Hot Stove 2023-2024

The twin 84s = 16% below league average

oh wow. stadium is a lot larger than i realized

Phillies extended Zack Wheeler who would have been a free agent next offseason

Zack Wheeler’s 3-year, $126 million extension is the highest annual salary for any contract extension ever.

— Buster Olney (@Buster_ESPN) March 4, 2024

never in a million years did I expect that original Phils/Wheeler contract to work out so well.

Mets let him walk for free, Giants traded him for a Beltran rental…doesn’t look that he really got very good until he went to the Phillies though

Mets couldn’t afford him, he was asking a lot and although they wanted him to stay this was pre Steve Cohen

funny you look back on those staffs with de grom, syndergaard, matz plus the mets acquiring scherzer and verlander and wheeler is the one leading all pitchers in WAR over the last 5 years

was matz ever hyped? he's decent when healthy but i missed the hype train on him earlier on. seems like he could have been really good had his arm not fallen off several times. btw, here is an impromptu test of the "generative AI" google uses now, when i prompted it with "matz injury steven history" (excellent prompt, i know)

Steven Matz, a left-handed pitcher for the St. Louis Cardinals, has had a long injury history. Here are some of his injuries:
July 23, 2022: Knee injury
May 22, 2022: Shoulder injury
May 23, 2022: Left shoulder impingement
May 22, 2022: Elbow injury
August 30, 2020: Shoulder injury
August 14, 2023: Left lat strain
August 2023: Flexor pronator sprain in left elbow

...accurate?

matz was hyped back in the mid 10s as part of that young mets rotation. ppl didn’t think he was better than degrom or syndergaard (ha) but i think if you polled mets fans at the time ppl were as or more excited about matz than they were wheeler. but i could be misremembering

he was pretty hyped iirc. He was a 2nd round draft pic and top 20 prospect by the time he debuted

i think if you polled mets fans at the time ppl were as or more excited about matz than they were wheeler. but i could be misremembering

I don't think you are misremembering, but possibly discounting the fact that Matz was a Long Island kid and lifelong Met fan who had a crazy debut that got everyone excited:

Matz debuted against the Cincinnati Reds at the Mets' Citi Field on June 28, 2015.[21][46][51] His first MLB pitch was a wild pitch to Brandon Phillips,[47][50][52] and later in that at-bat Phillips hit a home run.[48][50] Nevertheless, Matz got the win, giving up two runs, five hits, and three walks,[31][47][50] and striking out six over 110 pitches in 7+2⁄3 innings,[50][53] as the Mets defeated the Reds 7–2.[50][52] Additionally, using a bat gifted to him by Las Vegas teammate Matt Reynolds,[47][48][52] Matz recorded three hits as a batter and drove in four runs.[48][50] His first major league at-bat was a two-run double against pitcher Josh Smith.[47] Matz was the first pitcher in MLB history to record that many hits and RBIs in his debut game, and the 11th player at any position to do so.[48][50] He was also the seventh pitcher since 1914 with three or more hits in his first game, and the first since Jason Jennings of the Colorado Rockies in 2001.[48][50] Matz was the first pitcher and the 26th player in any position in the last 100 years with four RBI in his MLB debut

otm about that first game. he was a sensation in 2015 and was probably their best pitcher in the first half of 2016. but it’s never been the same since then. he would often get emotionally rattled when he got into difficult situations, and then was unable to shake it off (he’s a Mets fan through and through).

Thanks Jeff, I just leaned over the desk and vomited on the floor

Brutal news: Initial imaging showed Boston Red Sox starter Lucas Giolito likely has a partially torn UCL and flexor strain and could miss the 2024 season, league sources tell ESPN. Giolito, who signed a two-year deal with Boston, may need surgery to repair the right-elbow damage.

— Jeff Passan (@JeffPassan) March 5, 2024

Oh no

As noted elsewhere: Sale and Giolito pulling in a combined $36.25m this season from the Red Sox

Sale the poster child for health, famously.

