CuBase/MOTU Problems

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The guitarist/recording guy in my band has a question:

There are occassional random short drops (silences) in audio in the recorded wave files (all tracks simultaneously). I'm using cubase sx 1.0.6 with a motu 896 firewire interface with the latest drivers connected through a carbus-firewire adapter on a pc laptop (I've tried this on many different laptops and have had the same results).
I'm monitoring through a mixer before the interface so I set my buffer size to a large number and used direct monitoring through the interface to avoid any added strain on the computer. I'm at a loss for what could be causing this. Please, any suggestions would be appreciated. The cardbus-firewire? Power surges? I'm at a loss.

Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Sunday, 2 July 2006 23:28 (seventeen years ago) link

how long are the dropouts?

this could be caused by IRQ conflicts, especially considering that you're throwing a PCMCIA card into the mix.

if the computer isn't optimized for audio yet, check out http://www.musicxp.net/

aside from that, what are the specs on the laptop? how many tracks are you trying to record simultaneously....etc...

pablo (Pablo A), Monday, 3 July 2006 04:12 (seventeen years ago) link

also you may want to try swapping the firewire cable

pablo (Pablo A), Monday, 3 July 2006 04:20 (seventeen years ago) link

Thanks for the reply!

Dropouts are fractions of a second, but vary in exact length. Sometimes they are accompanied by a crackle nearby and sometimes I get a random crackle (one crackle) without any dropout around it.

IRQ's: THIS SEEMS LIKE ITS MY LAST OPTION!! There appear to be no conflicts with the irq settings according to the device manager, but the interface and cardbus are on irq #17 and share that irq # with the video and something called "Data Fax SoftModem". I would like to assign my interface its own irq to avoid any conflicts, but it appears that you cannot change the irq's in XP. Any ideas?

Computer has been optimized for audio.

Laptop Specs: HP Pavilion, 1.6Ghz AMD Sempron, 384MB RAM
***I've tried this setup on two different Dell Inspiron laptops and had the same issues.

As far as tracks. . I'm laying 8 tracks simultaneously.

Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Monday, 3 July 2006 15:35 (seventeen years ago) link

sharing an IRQ with video is very bad. i'm more of an apple guy, so i don't fiddle around with the inner workings if XP that much, but sometimes a BIOS update can help things. check dell's website for that.

anywho, if the symptoms are identical on multiple computers the culprit is most likely one of the common elements:

- motu hardware/drivers
- firewire cable
- cardbus card
- cubase sx 1.0.6

in this case i would be strongly suspicious of items 2 and 3.

pablo (Pablo A), Monday, 3 July 2006 18:44 (seventeen years ago) link

Crackle is a telltale sign of a bottleneck. I suspect the cardbus bus, especially if you are recording at 96/24. If so, check whether the problem goes away at 48/16.

Shoes say, yeah, no hands clap your good bra. (goodbra), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 05:28 (seventeen years ago) link

Motu tech support said to replace the unit and we did. We bought an 896HD (which we're going to return in a few days) and at first it seemed to clear up the problem. But then we realized we were recording at 48. When we bumped it to 96, we couldn't record at all --Cubase was not reading any input.

I'm not sure what a "bottleneck" is and how we fix it - this is me talking again, not the guitarist. But I'll mention it to him.

Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 13:40 (seventeen years ago) link

If you are recording at 96KHz x 24bits x 8tracks, then the cardbus bus, which operates at 33MHz x 32bits, should be able to handle it OK, now that I think about it.

My guitarist often cannot 2-track us at practice because the disk in his Mac isn't fast enough. Most laptop disks are slow, so that they don't heat up the computer unnecessarily or make loud noise. You might try daisy-chaining an external firewire disk before (or after) the MOTU, preferably a disk that runs at 10,000 RPM. Firewire is built for this kinda thing, so you wouldn't be creating any extra issues with such a setup.

One last thing to try is AudioDesk, a simple application that should come with the 896. If it can record 8 tracks OK, then Cubase is choking (which I doubt).

Shoes say, yeah, no hands clap your good bra. (goodbra), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:16 (seventeen years ago) link

The crackles and gaps are completely gone with the new device though. Now the problem is just that we can't record at all at the higher sampling rate (96). We also can't even listen back to files recorded (on the old device) at higher sample rates.

In fact when we opened an old project that was recorded at 88.2, we got an error message that "MFWA Keys" had to shut down, and in playback of the old files we're getting output levels in cubase but no output readings on the interface (the reverse of what happens when we try to record.) Any ideas? Thanks again for the help.

Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 16:24 (seventeen years ago) link

It's sounding more and more like a device problem rather than a performance issue. Things to try updating: 896 firmware, MOTU drivers, Cubase. If there's a driver issue, you'd expect that AudioDesk would also be unable to record at 96 as well.

Shoes say, yeah, no hands clap your good bra. (goodbra), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 16:42 (seventeen years ago) link

Also, if you are sure you have all the latest drivers for everything, try uninstalling Cubase and the drivers and reinstalling. PC driverland is a swirling wasteland, navigated only by black magic at best and hallucinations at worst. Probably the best way to tell if there's an incantation that'll set things right is to install Windows on a different PC, from scratch, and see if it exhibits the same problem.

Shoes say, yeah, no hands clap your good bra. (goodbra), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 17:07 (seventeen years ago) link

also might want to try "upgrading" cubase.

pablo (Pablo A), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 18:07 (seventeen years ago) link

also might want to try "upgrading" cubase.

Certainly, but before spending money, make sure that the audio chain is sound. I'm starting to sound like a broken record here, but I really think that a test recording with AudioDesk is a good idea. AudioDesk (a stripped-down version of Digital Performer) comes with MOTU product, it's up-to-date, and if anything will work with MOTU hardware, AudioDesk will.

Shoes say, yeah, no hands clap your good bra. (goodbra), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 18:25 (seventeen years ago) link

AudioDesk is Mac only though.

pablo (Pablo A), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 18:33 (seventeen years ago) link

Oh, whups. It's a cold day in hell when you hear those words.

Shoes say, yeah, no hands clap your good bra. (goodbra), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 00:50 (seventeen years ago) link

We got some recording done but we had to do it at the lower sampling rate (44). Is it really bad to record at that rate, which is CD-quality? Will we really lose a significant amount of quality assuming an otherwise good recording?

Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 01:25 (seventeen years ago) link

I mean I wasn't the one engineering it but to my ears, which are pretty sensitive, I thought the recording sounded great. The mic placement was right on, the room sounded good, and I spent a lot of time getting the perfect drum tunings for each song.

Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 01:28 (seventeen years ago) link

i've always been of the strong opinion that 44.1/24 is perfectly sweet.

electric sound of jim [and why not] (electricsound), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 02:42 (seventeen years ago) link

yup, imo if you're going to CD higher sample rates are a waste of disk space and bandwidth. 24 bit is a must though.

pablo (Pablo A), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 02:46 (seventeen years ago) link

actually due to the nyquist theorem it is advantageous to record at 96khz if you can afford to. digital eq's warp their shape the closer they get to 1/2 of the frequency recorded at. so if you record at 96 you wont get the eq curve warping at the upperlimits of human hearing.

yeah i know. but when the album drops.

jodawo (jodawo), Saturday, 8 July 2006 03:13 (seventeen years ago) link


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