people who doesnt like to go to shows , although they love music, and live in a place where it's available - c/d?

I like to go to shows, love it, I just don't get to nearly as many shows as I would like. In fact, its something I feel kind of... I don't know... almost guilty about. I live in Chicago in a neighborhood with loads of great venues within walking distance or just a short bus/train ride away. Bot working 50-60 hours a week out in the suburbs has really cut into my show attending chances. I just don't have the stamina to stay out until 1:30 and still get up at 5:45 anymore.

shows are too expensive, start too late, too many opening bands, clubs in dangerous neighborhoods, been there--done that, shows-how last century--I just go to dance clubs, blah, blah, blah, people like you!

donald fagen said he doesnt like to go to shows cause of the "bad sound quality"..this is ridiculous. than again, it's donald fagen.

xpost
depends where you live, and also most reasons you mentioned goes also for dance clubs as well, but dance yourself to death,you are a good person.

^^^regarding "bad sound quality", to be fair, a lot of live shows sound like crap.

I think Mark Richardson did one of his early Resonant Frequency columns over at Pitchfork on "not being a show guy." The column was pretty much dead on, for me at least. I've been to my fair share of live shows, and for a period went to several each month, getting really excited scanning the alt-weeklies for upcoming bands, etc. But I'm now not sure what I found so exciting. Especially after reading that RF column, it came to me that I really don't enjoy shows all that much. I'd much rather be at home in my apartment with the record or cd on the player, maybe with some friends over to talk it over, than standing around in a crowded hole inhaling everyone else's cigarette smoke (which, thankfully, is no longer in DC and more and more places). A lot of bands aren't that exciting to watch. As stated above, a lot of shows start/finish really late, don't have that great of sound systems for me to really appreciate what's going on, charge too much for a beer, etc. I also like to take my time with music, let it all sink in with repeated listens. That said, I'll still go to shows here and there if it's a band I'm really into, or if I'm curious how their live arrangement is going to be.

I mostly hate going to shows. They're so ritualized and full of either a) annoying young 'n' drunk types or b) old fucks like me who stand around grumbling and wishing there were seats. Plus, most bands suck live and compensate for it by sweating a lot, or pulling their clothes off, or trying way too hard and way too unimaginatively to be "shocking." It ain't 1969 and you ain't Iggy - settle down and play the songs so we can all go home and blog about you.

Here's that RF column I mentioned.

xpost otm too

seats especially.

i'd like to go to more shows but i don't have a lot of friends who share my taste in music. and no, going alone is not an option - tiny asian girls tend to get harassed a bit on weekend nights, and it's not like I can see shit anyway, being 5'1 and all.

i've gone to a few shows by myself but tend to make sure it's the sort of act that's likely to have a reasonable number of female fans, just so I feel comfortable/safe. otherwise, it's just not worth it.

I = "doesn't ever want to rock"

Most bands are rubbish live. unperson's complaint about the ritualization of the whole experience is 100% OTM. I like clubs but I usually only go to see bands at shitty little venues that host 5 local bands for around $5. The touring band experience is largely a load of cliched nonsense designed to rip you off, whether by ticket prices, drink prices or starting times (deliberately vague and subsequently late, in order to give you more time to spend dough at the bar) etc.

There are exceptions but mostly live bands are dud.

My excess time is devoted to my family (obv., not 100% of it, but I feel pretty guilty when I spend big chunks of free time doing things that don't involve them, and I can't take my six-year old to a concert). It leaves little time for shows. Plus, what Curmudgeon said above ("shows are too expensive, start too late, too many opening bands, clubs in dangerous neighborhoods")

Ha. That reminds me of when I lived in Michigan years ago we'd drive to Detroit to see a show and I'd be thinking: "wait, why are Stereolab playing in a crackhouse?".

Live music is a visual/communal experience, with the music often incidental or at least tangential. Live poetry readings, wrestling matches, dance clubs, amateur playhouses, the local Googolplex: Any one of these could conceivably be a purer, more appropriate forum for the kind of jolts you seek from your personal favourite styles of music, depending.

Everybody's got a TV - what's your excuse for not watching videos? They're always on.