Boras settling into his favourite couch and opening up a family size tub of Combos with his phone right next to him

They’re signing Lorenzen and…who’s washed…Madison Bumgarner. The rotation still needs a lefty!

Giolito had his first TJ as a senior in high school:

Giolito said he gained fortitude persevering through rehab.

“I had the surgery as an 18 year old,’’ he said. “Going through that process helped me develop a certain level of mental toughness that I think has helped me in my career.”

The notebook never fails

Ok but who is the Giants rotation in 2024

Webb
???
Harrison
???
???

Cobb & Ray both injured

Mantra’s a Met, Desclefani’s a Twin, Wood and Stripling both Athletics. Snell incoming? His lack of innings could pair nicely with Webb I guess.

― Roman Anthony gets on his horse (gyac), Friday, February 2, 2024 10:42 AM (one month ago)

Right now it's looking like:

Webb
Harrison
Hicks
Beck (out til August with peripheral aneurysm)
Hjelle (out with elbow sprain)
Winn (elbow soreness)
Mason Black (AA/AAA invite)
Spencer Howard (career 3W-11L 7.20 ERA including 10.80 in 2023)
Spencer Bivens (A/AA invite)
Landen Roupp (A/AA invite)

...

lol

Honestly feel like Snell could land there…good pitchers park, they can pay him, 2 time Cy Young winner from Seattle.

Ouch giolito

Bit of a nail in the coffin moment. Great way to start the documentary. Feel for Giolito

oh wow. had no idea they were doing a doc on the guy. (seems like a kind of a random dude to pick for one)

Nah there's a red sox doc being filmed throughout this season

Would watch a giolito doc though, for any network execs reading along

lol is correct Steve Shasta as I have no idea what the Giants are going to do about pitching. The Giants have spent more than any other team, this off-season, not named the Dodgers. They have to add pitching, right?

two weeks to from now we'll be in about the 4th inning of the first regular season game of 2024. I count the hours; the minutes and the seconds too.

how many hours? i only count the hours

re: giants rotation yeah, i know i mentioned it upthread (or nearby) but jordan hicks can't be relied upon to be in the rotation, imo, for longer than 6 weeks

not that the season really begins there either. it's one game then another week of waiting

168 hours of waiting!

can't complain, though - i love baseball's presence through 3/4 of the year, feb - early november, not to mention all the other stuff that happens, hot stove but also other leagues, throughout the 'off season'. i bet the baseball guys wish the seasons were shorter, but it's such a pleasure to have games on in the background

Two games thinwall! It'll be enough to tie me over for a week at least

Right-hander Brayan Bello and the Boston Red Sox are in agreement on a six-year, $55 million contract extension that includes a seventh-year club option for $21 million, sources tell ESPN.

The Sox lock up the 24-year-old into the 2030s.

— Kiley McDaniel (@kileymcd) March 7, 2024

The sixth year of Bello’s deal covers what would’ve been his first year of free agency, with the club option covering a potential second.

— Kiley McDaniel (@kileymcd) March 7, 2024

Honestly hope he has a huge year, has been hitting the ball hard recently

Mets fans to Tim Anderson: “overrated”

Tim Anderson to Mets fans pic.twitter.com/DICMDsqr8z

— Louis Addeo-Weiss (@addeo_louis00) March 11, 2024

BREAKING: The San Diego Padres are finalizing a trade to acquire right-hander Dylan Cease from the Chicago White Sox, sources tell ESPN.

— Jeff Passan (@JeffPassan) March 13, 2024

ben clemens seems somewhat baffled by both ends of this trade (why the padres are trading for a top-tier pitcher while seemingly being in rebuild mode, why the white sox agreed to this trade over other offers)

The price for Cease was always reported as really high but you have to see the return as their priority, they asked a steeper price for position prospects. The Padres didn’t have to send Merrill or Salas and they got a starter to cover some of their missing innings at a fraction ($8m) of Snell’s cost.

