was in the mid-90's he ruefully remembers? signing bands like Lucy's Fur Coat and "doing deals" with Best Buy? no, we were doing what we're doing now, only hopefully now we do it more effectively for everyone involved.
to imply that we've abandoned independent retail & distribution (why would we do that?) is not accurate. but running any kind of business (unless you truly are just out for a buck and yrself alone) is a minefield of dilemmas like this -- that's what capitalism creates -- tensions between artist/consumer/business that are not always easily squared.
learning through humiliation? that's no fun. no, learning through 17 years of having a record label and having to navigate this stuff.
again there are so many angles and curves to this issue, i'm sure i have barely scratched the surface here, but since you asked...
thanksmacmerge records
---
Here is a letter which I sent to all of the retailers and distros on our mailing list. I offer it for consideration here as well...
Hello retail and distributor friends,
Earlier this month SC Distribution authorized, with Secretly Canadian's blessing, participation in a Best Buy ad mailer which is currently running. Perhaps due to some naivete, we did not perceive the program as potentially controversial. After looking at things much more closely, thanks in part to the many emails we have received concerning this, we realize that we may have erred, and that, at a minimum, we should tread more carefully in the future. Though unfortunately, much of the negative response that has reached us is largely predicated on assumptions and/or misinformation (understandable as they may be). I am writing in an attempt to foster an open dialogue.
The program which we approved involved Antony and the Johnsons "I am a Bird Now" (Secretly Canadian, SC105). Best Buy approached us about this title, as they were seeking to focus on "Artists out of the Mainstream" (their words, not ours). The album was included in Best Buy's weekly print circular which was distributed in newspapers nationwide on 1/22/06. It also received special positioning with sale pricing for one week in Best Buy stores. On the surface of things, this seemed like most any marketing program that we would do with any indie mom and pop store (as that's where the majority of our marketing dollars go), just on a bigger scale. Here is a link to Best Buy's website featuring the "special offer" - http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?type=category&id=pcmcat81900050045
Now as soon as you look at that link, the first thing that screams out is that Best Buy is selling the participating titles for $7.99 in stores (for the one week of the program). Alarming to us and to many folks who have written us is the fact that this price on Best Buy shelves is cheaper than the price that retailers and other distributors receive by ordering the title from SC Distribution direct. To say that this was a shock to us is an understatement.
Many people who have written us have assumed that we allowed Best Buy to receive a discount so as to lower their price point. Simply this is not true. Best Buy did NOT receive a discount for this title. Before approving the program we specifically confirmed with ADA (our exclusive distributor) that Best Buy would not receive any sort of discount. In fact the price that Best Buy paid is the same price that any other store or chain would pay for our titles via ADA. Not to mention, the price that indie stores and distributors pay to order from SC Distribution directly is significantly CHEAPER than the price that Best Buy paid. We know that we can't dictate or control the end price in stores (as this is deemed in legal-legal land as price-fixing or something of that nature).
We sincerely feel just as blind-sided by this as many of you probably do. We had always heard theoretically how big stores, like the Walmarts, Circuit Cities and Best Buys of the world, often sell items like CDs at a loss in order to attract other business. And this, no doubt, puts unfair competitive pressures on the smaller record stores who have, to date, been our closest allies. Some of the responses we have received have said that we "should have known better." This is the first marketing program that we have ever done with Best Buy which included sale pricing. It's not always easy to admit naivete, but I'm not sure if we did know better. Now we do.
But, truly, this experience has now brought this reality even closer to home to us and has caused us to open our eyes further. That we were not more conscientious to begin with is regrettable. And that we unwittingly participated in this kind of scheme is highly regrettable. Independent retailers and distributors are our base. We have not forgotten that. Every indie store we work with in Chicago is more important to us than Best Buy Stores #323 and #814. Here in Bloomington, I shop at Tracks and TDs CDs and LPs, not Best Buy.
As I'm sure many of you have noticed, we have had a great year. With quick growth, there are growing pains. With new opportunities and decisions to be made, there are learning experiences. We are discussing how else we may want to respond to all this. A few of our staff are in France for the MIDEM conference. Once they return, we may have more for you.
Also, I encourage you to read the full comments that Mac from Merge posted here. He made a number of good points that don't require an echo from me. I encourage anyone with questions or concerns to contact me.
Best,Nick Blandford (Secretly Canadian)
Linky
― Brian O'Neill (NYCNative), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:58 (twenty years ago)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:09 (twenty years ago)
― dan (dan), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:18 (twenty years ago)
1) Visit Best buy with Amex.2) Buy everything.3) Stock indie store with it.
Since our costs for those discs are more than $7.99, we make money (even if we have to return them). The labels get to get their discs Soundscanned TWICE (for the ones we sell; in fact, the ones we sell are weighted since we're an indie so they get credit for more than two scans per actual unit) and the only loser is Best Buy because we're going in there specifically NOT to buy a washer-dryer.
In fact, my idea is so damn good, it's probably illegal...
― Brian O'Neill (NYCNative), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:33 (twenty years ago)
Best Buy - Cheap ass cds - but is there a catch?
― team jaxon (jaxon), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:51 (twenty years ago)
― Brian O'Neill (NYCNative), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:55 (twenty years ago)
i kinda like the idea of people stocking their stores with best buy titles.
patrick at carrot top is a really great guy in my experience, just sort of intense about things like this i guess...