For me the idea going to a show is almost always better then the actual show. Except for the ones I don’t go to. in that case I get told that I missed the best show ever.

sweating a lot
what bands do this as compensation?????

Punk bands.

For me the idea going to a show is almost always better then the actual show. Except for the ones I don’t go to. in that case I get told that I missed the best show ever.

quite true

Every time I'm at a show it's late and I'm tired and all I think about is how much I'd rather be in my nice comfy bed catching some Z's.

I'm curious, do the avowed non-showgoers on this thread also avoid live albums?

Course not. "Wart and All" is the best Marc Riley album.

not to mention that there's a hell of a lot of difference between say, The Ramones, live on New Year's Eve 1977 and Jarvis Cocker live in 2007 (recently recommended to me as the "best gig ever").

Most live music is too late and too loud, and a lot of it is too expensive. I have a job I need to catch a 6:30 bus to get to, I like my hearing, and I have to pay rent.

It wouldn't be very difficult at all for club owners to book earlier shows and for bands to ditch the macho bullshit posturing of 'If it's too loud you're too old hurhurhur.' But they haven't done it yet.

I skipped right to the bottom of this thread, but I'll bet I'm being redundant here - lots of people I know have the same issues with live music I do.

Consider me one more old geezer who can't really be bothered to go to shows. Rock shows, that is- jazz I go to whenever I can.

Yep, thread otm, except for Zeno.

xpost. Ditto. And the jazz can be had any night of the week for free, just round the corner from my house from 8pm onwards.

u know, i'm kind of one of these ppl. i love music, i mean a lot, and i don't really go to shows -- unless it's something i LOOOVE.

but i don't like this about myself, so i'm going to more these days, which is great. usually i don't really like to go out much at ALL, becuz i use my free time to work on music. but i figure shows are actually a really smart way for me to get out, cuz at least it's something i care about...

This thread is making me rethink going to see a band I don't even like tonight because I have a free ticket. I'll still probably go. Shows can be really fun, still. I usually go to smaller shows that are cheap, though. Used to go to a ton of instores at the local noise shop (which sadly moved to St Louis). They had a ton of great FREE shows (Nautical Almanac, Ghost Ice, Big Nurse).

I'm curious, do the avowed non-showgoers on this thread also avoid live albums?

For the most part. There are huge exceptions - with jazz, for example, I don't mind buying live albums at all. But with jazz, one of the reasons is that the recording quality is usually so much better than a live album recorded by some rock band in a stadium or amphitheatre. (Going to see jazz shows is also an exception for me, I think the tiny venues and not to mention the availability of seats are a huge draw.)

With most live albums I have, though, jazz or not, you can barely tell that they're live albums.

It's not about not liking to go to shows, it's about having to get up in the morning.

It's also about having various latent pinched nerves and backache potentialities that don't do well jammed in between a concrete pillar and a crowd of trucker-capped emo kids, to name one scenario.

Live albums get the exact same chance to impress me as studio albums. Underworld's live album is great, as is Ted Nugent's Double Live Gonzo and the Art Ensemble of Chicago's Urban Bushmen. Not to mention fucking Agharta and Pangaea, two of the greatest albums ever recorded, studio or live.

The worst live bands these days tend to be whichever hot British band is supposed to be trying to break America. The sychronized flapping beerguts of The Klaxons are currently underwhelming them right across the continent and as for the The Arctic Monkeys...seriously Britain, is this the best you've got? I've eaten baked potatoes that have more stagecraft.

Also, I have a phobia of one day being old & deaf. (And I agree with the "live jazz" > "live rock" sentiments.)

These days I'm lucky if I make it out to one show a month. The reasons for this are: a) currently live in a non-media center that bands regularly skip on tours; b) have to get up early for work, which makes weeknight showgoing impossible; c) usually get up early with my two young kids on weekends, as i barely get to see them during the week. It's hard to read about bands I like skipping over town, but the upside is that I now enjoy shows more than I have in years. There's something to be said for cutting back, it turns out.

grumpy old men to thread

Is no-one going to defend live shows? Not even the original poster?

x-post

Despite listing some grumpy old man complaints above I still go out to see live music and am ocassionally rewarded with a great night out. This includes seeing Willie Colon come on at 1:30 in the morning and being one of the few folks in attendance speaking English not Spanish. Yea yea, it was not like a Fania record circa 1974 or something, but hearing he and the horn section booming out sounds live, and seeing how the audience reacted gave me another angle on why I like such sounds.