I read that the White Sox consider only Luis Robert Jr untouchable - they have him on an insanely cheap contract of $50m for six years with two team options for 26 & 27 - and Cease was going to walk so they decided to get something for his two years of control.

Reported requests for Cease by the White Sox:

Of note: The White Sox ask for Cease at the trade deadline was a package that INCLUDED Brayan Bello https://t.co/tmalSxFGuM

— Rob Bradford (@bradfo) November 27, 2023

The Yankees, while awaiting news on Gerrit Cole, have re-engaged with the Chicago White Sox and made a new proposal for ace Dylan Cease, but the new offer once again did not include prized outfield prospect Spencer Jones.

— Bob Nightengale (@BNightengale) March 12, 2024

why the padres are trading for a top-tier pitcher while seemingly being in rebuild mode...

― na (NA), Thursday, March 14, 2024 6:08 AM (one hour ago)

ah yes, can't wait to see what becomes of these SD prospects: Machado, Tatis Jr., Bogaerts, Darvish, Musgrove, Kim et al.

they basically traded two non top 50 pitching prospects for a verifiably great starter -- without knowing much about the prospects in question i think that's a pretty defensible trade on its face. it's possible they got a look at thorpe and thought he was overvalued as a prospect. if i was the white sox i'd be a bit worried about acquiring a guy who has now been traded three times. i think the fangraphs article makes some good points about how the team control on cease probably lengthens the padres "window" moreso than just one year of soto. the most interesting part to me is the stuff about how the top trade guys are going for far less than we're used to ... the fact that this prospect package has more or less been used to acquire players of soto's and cease's caliber is pretty crazy considering, like, what the tigers gave up to get miguel cabrera

"rebuild mode" was probably inaccurate, but if they're planning on competing this season, why did they trade soto?

i think their logic on that one was pretty simply that they weren't going to re-sign him and didn't want to lose him for nothing, and they must have thought that what they got from the yankees superseded any offers they would get around the deadline

"rebuild mode" was probably inaccurate, but if they're planning on competing this season, why did they trade soto?

Outfielder Adam Duvall has signed a one-year, $3 million contract with the Atlanta Braves.

— Robert Murray (@ByRobertMurray) March 14, 2024

bless

I think the Padres will try to flip Cease at the deadline for a good young hitter. Right or wrong, Preller doesn't care about pitching prospects. While they could have used the guys they gave up in a similar deal, it's harder to do a prospect-for-prospect swap.

The Padres needed starting major-league ready pitching. Why would they flip Cease for a bat when

1) they can’t afford to pay Snell and Cease actually pitching more innings than Snell relieves some of the pressure on their now Haderless-pen?

2) they had Soto in the lineup last year and still struggled over .500, they had Rich Hill pitching for them!

The bats they have rn:

- Bogaerts
- Tatis
- Machado
- Kim

They’ve basically raised their lineups floor by getting rid of Austin Nola and Matt Carpenter.

Campusano looked pretty good as well and should produce offensively. The catching position should immediately be more productive now that they dropped Austin Nola, and also they’re not giving ABs to Matt Carpenter so they can DH Campusano on days Higashioka catches.

I’m not saying the lineup couldn’t use an extra bat, but they’d be creating a worse problem by trading actual starting pitching away.

hard agree with gyac:

friars lost snell, wacha & lugo which accounted for 360 IP, that's a massive hole that they're only now trying to fill in (Cease & MKing).

I'm not talking about flipping him now. I think they'll trade him at the deadline when they're out of contention.

And when I say young hitter, I'm talking like A/AA level, not a guy to slot into the 2024 roster.

xp and King is a risk cos although he finished last season starting for the Yankees - and was really good starting - he hasn’t pitched a full season as a starter yet.