Confirmed: Ian Buruma is out as editor of the New York Review of Books, following much criticized decision to publish piece by Jian Ghomeshi. "I can confirm that Ian Buruma is no long the editor of The New York Review of Books," said a spokesman— Cara Buckley (@caraNYT) September 19, 2018
― mookieproof, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 17:42 (five years ago) link
:D
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 19 September 2018 17:45 (five years ago) link
Must be a real trip to reach the apex of your profession and then lose all credibility with your entire organization in one fell swoop.
― faculty w1fe (silby), Wednesday, 19 September 2018 17:48 (five years ago) link
aww I was kinda looking forward to my first angry cancellation letter
― Uhura Mazda (lukas), Wednesday, 19 September 2018 17:55 (five years ago) link
itβs not too late
― π§π»ββοΈ F A T π§π»ββοΈ D R A C U L A π§π»ββοΈ (bizarro gazzara), Wednesday, 19 September 2018 17:55 (five years ago) link
I don't know the story here, or whether IB should go over this particular incident -- but I'm instinctively inclined to be glad about this, as I remember him writing a regular Guardian column, maybe 15 years ago, that I found unpleasant and reactionary.
― the pinefox, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 17:57 (five years ago) link
It seems puzzling to me that someone should publish an essay, presumably after lots of discussion, copy-editing, official agreement, etc -- *then* be told (by bosses?) that it was unacceptable.
Wouldn't or shouldn't they have made this clear at an earlier stage?
― the pinefox, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 17:58 (five years ago) link
lol kicker in the NYT story about it
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DneaxZFVYAAA4rW.jpg
― mookieproof, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 17:59 (five years ago) link
Note: the Brixton Review of Books doesn't seem to have any content online?
― the pinefox, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 18:00 (five years ago) link
i would guess that robert silvers published whatever the hell he wanted, so there may have been no apparatus overseeing buruma editorially. i would also guess that his publisher (and buruma himself, obviously) had no idea what kind of firestorm it would bring. i don't know what the NYRB's last major public fracas was, but i'll bet it happened before twitter was available to magnify things beyond a series of angry letters over the following issues
― mookieproof, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 18:07 (five years ago) link
i was a NYRB subscriber from ... 2010 to 2015ish.
i was always a month or three behind reading them. the ability of their US politics writers to make predictions that, in the time it took me to get around to reading the article, turned out to be laughably wrong was notable. i'm sure i'd feel the same way about other politics writing if i read it on a 3 month delay. but the tone was so above the fray that i kind of felt/feel they should do a better job than the news.
their science (and history of science) coverage was (and perhaps is) excellent and afaict unique (serious, accessible, humane, etc.)
daryll pinkney being the fossil they wheeled out (and perhaps the only person on their roster) capable of reviewing ta-nahesi coates earlier this year doesn't bode well. (it was a good review though.)
i've never had an LRB subscription but i read more of their stuff these days via the web. e.g. i have saved 5 LRB pieces this year, and zero NYRB (unless you count the odd blog post, e.g. https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2018/06/17/world-cup-2018-the-yob-swagger-of-inger-land/ was fun).
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Wednesday, 19 September 2018 20:26 (five years ago) link
*Darryl *Pinckney
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Wednesday, 19 September 2018 20:27 (five years ago) link
also: i liked it more when i didn't live in new york. when i lived in mitteleuropa it felt like they might know lots of things i didn't, but it seemed more obviously out of touch when i moved to NYC and had more direct knowledge of the culture/institutions it covers.
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Wednesday, 19 September 2018 20:32 (five years ago) link
Well, look at that...
This is certainly an opportunity for them to re-think the mag and have a more considered approach to who takes over the editorship (I think in large part Buruma was named because he was there and regularly contributing for so long).
I think it would be swell if they went back to two editors and perhaps opted to not continue only under the helm of an older white guy. I don't know if I'm optimistic this will be the case, but you never know...I think they are self-aware enough, like the Paris Review was, not to do it but, you never know.
― Federico Boswarlos, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 20:52 (five years ago) link
Note: the Brixton Review of Books doesn't seem to have any content online?β the pinefox, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
β the pinefox, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
I know its very small, only 2/3 issues and I've only seen it sold in our local 2nd hand bookshop lol.
― xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 20:57 (five years ago) link
I pretty much read the NYROB for Elizabeth Drew.