I've long felt that varying the types of shows I go to has helped keeped me interested. Folks I know who used to only go see hardcore punk shows quickly became burnt out. I've always liked varying things--rock shows in a club, blues in a theatre, Prince in an arena, etc. I am going to less rock shows though--sometimes because they just sell out too quick, and sometimes because of burnout. If it's potentially exciting enough I manage to deal with the less sleep issue(coffee!).

Despite listing some grumpy old man complaints above I still go out to see live music and am ocassionally rewarded with a great night out.

Yeah, me too. I didn't mean to leave a contrary impression.

I went to all three days of the Langerado Music Festival in South Florida this year. My wife and I have -- until last year -- had season tickets to the Florida Granda Opera, which is kind of like a concert (well, it's a night out, at least). And we see live music often (jazz bands play every weekend at local cafes and coffee-houses, for instance). So I go see live music from time-to-time, and I've enjoyed it a lot. I just don't go to concerts very often.

Sometimes I even insanely see late night shows and review them as well, on a short deadline. Despite all the hassles of seeing shows, I still do so and plan on continuing to do so, just not as often as I did in my 20s.

I'm 22 and I usually avoid live shows. I can't remember when I finally admitted to myself that I don't enjoy them. I get mad when I've spent money on something that sucks, so I don't usually go to shows unless I know the band and I'm convinced that the live show is going to be worthwhile. Also, I can't think of any show, ever, where I didn't think to myself, "I really wouldn't mind the show being over with right now." I like the knowledge and experience of having seen a show, but the experience as it's happening is unpleasant.. I'm not sure why I don't mind sitting through films. This really all might have to do with having to stand the entire time.

For example, Battles is playing tomorrow night. Tickets are 22 euros, which is $30 (before drinks). I already saw Battles in April (for $5 at NYU) and they were great (despite the group of dancing assholes that kept purposefully launching each other into bystanders), but the prospect of sitting on my couch at home and listening to Mirrored while drinking a glass of wine with my roommates is much more appealing.

I went to go see an Israeli pianist tonight and had a great time, though. And I'll probably go see Animal Collective next week even though I've never liked their live show.

actually, i think it's just the seat.

So it would seem the thread answer is "classic". Lots of well-reasoned answers, particularly the comment about how clubs should do early shows.

I still go see a lot of live music. This month I have seen Animal Collective, Danbert Nobacon, and a few local shows. Two nights from now I am seeing Melt-Banana. I'm 41, so I think I can qualify for "grumpy old man" status. But I have pretty bad tinnitus, wear earplugs, and rarely stay out past 2. I have to get up for work at 7 on weekdays.

Last Saturday I went to see The Tiptons who were amazing, and the show was done by 11. Bliss!

I enjoy seeing friends' bands that I like, or catching an artist that I really love (if it doesn't cost a gazillion dollars), but otherwise I have to chime in with much of what has been expressed in previous posts-- at this point in my life I'm burnt out from years of show-going, the experience itself is too often tedious and ritualized blah-ness, I am reluctant to cough up the dough, I find that crowds interfere with/distract from what at its best is often a very intimate and personal experience for me, I don't like big club environments (but at the same time am frustrated by venues where there is no booze available)...

I hate live shows for the reasons listed but I do want to underline one of them - the waiting (and not the Tom Petty classic). I fucking L-O-A-T-H-E waiting, esp. that extra-stretched time before the headliner goes on (if there are more than two acts on the bill). When I reviewed shows, I was almost always alone which meant that I couldn't get drunk (besides I was usually on deadline so drunkenness wouldn't have helped too much there) or talk too much with anyone else. So I felt every minute of those waits. But I don't like waiting in general. So even when I'm with friends at a show (as happened last Saturday), I still get itchy.

