CROOKED RAIN CROOKED POLL

"fillmore jive" rules and is a perfect closer, feels unusually 'epic' for them. the real dud on this album is "hit the plane down"

watery, domestic is a perfect ep and the best thing they ever released

otm across the board ^

if i had to take one disc to the desert island with me, though, it'd be one of the first three full-lengths

the real dud on this album is "hit the plane down"

otm. although it does make the arrival of fillmore jive even more welcome

Fillmore Jive is wonderful, Hit The Plane Down is OK.

Is controps still a thing around here? I've never really liked Cut Your Hair. Does that count?

watery, domestic is a perfect ep and the best thing they ever released

Frontwards might be SM's greatest achievement.

See, those are the takes I'm talking about! (I respect them, of course, I just don't share them...)

Watery, Domestic is the core, the heart music of Pavement.

Tt has its share of duds but the highs are high enough to counterbalance them. Is thinking carrot rope is one of the best things pavement did a controversial opinion? My head says it's dumb idea, but my heart can't help but love that silly little ditty.

Agree that Filmore Jive is wonderful and Hit The Plane Down is the one to drop

i wouldn't say "carrot rope" is top tier but it's very good, second best on terror twilight after "spit on a stranger"

I don't really get early Pavement. I listen to Westing and Slanted a fair bit hoping they'll click, and, well they're hard to listen to sonically, the songs aren't really there, and I just don't love the music until CRCR much as I'd like to

Carrot Rope is brilliant.
The Hexx is one of the best things they've ever done.
Major Leagues is genuinely affecting.
Folk Jam is superb. You Are A Light is perfect...
There's very little I don't like about Terror Twilight and if there are any low points I rarely notice them because they're nicely hammocked by high quality stuff

man if you don't dig "Box Elder" or "Perfect Depth" or "Debris Slide" idk what to tell ya, I think those are the height of lofi genius and great songs to boot

(I fully accept that this is a place/time thing, I was one degree removed from them in college growing up in Cville)

sorry *post-college in Indiana AFTER growing up in Cville*

Yeah, might be a time/place thing. I get that stuff like Debris Slide and Forklift are fun tunes of course, but it mostly sounds like a garage band jamming around (which I get is the point because, well, that's what it is). I suppose I just find the sound quality hard to enjoy, and nit really what I cone to this band for

Fillmore Jive is incredible, what's wrong with you people

the hiss and noise is my favorite thing about early Pavement!

well, that's what it is

but that's not what it is! these are fully formed songs cloaked under a layer of hiss and treble and evasion

xxp I think the problem is it’s all too “credible”… It sounds like a band trying to do an “epic jam” without a strong idea of what to do musically (…compare with “Half a Canyon,” on the next album, where they totally nailed it IMO).

… on another level, though, there’s just a subjective question of how certain songs “hit” musically. And most the songs after “Gold Soundz” on Side 2 not only don’t hit for me (“Heaven Is a Truck” is OK), I can’t skip fast enough when, say, “Range Life” comes on. Especially after the glories of Side 1, it’s like – “How could they think this was on the same level??”

“Fillmore Jive” isn’t quite that bad, but it substitutes sloppiness for inspiration. Pavement could be very loose, but weren’t really “sloppy”… it just wasn’t one of their attributes, and they couldn’t spin that straw into gold.

I can’t skip fast enough when, say, “Range Life” comes on

are you freakin kidding me with this omg

best song on the album

may need a deeper explanation of how 'fillmore jive' is 'sloppy' rather than 'loose'

not even going to touch the matter of 'inspiration'

i mean if 'fillmore jive' is 'sloppy' how shall we refer to 'westing'

may need a deeper explanation of how 'fillmore jive' is 'sloppy' rather than 'loose'

Compare w/“Stop Breathin,” which is “loose” but has tension and interest and a through-line… “Fillmore” just feels limp and floppy to me, it doesn’t cohere

okay -- i am not a musician and respect your opinion (plus of course the whole dancing about architecture thing)

but also 'floppy' and 'doesn't cohere' are words that amount to nothing. if you don't like it, that's cool, but

^^

Fair enuff… yeah, it just doesn’t grab me or make me want to keep listening (or feel like it took me anywhere when I do), obviously this isn’t a universal judgment.

But, again, contrast with “Half a Canyon”… tho I guess there must be folks who find that boring and repetitive or whatever.

(I admit saying they lacked inspiration is “unfair” - no pun intended - clearly I have no idea how inspired they were or weren’t… maybe they thought it was a great musical idea… maybe they were inspired by the best hash in the city that night… etc.)

Range life and maybe unfair when you wanna get down: all you need from this album tbh

Okay Newark wilder and elevate me later are good tunes, and 5-4 unity a fun novelty track too

Not there for filmore jive. It's like pavement trying to be radiohead: the worst concept imaginable. I do like the five seconds where sm sings "every night it's straight and narrow" otherwise nah mate, bit of wank ain't it?

smdh.p.

My spittin' too truthful

I also kinda like "heaven is a truck" because it sounds like a lot of the songs on brighten the corners.

Okay maybe I like more of this album than I thought. But half of the songs I can easily do with never hearing again = silence kit, stop breathing, gold soundz (not actually a bad sing, just a cmvery short shelf life), cut your hair, hit the plane down and filmore jive

What song should I teach my next guitar student from this album and why should it be unfair?

oh my god, some of y'all are out of your friggin' minds

this thread has taken an unfortunate turn; steer it directly into the ground

there’s no survi

vors

i do like fillmore jive, it's a good closer, but there's other stuff that was cut that should have been on the album, just like every pavement record.

anyway this is the most otm thing ever said

watery, domestic is a perfect ep and the best thing they ever released

basically a perfect 11 minutes and 27 seconds of music

Anyway, I don't skip anything on this album, I dig it all

There are some very bad opinions here and I admit some of them are mine

I wouldn't say I *hate* Fillmore Jive, but I've never really vibed with it. Something about the melody irritates me. It just sounds very trite. Coupled with the arch lyrics, makes me understand more than anything why people *don't* like Pavement and find them insincere.

Raft & Coolin' by Sound are two S-tier bangers and should have been on the album. CBS might even be my favorite Scott song in the catalogue.

Sorry if I went too hard on “Fillmore Jive”… If I’m expressing a negative opinion, I like to give my reasoning (rather than just say “it sucks”); if only so others have something specific to argue against if they’re telling me I’m full of it(!)

I still invite y’all to imagine a world in which the album ends with “all my friends”… we could live in that world… together

that's how it starts...

xxp don't apologize ... i love "Fillmore Jive" but i also agree that "All My Friends" would be an even better album closer.

The story behind "All My Friends" being cut was that SM felt the melody was a little too close to Sebadoh's "Vampire" so he ended up just taking a snippet of the outro and releasing it as a b-side to Gold Soundz under the title "Exit Theory (Edit)".

I still invite y’all to imagine a world in which the album ends with “all my friends”… we could live in that world… together

― Hippie Ernie (morrisp), Tuesday, March 12, 2024 3:46 PM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

I'm good thanks. I might come down later