― The Silky Veils of Alfred (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 19 September 2018 21:00 (five years ago) link
Can believe that although iirc Michael Tomasky was dispassionately assessing Trump's chances and wasn't discounting him.
I think these two papers are not much better than the general media in terms of analysis and prediction (trying to think of Adam Shatz (writing for the LRB) on Egypt but I'm too exhausted to check and assess).
― xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 21:06 (five years ago) link
This is all happening while two new magazines have launched this week in this island of ours. Centre-right Drugstore Culture and democratic socialist Tribune.
― xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 21:09 (five years ago) link
It seems puzzling to me that someone should publish an essay, presumably after lots of discussion, copy-editing, official agreement
i don't know the set-up at the nyrb but i think it unlikely -- and have never imagined -- that there were people senior to IB that he generally had to clear content with: even given his plan to "democratise" that mookieproof cites, he would have been the moral, intellectual and aesthetic conscience and the buck would stop with him
(at least this is what i'd guess: not all publications work like this but it is normally what "editor in chief" means)
in the slate piece he said it had been discussed with his editorial staff and some had said no: but then it was decided and everyone went along -- i forget the exact words but this could well have meant that his staff, or anyway some of them, strongly demurred, and he put his foot down and they acknowledged force majeure and went off to do their jobs muttering to themselves "on yr head be it"
it hadn't -- in my judgment -- been edited, beyond routine proofing for spelling and grammar: to be publishable at all in the context buruma claimed for it in the slate interview it need two or three more serious rewrites and rethinks, with tough editorial notes requiring a whole bunch of stuff (like -- minmally -- accurate descriptions from ghomeshi of what he'd been a accused of!) but clearly none of that had been done
who can say -- there would have been a furore either way -- but i suspect what truly sunk him was the interview, which was jaw-dropping to the point of being weird. (this is what i wrote on the other thread, to save retyping it all):
it's one thing a good editor defending running a strong piece of writing that argues a very bad political line (perhaps even an evil one?): but here we have a self-confessedly* bad editor NOT really defending an eye-stretchingly BAD piece of writing arguing nothing more than he jian ghomeshi is the real victim here.*buruma stating in public that the facts in the case are "not my concern" undermines all his staff and all his writers, and (obviously) spits in the face of his readers, who have the absolutely right to expect otherwise. he might as well have said "i am entirely incompetent and very out of my depth." if he doesn't resign pretty quickly it will destroy the magazine i think.
*buruma stating in public that the facts in the case are "not my concern" undermines all his staff and all his writers, and (obviously) spits in the face of his readers, who have the absolutely right to expect otherwise. he might as well have said "i am entirely incompetent and very out of my depth." if he doesn't resign pretty quickly it will destroy the magazine i think.
my guess is the revolt -- and the demand for his resignation -- came from below not above: editorial staff maybe (tho they had -- so he said -- signed off on it) but much more than that, other contributors threatening to walk, and of course readers
this is the first time i've ever actually posted an angry letter or email demanding someone resign, so this is a gratifyingly quick result! maybe i should write more! (obviously i choose to believe mine is the one that did the trick, it was π₯ π₯ π₯
― mark s, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 21:47 (five years ago) link
The NYRB is for people who think Colm Toibin is a good critic.er..the people at the LRB think so:
https://www.lrb.co.uk/contributors/colm-toibin
β xyzzzz__, Tuesday, September 18, 2018 1:06 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
ha i was gonna say
― flopson, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 21:53 (five years ago) link
i also wrote an email, as did at least a couple other ilxors. i suspect they got a lot more reader feedback than they're used to
― mookieproof, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 21:54 (five years ago) link
Iβm looking forward to the Apology Issue
― faculty w1fe (silby), Wednesday, 19 September 2018 21:59 (five years ago) link
they will run my email on the cover i expect
― mark s, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 22:01 (five years ago) link
i wanna read everyone's angry emails tbh
― macropuente (map), Wednesday, 19 September 2018 22:04 (five years ago) link
Colm Toibin is a poor critic? News to me!