― Michael J McGonigal (mike mcgonigal), Thursday, 26 January 2006 22:01 (twenty years ago)
― adam (adam), Thursday, 26 January 2006 22:36 (twenty years ago)
And some of this whining is a little funny— I don't think that the Anthony and the Johnsons album is worth $16.99. I think very few albums are. $6? Maybe. I pay between $8 and $10 for cds at shows, and that usually seems like a good price (in addition to helping bands pay for gas).
Oh, and Best Buy doesn't allow returns on CDs (unless he's talking about unsold albums).
Adam: From working at a video store that got in trouble for that once, that's illegal. You're supposed to pay an inflated price for the movie because it covers the rental license too. Illegal, but not immoral.
― js (honestengine), Thursday, 26 January 2006 22:39 (twenty years ago)
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Friday, 27 January 2006 05:51 (twenty years ago)
It's weird but probably noble that people get worked up about this sort of thing, given that every chain store you walk into works this way. Bookstores have these systems locked up like crazy. And when you stop at the grocery store to get toothpaste, and the Colgate is right at eye level, with a slip-out coupon machine attached to the rack? There are reasons for that.
― nabisco (nabisco), Friday, 27 January 2006 06:24 (twenty years ago)
― nabisco (nabisco), Friday, 27 January 2006 06:30 (twenty years ago)
We get paid to put records in Endcaps and to sale price them (P&P; Pricing & Positioning). Also, a co-op will have the label paying for advertising that benefits the store and the label (i.e. radio spots that tag a retailer when an artist is in town or to promote an in-store). Retailers are even paid to put up posters and displays.
Some co-ops don't involve money, such as when a label will give free 7" singles or tee-shirts to give away with the purchase of a CD.
Some co-ops have the money go directly into the retailers wallets (Endcaps) whereas others have the money going to a place that advertises the retailer (radio, press). In my store, I try and do co-ops that do both.
The catch to a co-op is that the retailer has to reciprocate by ordering more units than they usually would. For example, when my store does an Endcap, we will bring in a box of CDs - 30 pieces. For a single store in a medium market, that's a lot. Also, if a label wants a store to stock their new baby band, a great way to get them to give the band a chance is to throw a co-op at them - even something small like a Listening Post will get a store with limited space to stock your new band even if it doesn't have anything else going on in the market.
Obviously you get what you pay for - a co-op with a single mom & pop will cost a lot less but also give you a lot less of a push than the Best buy circular.
If you want to set up a larger program with a lot of indie stores, there are coalitions of independent stores - CIMS and AIMS are two of the main ones. You can get into Listening Posts in all of the CIMS stores, for example.
Speaking of the coalitions, as a way to combat the trend of big national retailers and coffeehouses getting exclusive product, CIMS has started a distro called Junket Boy. (You might need a password to access that site.) Indie retailers have had exclusives from the likes of Queens Of The Stone Age or they are able to get imports at cheap prices (like the Interpol "Evil" CD single that we sold for only a few bucks). Junket Boy distributed Clap Your Hands Say Yeah before the majors came along as well so it's also being used for emerging artists as well as cool things from bands who are established at the Mom & Pop level.
― Brian O'Neill (NYCNative), Friday, 27 January 2006 06:34 (twenty years ago)
― dan (dan), Friday, 27 January 2006 06:38 (twenty years ago)
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Friday, 27 January 2006 07:06 (twenty years ago)
Something I've always wondered, while we're here, is if indie labels take the same bite for packaging that majors do, and if indie labels toss in the CD tax (an extra four dollars off the price at which royalties begin to be calculated, instituted at the beginning of CDs as a format and never removed) the way that majors do. I know that artists still see less of a dollar spent on a CD than on a tape, though I can't think of anyone really marketting tapes outside of truckstops anymore.
― js (honestengine), Friday, 27 January 2006 07:18 (twenty years ago)
NB the best way of characterizing this stuff isn't really as any sort of insidious collusion or scamming or anything. It's mostly just that there's a whole separate economy of how stuff gets into the stores, and where it goes, even before you reach the economy of what people are actually buying -- so of course everyone involved is going to market and muscle-flex and take any advantage they can. And of course the horrible side effect of this will be that smaller entities like little indies and mom-and-pop stores just don't have the power to get a foothold in that economy.
― nabisco (nabisco), Friday, 27 January 2006 08:43 (twenty years ago)
As in Mac's example, I was one of those kids who bought his first Superchunk CD at a Best Buy out of necessity. Obviously I make a majority of my music purchases at School Kids Records or CD Alley or Static Blue or Harvest Records etc. (NC) because those places will always be more rewarding to everyone involved (artist, label, distributor?, store, myself) than buying at Best Buy or online, despite the culture of superiority it perpetuates.
― earinfections (Nick Twisp), Friday, 27 January 2006 15:20 (twenty years ago)
― /////////////, Friday, 27 January 2006 18:56 (twenty years ago)
Not to my knowledge. They will often run sales that simply give you a percentage - anywhere from 5-40% - off the regular price of catalog releases. This is either a full catalog sale or they will highlight certain labels or tie in with certain new releases (EMI did a deal with Coldplay and Gorillaz back catalog when they both had new discs last year, for example.)
Sometimes they are tied in with an obligation on the part of the retailer to sale price/position the product for a certain length of time, other times there are no stipulations. When they do this there are usually no co-op funds (i.e. cash for the store).
As an incentive to buy newly released product, most distro offer new release discounts - 3-10% off the regular price. To entice retailers to buy more product, there is usually a surcharge added on for loose pick - anywhere from 20-40¢ per disc - of you buy less than a box (usually 30, sometimes less).
― Brian O'Neill (NYCNative), Friday, 27 January 2006 20:40 (twenty years ago)