The absolute nadir in this respect was a Frogs show at Shank Hall in Milwaukee which was scheduled for 7pm. They didn't go on until....fuckin'....MIDNIGHT. Now I love me some Frogs and it was a damn good show (they even accidentally started their amp on fire). But the second coming of Jesus Christ Almighty isn't worth waiting that long. (P.S. I didn't drink at all at this point in my life.)

And the blame cannot be laid entirely on the venues. Some acts with enough clout can extend the time for, um, dramatic effect (and merch sales).

That said, I had a blast the two times I attended SXSW. There's music all over the city. So if you don't get in to one venue, just go next door or to your next fave act. Plus bands rarely play longer than an hour with many at the half-hour mark. Plus there's VERY little waiting even if you stick around at one venue. Plus there are lots of great bands because most make it a point to be at SXSW. And let it be known that I did my venue hopping almost entirely alone. And sober. But let's face it - that's an extremely singular experience. And a privileged one. I had a free press pass which costs $500 for those not reviewing the event.

At the end of the day, I can count on one hand the truly transcendent experiences I've had at live shows and I've been to many. And though it pains me to say it in this context, the same cannot be said of my time on dancefloors (which, right, have their own drawbacks but waaaay less than live shows).

As for live albums, they suck (except, right, those that don't). But I want to address live bootlegs. If someone tells you ten live boots are great, you can be sure nine of them don't come close to whatever's good about the studio work. My fave example of this is Prince's absurdly overrated Small Club 2nd Show That Night. I can think of at least ten Prince studio releases that slash it to pieces. The wisest music purchasing decision I ever made was NOT buying this on vinyl for $60.

Of course, genre is important here. Little of the above applies to jazz. I've yet to hear a bad Miles Davis bootleg. African music almost always sounds as great live as it does recorded. And sometimes, live is the only way to enjoy genres you don't much like (for me, that's metal and noise). Black Dice or Agony Column make more sense to me live than New Order who I consider the greatest band of all-time.

Still, I'd love to hear from people who know what the hell is wrong with us live show haters.

I fucking L-O-A-T-H-E waiting, esp. that extra-stretched time before the headliner goes on..

Every time I'm at a show it's late and I'm tired and all I think about is how much I'd rather be in my nice comfy bed catching some Z's.

..I can't think of any show, ever, where I didn't think to myself, "I really wouldn't mind the show being over with right now." I like the knowledge and experience of having seen a show, but the experience as it's happening is unpleasant..

Nailed it! Definitely classic.

But the main thing for me: I don't like the demystification. Watching the fingers fretting, plucking, plinking.. it makes it totally human-made and diminishes the transcendentalism. For me. (Guitar/bass-based) songs also lose their charm for me after I figure it out or download a power tab, for the same reason.

I hate this, though. I'm 22 and really feel like I'm missing out. I love meeting people who saw Slowdive and MBV and stuff but have no desire, apparently, to be that person myself in another generation. In the last month I passed up Animal Collective and Boris, the former I'm interested in and the latter I absolutely love.

Personally I mostly get distracted and bored at shows. Guys playing guitar! Great! Never seen that before! This is easier when it is friends or something like that. But basically I don't like being around other people, watching them watch shows. Which is, you know, what ends up happening by the third song.

What's confounding to me is how people who buy an average of two new albums a year often go to several huge stadium shows a year. They spend over $100 on tickets enthusiastically, and really seem to enjoy the shows, no matter how cheesy the bands. They see more shows than a lot of my friends who used to see a few shows a week with me back in the day. Yet many of these people have never even been to a more intimate show at a club that holds less than 5,000.

I hated most of the stadium shows I've seen, as I feel most miss out on the energy unless they're in the first few rows. The Police at Wrigley wasn't bad though, as I can't expect to see them in any other context without time travel.

I recently bought a place a block from Metro and hope to catch more shows. Saw Patrick Wolf last Tuesday, and he had real stage presence. Not just that he looks like an overgrown elf, but he's just an amazingly expressive musician. I think spacing shows apart enough and getting variety is key to not burning out on live shows. Helps that the club is non-smoking and often has 7:00 shows on weeknights too.

maybe i see it from new york perspective,

...where, as far as I can tell, shows start even later and drinks are even more over-priced?

