sigh... thread:
He’s listed at 38, but I’m pretty sure Albert Pujols is 40. Today @baseballpro, I lay out new evidence (from Pujols’s own mouth), and then dig into why this happens, and why it matters, and what parts of it *don’t* matter much (Free): https://t.co/HGub38otZd— Matthew Trueblood (@MATrueblood) April 24, 2018
― Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Wednesday, 16 January 2019 22:21 (five years ago) link
or rather link:
https://www.baseballprospectus.com/news/article/39462/rubbing-mud-aging-angel/
only 3 years and $72 million left on his contract
― Karl Malone, Wednesday, 16 January 2019 22:22 (five years ago) link
slowest sprint speed in the majors last year (22.2 ft/s, which, when you put it that way, always seem really fast to me)slowest sprint speed in 2017 (21.8 ft/s)slowest sprint speed in 2016 (22.6 ft/s)8th slowest sprint speed in 2015 (23.5 ft/s)
― Karl Malone, Thursday, 17 January 2019 03:42 (five years ago) link
this will be close when it's all said and done
Pujols career (18 seasons): .302/.382.554Cabrera career (16 seasons): .316/.395/.551
(after 16 seasons Pujols was at .309./.392/.573)
― omar little, Friday, 1 February 2019 20:26 (five years ago) link
wow that's sad
― k3vin k., Friday, 1 February 2019 20:41 (five years ago) link
(cabrera obviously a HOFer, but pujols' fall from the inner circle back to the mere mortals has been a long, slow, sad journey)
― k3vin k., Friday, 1 February 2019 20:42 (five years ago) link
pujols still a little more valuable overall, on average, due to his blazing speed and impressive defensive skills compared to miggy, but yeah :(
― Karl Malone, Friday, 1 February 2019 20:50 (five years ago) link
Pujols w/the Angels: .260/.315/.453
― omar little, Friday, 1 February 2019 20:54 (five years ago) link
to compare to similar "decline phases" from a couple recent HOF guys who fell off a lot from their peak:
Frank Thomas after his MVP runner-up campaign in 2000: .262/.376/.507
Griffey Jr with the Reds/ChiSox/Seattle pt 2: .262/.355/.493
― omar little, Friday, 1 February 2019 20:58 (five years ago) link
that's why Peak Value and Career Value are separate considerations
― a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Friday, 1 February 2019 21:07 (five years ago) link
prince albert pujols, he broketh free agency
― mookieproof, Friday, 1 February 2019 21:10 (five years ago) link
First I've ever heard that Ruth's and Cap Anson's RBI totals are not considered official. I can maybe see that for Anson, but I don't get it for Ruth.
― clemenza, Monday, 29 April 2019 04:33 (five years ago) link
Box scores from the teens and '20s are not all absolutely verified/complete.
― a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Monday, 29 April 2019 11:53 (five years ago) link
It's strange though that the pre-1920 RBIs aren't included in the official totals at all. Mistakes aren't too uncommon, and the "official" totals can easily be adjusted.
― NoTimeBeforeTime, Monday, 29 April 2019 12:45 (five years ago) link
i was trying to think of a solid comparison for Pujols in terms of an all-time great player falling off a cliff. i checked out Frank Thomas, specifically the era after his 2000 MVP runner-up season. During his age 33-39 seasons he accumulated 14.8 bWAR. Albert during that same run (this is his age 39 season, doubt he'll add much to the total and may subtract some, he's at 0.0 bWAR now) has accumulated 8.5 bWAR.
Griffey Jr. put up a 7.1 bWAR during those same seasons.
Beltre, on the other hand, put up 37.6 bWAR. And it's probably not fair to include Barry Bonds but...63.1 bWAR from his age 33-39 seasons.
