Wonderland

is this the one about people in London who are kind of looking for love and stuff? With Gina McKee & Shirley Henderson in it?

No. Val Kilmer. Lisa Kudrow. Porn. Murder. Based on a true story. John Holmes. Big penis.

the micheal winterbottom film is excellent (the one DV mentioned), though

Ha ha Calum, believe it or not, I have actually seen one of John Holmes' films. I do not know what the title of the film was, the story of the film was that Holmes was a (private?) detective, and that he had to solve some crime or other. His method of solving the crime appeared to be to fuck and eat out loads of women. How nice it would be if real life were so simple, no? His penis was enormous, I do remember that. I would love to be able to tell you that it was a gem in the rough or somthing, but I'm afraid it was utter, utter piss. When I was at my mother-in-law's place thee other day, I was so bored I watched this thing on TV called "Murder in Suburbia", which was a kind of bad murder mystery done in the style of a nescafe advert, and which was total shit. "Murder in Suburbia" was 100000000000000000000000000000000 times better than the John Holmes film I saw, it was that bad.

Paul Thomas Anderson on the "Johnny Wadd" documentary on the DVD, makes it sound as if some of Holmes films are worth catching. Your description makes them sound as funny as I've been led to believe. I've not seen "Deep Throat" or "Behind the Green Door" though and if I ever get around to seeing any classic porn these are the two that hold my interest. Have you seen them Norm?

I saw the film when I was looking after this friend's house when he was away on holiday. He was an Arthur Daley type wheeler-dealer, and he'd bought the remaining stock of a bankrupt video rental store, like hundreds of films, ALL ON BETAMAX. Luckily he had a stack of betamax machines in his garage as well. (also video disc machines, 8-track cartridges, this guy was and is a total pack rat, and pretty crazy too) I was kind of thrilled to find this John Holmes movie, b/c obv, he was this legendary figure and stuff (I was a lot younger then, and less cynical than I am now) Unfortunately, it was just a bad film, badly shot, and really badly acted, that happened to have fairly graphic fucking in it. It was very very boring. Maybe I saw the bad one, and all the rest are good I don't know, but I doubt it. It makes me wonder why anyone would buy a John Holmes film, when you can get (obv far less graphic) russ meyer films more easily, I mean they're pretty shit for the most part, but they at least have this sense of demented on the edge-ness about them, and the dialogue is usually so strange that it makes yr head go funny, plus, the actors all look really weird, where did he find people who looked like that?

The only "classic" '70's "X"-certer I've seen is Emanuelle (sp?) which as you probably know, is a really terrible film.

I suspect w/this, as w/other things, your tastes and mine differ, I mean if you were to name a movie w/good fucking in it, I'd probably say "The Piano", or maybe "The Lover" at a push, you know?

I just remembered, I have seen Lydia Lunch's entire cinematic ouvre, and some nick zedd films, haha, haha, haha.

Well first off your mates collection will be worth more money than a barrel load of X Rated Traci Lords films. Seriously, he should stick them on ebay. I've not seen any of them, but surely they have something to have lasted this long - be it trite humour or, well, SOMETHING?

I have yet to see any hard porn that is erotic. I guess when Constance Money finally gets naked during the last ten minutes of the otherwise crap "Opening of Misty Beethoven" there is some erotic value (based on the looks of the girl on show rather than the actual sex which is, if memory serves me correctly, quite brief).

Russ Meyer's films are awful - boring, dull, turgid rubbish with women sporting oversized, unnatractive boobs.

Mainstream films that are erotic - well Sylvia Kristel always did it for me, but you are right in saying the first Emmanuelle is not so good. The second is an improvement though, and at least these are films with something resembling a plot and the soft focus photography and decent acting (by the standards of the genre) make them a cut above. "The Lover" is toss, "The Piano" is a fine film but not what I'd call erotic. "9 and a Half Weeks" is probably the closest to that.

Yeah, "The Lover" is toss, but it's toss with beautifully filmed beautiful scenery, haha.

I googled "Russ Meyer", and found this:

Russ Meyer is considered by most critics to be one of America’s few cinematic auteurs. This lofty title is usually reserved for the likes of Bergman or Felini. However, after six decades of great film making, Meyer has more than earned it.

I dunno, its ludicrous hyperbole made me laugh anyway - "most" critics? eh... I like "Faster Pussycat! Kill! Kill!! and (especially) "Beyond the valley of the dolls", but the rest of it is shit, as far as I've seen. I didn't much like "9 1/2 weeks" b/c i find mickey rourke annoying. Likewise val kilmer, as it happens, so i doubt i'll be seeing "wonderland" (i assume this is the val k vehicle abt j holmes)

Faster Pussycat, Kill! Kill! is Meyer's only really watchable film ("Beyond the Valley" falls apart in the last half hour with its "everything but the kitchen sink" approach).

It was William Goldman who (with much sarcasm) noted Meyer was an "autuer". In the broadest sense of the word, yes he is, because he does all the technical side of things himself. Still don't like his work though.

By the way, it is a Kilmer film, but I like Val when he's in character mode (he makes an excellent Jim Morrison). I think that bad career choices and a legendary "bad" attitude have sunk him somewhat, but if things had gone different I honestly believe he would have had an Oscar or two by now.

But the last bit, where there's a little moral for each of the characters is the best bit!! Honestly, the dialogue in that film does my fucking head in...