Personally I don't mind shows where I can sit at the bar, assuming I can actually see the band, and where there is Stella on tap (I can drink beer in bottles cheap at home, for crissakes) and where the bar is not too crowded but also not completely empty (which can be depressing.) Given those particular variables, it doesn't even matter if I like the band that much; I'd usually rather see some half-assed no-name local unknowns in a bar like that than an act I love in a big venue that makes the whole experience feel like just more work. But even that's in theory, though. I used to see bands almost every night, a few years ago; now I almost never go out, especially during the week, when I have to get up early the next morning. (I did like seeing Little Big Town in a book store last Tuesday, though -- though even there, there was still an annoying wait before they went on stage. But at least I got to sit down, had a seat near the front, and I liked the show a lot. The audience was just a small crowd of industry types, which helped as long as I didn't have to actually talk to them.) But usually, yeah, I'm with the people here who think two-or-three-song sets would generally be optimum in most cases; beyond that, I tend to get really antsy and hope it's all over soon.

Live albums are....albums. Period. And usually, compared to studio albums, you have to strain to hear what's going on. So generally, on balance, they strike me as pretty useless, though obviously there are exceptions. And sometimes they can work as de facto greatest hits samplers, which can be nice.

i hate gigs

they remind me of msg boards - 95% male

I like music that is perfectly produced, with preferrably no mistakes at all, and possibly with a lot of overdubs of the same people playing different instruments and singing different voices.

If that stuff was to be reproduced on stage, they'd have to use playback. Exactly why should I go to shows then?

i keep thinking about how great the Daft Punk gigs looked and how much i would like to have seen them but being crushed by nerdy guys all around me and no space to dance blah blah blah

i much prefer performances at festivals as a loose rule because you've got more freedom generally altho the sound tends to be shitter.

they remind me of msg boards - 95% male

Not all gigs. It seems to depend on the performer and the genre. My unscientic analysis shows that there are more women at salsa, reggaeton, zydeco, and twee pop shows than at indie-rock or indie-dance.

Most of the objections above are perfectly valid, especially for bigger gigs. I can't be arsed with anything much bigger than a pub-sized venue these days - at least you can talk to people, get a decent pint and actually SEE the band close-up.

That said - I do enjoy live music massively. Actually seeing a band play their stuff adds tremendously to your overall impression of them. Just noticing things like how they play, their facial expressions, how they communicate between themselves as a band all add to the music, I reckon. I like to check out what gear they use too (sad muso alert!)

Geir - mistakes, rearrangements, rejigging songs because you can't do overdubs - if you really love a band - all of these things are interesting and classic - and can make live versions better and more 'human'. But that wouldn't interest you, right?

I used to love going to gigs but I got out of the habit because they go on too late a) for me to get up for work the next day and b) for me to catch the bus home (taxi is ~$80, so no thanks), and now even if I moved I'm not sure I could be bothered any more.

Standing around on yr own, nowhere to sit and nothing to look at, watching everyone else have people to talk to and being too cool to acknowledge you no matter how many times they've seen you there, waiting for the bands to start while everything runs later and later until you realise that you're gonna have to leave before the band you wanted to see starts. And I'm not going to claim that the sound is always terrible, but it's not that rare to spend your money and be subjected to a physically uncomfortable rumbling where you can hardly work out which song's which, and there's sod all you can do when it happens except grouse on the internet the next day.

I still miss it though and would probably still really enjoy it if I had the transport or could be bothered to spend a hell of a lot of money. Often I spend the first 80% of the evening thinking how lousy everything is and running through the previous rant in my head and then when the band gets onstage suddenly everything is AWESOME BEST NIGHT EVER WHY AM I NOT DOING THIS EVERY NIGHT. I mean music on headphones is great but live you get to feel it, walk round in it, see what kind of people made it and how it fits together. So I guess I shouldn't be on this thread.

I'm hesistant about seeing M.I.A. in a couple of weeks because the venue is notorious for not giving a shit if performers wait to go onstage two and a half hours past the scheduled time.

and the drinks are expensive. $10 for a g & t!

MIA live probably ain't worth going out of your way for.