― omar little, Wednesday, 1 May 2019 16:32 (five years ago) link
when i think of falling off a cliff, i think of andruw
― mookieproof, Wednesday, 1 May 2019 16:38 (five years ago) link
🙌 Mr. 2,000 RBIs 🙌 @PujolsFive tacked on the two-thousandth RBI of his Hall of Fame career with a solo shot in #Detroit! He joins Hank Aaron & Alex Rodriguez as the only #MLBPlayers to ever reach the milestone. Congrats to The Machine! 🔥 pic.twitter.com/jgjvwD9Xvz— MLBPA (@MLB_PLAYERS) May 9, 2019
― mookieproof, Thursday, 9 May 2019 19:20 (five years ago) link
1,329 of those RBIs with the Cardinals, 2001-2011
― these are not all of the possible side effects (Karl Malone), Thursday, 9 May 2019 19:32 (five years ago) link
he is the Aged Compiler :/
― a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 9 May 2019 19:51 (five years ago) link
his fWAR w/LA is a lot lower than his bWAR (6.6 vs 13.3)
even by bWAR's generous standards he's put together a WAR of 3.1 since the beginning of 2015, which is i think equal to what Cody Bellinger did in April.
― omar little, Thursday, 9 May 2019 20:14 (five years ago) link
The stories of fans doing right by players and being rewarded with autographs and such are nice. But Pujols has long been a humble fellow who gets to the heart of the matter. https://t.co/256RvmhZCC— Richard M. Nixon (@dick_nixon) May 9, 2019
― a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Friday, 10 May 2019 15:43 (five years ago) link
saw people being really weird about that on twitter -- like 'how selfish!' or 'what an idiot; he didn't get it authenticated so now it's worthless'
― mookieproof, Friday, 10 May 2019 16:32 (five years ago) link
Ignore the headlines you'll read about this being Albert Pujols' first time back in St. Louis since 2011. Truth is, he never left at all.How Pujols' impact on those with Down Syndrome has continued to grow in STL even as he took a new uniform. https://t.co/5zNJNBtTBL— Jenifer Langosch (@LangoschMLB) June 20, 2019
― a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Friday, 21 June 2019 21:00 (four years ago) link
pujols gets a curtain call in STL after homering to deep left
― i will never make a typo ever again (Karl Malone), Saturday, 22 June 2019 20:37 (four years ago) link
Ricky Horton speaks for us all when he said “of the 20 great moments he had - we’re gonna have to get another piece of paper”
― i will never make a typo ever again (Karl Malone), Saturday, 22 June 2019 20:40 (four years ago) link
scandal: albert pujols' wife diedre says cardinals fans truly are "best in baseball", it's like they never left, and that the HR ranked as the greatest moment in his career.
― i will never make a typo ever again (Karl Malone), Saturday, 22 June 2019 20:47 (four years ago) link
he passed pete rose for 8th place all time in total bases with that HR
― i will never make a typo ever again (Karl Malone), Saturday, 22 June 2019 21:18 (four years ago) link
just a little guy named steve sax up next on that list
jk, next up is babe ruth
2019 is almost in the books.
wrC+ 98, .249/.310/.449, -0.1 fWAR.
since the start of the 2015 season, he's been worth +0.1 fWAR overall, with his 1.6 WAR 2015 season balanced out by his -2.0 2017, and near-zero value for the other 3 years.
only 2 years and $59M left on his contract.
― Sally Jessy (Karl Malone), Wednesday, 18 September 2019 15:50 (four years ago) link
Prince Albert Pujols, he collecteth.
― clemenza, Thursday, 19 September 2019 13:54 (four years ago) link
One key factor is the owners’ increasing use of analytics—sophisticated statistical metrics—to calculate a player’s value to the team and negotiate his salary accordingly. While many players believe that analytics can help improve their on-field performance, others remain skeptical.
“Put a computer on the mound and see if it will throw strikes, or put it at the plate and see if it can hit a fastball,” said future Hall of Famer Albert Pujols in the Los Angeles Angels’ locker room after a Labor Day weekend game.
https://www.thenation.com/article/mlb-moneyball-labor-unions/
not sure if he realizes that pitching machines are computerized, or that a computer-controlled bat with motion sensors could probably hit a fastball, if someone bothered to make it. not that is has anything to do with the point he was trying to make
― It is my great honor to post on this messageboard! (Karl Malone), Tuesday, 8 October 2019 16:59 (four years ago) link
Pitching machines have no soul
― omar little, Tuesday, 8 October 2019 17:12 (four years ago) link
As a player whose career has essentially disintegrated in parallel with the rise of advanced analytics... I'm empathetic of his criticism of the advances. But then I remember dude is making zillions so then my empathy turns to straight up ROFL.
― Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Tuesday, 8 October 2019 17:49 (four years ago) link
prince albert pujols turned 40 last week.
his ZiPS comp for 2020 is 1996 Eddie Murray
― But guess what? Nobody gives a toot!😂 (Karl Malone), Thursday, 23 January 2020 00:03 (four years ago) link
(trout's comp is 1960 mickey mantle)
― But guess what? Nobody gives a toot!😂 (Karl Malone), Thursday, 23 January 2020 00:04 (four years ago) link
only 2 years and $48M left on the contract
https://i.imgur.com/otHLPTe.png
― But guess what? Nobody gives a toot!😂 (Karl Malone), Thursday, 23 January 2020 00:10 (four years ago) link
According to my math, he'll earn $29M for the 2020 season.
― Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Thursday, 23 January 2020 01:13 (four years ago) link
https://blogs.fangraphs.com/zips-time-warp-albert-pujols/
Name G PA WARChuck Klein 196 525 -1.6Jim Bottomley 312 1146 -1.2Larry Doby 39 124 -1.0Willie Keeler 316 1288 -0.8King Kelly 20 73 -0.5Roberto Alomar 196 788 -0.4Lloyd Waner 235 592 -0.4George Kelly 64 226 -0.3Bill Mazeroski 34 72 -0.3Albert Pujols 731 3093 -0.2Joe Tinker 7 12 -0.1Ray Schalk 7 3 0.0Jim Rice 191 770 0.0Hughie Jennings 4 9 0.0
Thirteen Hall of Fame hitters played replacement-level ball or worse starting at age 35. Pujols stands out for the amount of ineffective baseball we’ve seen from him, with the rest of the players on the list retiring either voluntarily or non-voluntarily when it was clear they could no longer contribute in the majors. With guaranteed money and no apparent motivation on either side for a buyout that would lead to a graceful retirement, this has led to an unfortunate secondary result in which we’ve seen Pujols at his worst longer than any other great hitter.
ouch. but then szymborski goes on to ask the tough questions, like, what if pujols had not sucked so badly with the angels? turns out, that would have been pretty awesome!
― Karl Malone, Friday, 4 September 2020 23:36 (three years ago) link
oops [code] mess-up there on the column headers, my bad
on a rate basis, though, damn Larry Doby age 35+ was fucking awful!
― Karl Malone, Friday, 4 September 2020 23:38 (three years ago) link
According to my math, he'll earn $29M for the 2020 season.― Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Wednesday, January 22, 2020 5:13 PM (seven months ago)
― Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Wednesday, January 22, 2020 5:13 PM (seven months ago)
...and $30M for 2021.
― Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Saturday, 5 September 2020 01:12 (three years ago) link
but just think of that thrilling chase for the RBI record!!!
― Karl Malone, Saturday, 5 September 2020 01:18 (three years ago) link
lol, i was joking about that, but that would be a true nightmare scenario for angels fans - an extra incentive to give pujols as many RBI opportunities as possible
― Karl Malone, Saturday, 5 September 2020 01:19 (three years ago) link
am i right in thinking he was never the same after developing plantar fasciitis?
― Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Saturday, 5 September 2020 06:57 (three years ago) link
Surprised Ichiro isn't on that list.
― clemenza, Saturday, 5 September 2020 17:27 (three years ago) link
If you use bWAR, Ichiro is -0.5 for his last 449 games/1071 PA (-1.3 if you limit it to offense).
― clemenza, Saturday, 5 September 2020 17:34 (three years ago) link
I think Fangraphs missed him--using their numbers, Ichiro is -0.1 for the same time frame, which would put him with Joe Tinker.
― clemenza, Saturday, 5 September 2020 17:38 (three years ago) link
oh, i think that list was comparing pujols to hall of famers, only (although ichiro is obv a hall of famer)
― Karl Malone, Saturday, 5 September 2020 17:41 (three years ago) link
which is stiff competition, of course, but i think they were just trying to make the point that out of elite players, pujols has been uniquely awful in his later years
― Karl Malone, Saturday, 5 September 2020 17:42 (three years ago) link