This guy who lives in my apartment asked me what I thought, so I'll chime in, and this is from the point of view of a musician who plays shows at small NYC venues. First, I love a live show like the one I recently dragged the aforementioned guy to, Katatonia at BBKing's, where it's a band I'm really into and I can stand right in front of the band.
But Mars Volta at Roseland was lame; any show at Roseland is lame. Forget about a 5'2" girl getting to see anything at a venue that huge. Though getting drunken marriage proposals from nerdy math rock boys is amusing.
I hate to say it, but live shows at small NYC venues can be kind of miserable. First: Stuck-in-their-ways sound engineers often go through their idiotic routine miking every amp, which is inappropriate for a small space. It ends up way too loud for the space, distorted and annoying. Second: I personally think a live music performance should be a social, casual experience where the audience doesn't feel held hostage to stand for forty minutes and stare at the stage. But in most of these one-room venues it's too loud to talk, there's no place to sit down, and there's not even a little side room where you can go to actually hear the music better and blab about it with that hot guy who lives in your apartment. The end result is the same as at those hoity-toity jazz clubs, where they at least tell you straight out: "No talking during the show." Get me out of here!
Live music can be an intense experience, which is why it can be so great. But it can also turn annoying real fast. Maybe the old pros had it right: Two sets, giving the audience a break in between. At small rock clubs that would mean two short sets, like four songs each set with a 5-10 minute shoot-the-shit break in between.

these people are neither classic nor dud, unless they go to shows and then moan about it the whole time, in which case they are dud.

Helen Keller i think you are on point.

i think helen keller is part of the problem - the people talking at gigs problem.

Nah, she's right -- Live music is as much a social experience as a musical experience; if you're not allowed to be social, there's even less reason to show up. And as annoying as audience members can be at shows, I can't remember when I've ever been annoyed by people merely talking. (Actually, there was a thread about that very subject a couple years ago, but the search function doesn't seem to be helping.)

At jazz shows you may not talk too much, but usually you can eat, making it easier to stay put.

People who get angry about having to "put up" with opening bands irritate me. God forbid you might have to hear something new and unfamiliar.

live music sucks. mostly cos of all the other people there who also think live music is any good.

"they remind me of msg boards - 95% male"

not at the last Boredoms show, forexample - it was like a model agency party...

that ellipsis means we are all now imagining Zeno "getting some"

wow, you can really read through me...

when I lived in a tiny market I went to way more shows than I do now that I'm in a city where there's a "big show" every week.

This is true for me as well, here in New Haven, shows that interest me are few and far between and when they happen I tend to get more excited about them. When I lived in Chicago going to shows felt more obligatory and less fun, thus I pretty much stopped.

After reading through this thread I feel so much better about myself. Thanks!

MIA live probably ain't worth going out of your way for.

This is complete crap. When I saw her this summer it was brutally fantastic. She did the sexiest crowdsurf I've ever seen. Boyz and 20 Dollar were incredible.

I spend so much money just travelling to concerts that it bothers me when people have the opportunity so easily they don't bother. Its 30 euro or a four hour bus journey every time I want to see something. And I do it about every two weeks. From my minimum wage job.

"People who get angry about having to "put up" with opening bands irritate me. God forbid you might have to hear something new and unfamiliar.

-- John Justen"

its not that its new and unfamiliar so much as it is that most people booking a show have no idea of continuity or how to program an evening of music so that things flow well. do i need to hear 3 bands all performing the same kind of music? no thanks.

last year i went to a great show, the headliner was Amel Larrieux and opening for her was Donnie. this was good, a similar but not samey kind of artist. and even before donnie they had some poets from all over the US who were really really good, as well as some african drumming. it all worked very well, if every show was programmed that well, id probably go to many more.

Yeah, I WISH I could hear some new and unfamiliar music from an opening band but it so rarely happens.

This is complete crap. When I saw her this summer it was brutally fantastic. She did the sexiest crowdsurf I've ever seen. Boyz and 20 Dollar were incredible.

yeah i take it back - it does sound cool

I lived in a small town when I grew up, Ripley, WV, which had no music scene, and then went to college at WVU in Morgantown, WV. I'm currently in Columbus, OH, which has good shows fairly regularly, although not the constant barrage that NYC or SF might experience. I go to shows about 3 or 4 times a month, and it's normally bands I enjoy quite a lot recorded. I get a rush out of watching music performed, I cried the first time I saw Man Man, I was just overwhelmed. I'm only now able to find lots of music and it's not diminished the novelty of the show experience. I don't go to socialize, I wasn't familiar with what a scene kid was until I was probably 20, and I've never really been smacked with insincerity that seems to bother a lot of people about show crowds. I like it, I like that it's loud and dirty. As a side note, I have congenital anosmia (no sense of smell since birth) which might contribute significantly to me being able to ignore the crowds and bar stench.

Yeah, I WISH I could hear some new and unfamiliar music from an opening band but it so rarely happens.

Soooooo OTM that the earth just imploded. As a man who's sat through countless cookie cutter, "why did you go to all this bother?" opening bands, I bow to you, Everything.

I have congenital anosmia (no sense of smell since birth) which might contribute significantly to me being able to ignore the crowds and bar stench.

Strangely enough, I've been anosmic since birth, too. (Notice that bad smells were not among my complaints above.)

"What's confounding to me is how people who buy an average of two new albums a year often go to several huge stadium shows a year. They spend over $100 on tickets enthusiastically, and really seem to enjoy the shows, no matter how cheesy the bands. They see more shows than a lot of my friends who used to see a few shows a week with me back in the day. Yet many of these people have never even been to a more intimate show at a club that holds less than 5,000."

How is this strange? The money that goes on shows don't go on records, music as a purely social experience (not that records need necessarily be anti-social).

As for classical music, especially the newer stuff, its pretty vital forme to see what the performers are doing if they're employing a theatrical technique to get sounds out of their instruments, or a type of physicality. Its better to sometimes hear sometimes challenging works when you're sitting down in a venue after a tiring day, it can give an interesting perspective, the ear may pick something that you never thought ws there before. The problem you get is that some of these concerts are, at times, unsatisfactorily short, and that more thought has to be given to what's going to be played - it is often the case where a passing ensemble will sometimes pair works with little thought as to audible links, the reasoning for this can be shock tactics or bringing ppl that wouldn't normally go...not that I'm against this on principle, but again you can see through this immediately, a sense of bad faith on the part of the programmers, more than anything.

I'm definitely guilty of this. Though I would do a lot better to leave the house more lately, I just think that, for the majority of music I like lately, it is definitely a more rewarding experience recorded than live. Some live performances are indeed good, but I think the era of live music is past and it's thankfully becoming less and less of a neccessary element of pop. Most artists, groups just don't put on a live show interesting or exciting enough for me really ( I think most live rap/hiphop in particular is pretty lame). I've been to some great live shows and appreciate having been there. But I've also been to see a lot of bands etc., play a relatively successful reproduction of their recorded work while I stood in a motionless crowd all staring at the band and wondering why I was there.

Well I went to Justin Timberlake this summer, and it was the first big outdoor arena concert I'd ever been to. And it was quite dull.

I like music that is perfectly produced, with preferrably no mistakes at all
-- Geir Hongro, Wednesday, October 17, 2007 6:29 AM (3 days ago) Bookmark Link

exactly what constitutes a "mistake" though?

Strangely enough, I've been anosmic since birth, too. (Notice that bad smells were not among my complaints above.)

This is off topic, but, have you ever been at a (shitty) job, and someone cleans up a smelly mess, but won't let you step in, and then you just feel incredibly guilty? Hahaha

Second: I personally think a live music performance should be a social, casual experience where the audience doesn't feel held hostage to stand for forty minutes and stare at the stage. But in most of these one-room venues it's too loud to talk, there's no place to sit down...

ex-fucking-actly.

I agree with those who've said the sound is usually bad. Plus it's TOO DAMN LOUD. Tinnitis isn't supposed to be part of the mix.

I've never been to any sort of indie rock type show, except I guess Sleater Kinney, where the sound sucked. I go to metal shows all the time, though (and bring earplugs), which are usually pretty awesome as long as I like the band on stage, because usually they know how to put on a good performance. Lots of energy and all that. There's something about the communal experience that really amplifies the enjoyment of songs you've heard a thousand times before. It's all about the vibe you get from the other people.

Plus it's TOO DAMN LOUD. Tinnitis isn't supposed to be part of the mix.

Oh most certainly. Over the last year I've curtailed my show-going significantly due to increased hearing sensitivity and often not being able to deal with aural assault on a weekly basis.

I find I very much fit the criteria of the thread title. And to the question I respond: gong out is not an end in itself. I used to think it was, these days I'm generally happy to listen to music at home and stuff. A better answer: I'm antisocial and can't stand being around crowds, especially when it's at places that draw a certain element, which usually is most places where things are, that and I'm turning into a bit of an agoraphobe. Also theres lots of issues about club culture and particular ideas about experiencing music that I have lots of problems with and will not get into here.

I find this thread really interesting. I'm full of conflicted feelings about this, being a musician who plays a lot of shows (I'm on my way to one right now, in fact) but also a curmudgeon who tends to agree with a lot of the complaints listed in this thread.

I guess the way I feel about live music is that it's good when it's about connecting with people. But too often that gets forgotten. You go to a room packed with people who are really into this band that you're also really into, but you don't talk to anybody.

-------

I'm writing this now after playing the show. It was the best night I've had in forever. It was a tiny tiny bar in Redding, California. People came because they knew one band, but they stayed and listened to five bands. My violinist played with two of the other bands and made out with a girl we were all sure was gay. The point is, sure, live shows are about music, but really they're about PEOPLE! That's why you should go. I have too many things to say about this, but that will suffice for now I think.

Great thread! I relate to all of this, especially about looking more at the crowd than the band after 3 songs. Then getting self conscious, needing more expensive beer.

I sympathize with Fagen, even though the sound isn't really "bad" there is still this generic live sound (one factor is to be as loud as possible) which seems to be what most bands settle for, and I don't care for it. When a band knows what they're doing and have an idea about performing live, it might still work though (Deerhoof).

I can't say I haven't enjoyed any shows I've been to lately, but there are those moments where I'm definitely not seduced by the music or the performance. In those moments I become very aware of the weirdness of me just standing in a room staring at a band. The band is making noises and I feel obligated to nod my head along to the rhythm they're producing, cause that's my role here. The melody isn't tugging at me, I'm not feeling the tension, I'm not feeling the groove. Usually this happens when it's a well known indie band. Subconsciously I rely on recognition alone to manufacture excitement "I know the band, and here they are" "I've heard this song, I think I know which one it is based on how it has begun. I will communicate my knowledge of this via slightly more exaggerated head nodding".

It extends beyond the live show too:

B(r)and you recognize ~announces~ new album of 11 songs. Listen to the 3-4 minute mid-fi mid-tempo song. Picture of band posing. Picture of the album art. Buy the t-shirt and the sticker with the picture of the album art on it. See the band make the same noises as the recording above but in a room where it will sound muddier but louder.

Just the expected sameness of the experience and the cycle and the words and the merch all just becomes so monotonous if I can't fall in love with the music itself on a deeper level. Guess this is why I've been leaning on more atmospheric genres overall.

^- this post reminds of laurie anderson stage banter circa 1986

The melody isn't tugging at me, I'm not feeling the tension, I'm not feeling the groove. Usually this happens when it's a well known indie band.

think i found the problem

LOL, no kidding. Who are some of these bands, for example?

IDK it's kind of a cumulative memory of varying lengths of moments across very many shows attended. Reflecting on the Sleater-Kinney Fallon performance this morning brought it to mind I suppose.

You're (getting) old is what it is. No more no less.

- not seduced by the music or the performance
- very aware of the weirdness of me just standing in a room staring at a band
- feel obligated to nod my head along to the rhythm they're producing, cause that's my role here
- The melody isn't tugging at me, I'm not feeling the tension, I'm not feeling the groove.
- the expected sameness of the experience and the cycle and the words and the merch all just becomes so monotonous

I mean, it's pretty clear. (wanted to say "I've been there" but the correct phrasing is "I'm there")

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-5R9UjTiCI0Y/T1DVv0-k1DI/AAAAAAAAAZk/lYhWnFb2YZo/s1600/colour+i

Yeah definitely that.

"getting old(er)" doesn't explain much except it may contribute to the question of when (typically).