― The Silky Veils of Alfred (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 19 September 2018 22:06 (five years ago) link
nyrb ppl think he's good, lrb ppl think he's bad: it's like melody maker versus nme in the late 80s, and grebo
― mark s, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 22:08 (five years ago) link
i wanna read everyone's angry emails tbhβ macropuente (map), Wednesday, September 19, 2018 6:04 PM (three minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
β macropuente (map), Wednesday, September 19, 2018 6:04 PM (three minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
i would buy this issue
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Wednesday, 19 September 2018 22:09 (five years ago) link
I'm reading Toibin's review of the Gunn collection and so far it's not bad. I've liked several of his novels and have never minded his criticism.
― The Silky Veils of Alfred (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 19 September 2018 22:13 (five years ago) link
β mark s, Wednesday, September 19, 2018 6:08 PM (one hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
in what way do lrb people think heβs bad? heβs in like every other issue
― flopson, Wednesday, 19 September 2018 23:09 (five years ago) link
I don't like the Grenfell piece, but I don't think it represents the political stance of the whole LRB (certainly not all of its contributors) -- more the political stance of its author.
O'Hagan is one of the LRB's 17 million contributing editors, who as far as I can see can publish whatever they like.
That NYRB issue hasn't even been published yet: I wonder if they'll actually run the article that blew up in their faces.
― Mince Pramthwart (James Morrison), Wednesday, 19 September 2018 23:22 (five years ago) link
Interview with Buruma:
βI am embroiled in a big scandal, in the middle of storm on social media,β said Ian Buruma on the phone from New York. βIt is rather ironic: as editor of The New York Review of Books I published a theme issue about #MeToo-offenders who had not been convicted in a court of law but by social media. And now I myself am publicly pilloried.β
― ArchCarrier, Thursday, 20 September 2018 07:37 (five years ago) link
really makes you think
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Thursday, 20 September 2018 07:40 (five years ago) link
it's a pity he was a man
― Neil S, Thursday, 20 September 2018 08:42 (five years ago) link
Twitter runs the NYRB now.
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 20 September 2018 09:35 (five years ago) link
new editors: shanley and the helldude
― mark s, Thursday, 20 September 2018 09:38 (five years ago) link
Flopson: yes, I know that Colm Toibin writes a lot in the LRB. I have said this twice on this thread. That is one reason that I said that my original comment was deliberately glib. The fact that he writes in the LRB is also the reason I have read loads of his essays, and think he is a quite bad and extremely overrated essayist.
Nonetheless, I think that Mark S's joke also has something to it -- I think that CT *is* more respected in the US than the UK. He works there, and anecdotally I have met American scholars who think he is wonderful and couldn't believe I didn't think the same.
The question re whether he is actually good or bad, in any individual's view here, should probably better be discussed on another thread. I think I have probably already said what I thought about it somewhere on this board.
Despite my typical great frustration with his essays I did read his book on Bishop. I'm not sure now if I thought it was better than the essays.
I have read two of his novels - I think they would need separate judgement.
― the pinefox, Thursday, 20 September 2018 10:37 (five years ago) link
It would be a pretty amazing own of Buruma by the disgruntled members of his former staff if the next issue was indeed composed entirely of the angry letters/emails and, of course, tweets of the last few days.
― Federico Boswarlos, Thursday, 20 September 2018 12:14 (five years ago) link
As a reward for making them see sense on this NYRB should commission mark s to review the dril book.
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 20 September 2018 12:47 (five years ago) link
Update, September 20 at 9:36 a.m.: Buruma spoke briefly about his departure to the Dutch outlet Vrij Nederland, saying that he has βbeen convicted on Twitter, without any due process.β He also claims that he resigned from the position and that university presses, who advertise in the NYRB, were threatening a boycott because they feared adverse campus reactions to the Ghomeshi article.
― mookieproof, Thursday, 20 September 2018 14:53 (five years ago) link
Itβs not a trial, dipshit!
― faculty w1fe (silby), Thursday, 20 September 2018 14:55 (five years ago) link
The blaming of the college kids is such a giveaway.
― Frederik B, Thursday, 20 September 2018 14:57 (five years ago) link
oh noes i was convicted on twitter just for being a shithead
(also the magazine would have lost a fuckton of revenue had i stayed on but waaaah social media)
― π§π»ββοΈ F A T π§π»ββοΈ D R A C U L A π§π»ββοΈ (bizarro gazzara), Thursday, 20 September 2018 14:57 (five years ago) link
idk how many college kids are aware of the NYRB enough to pressure university presses -- i'd guess the presses were more scared of a faculty response
(if any of that part is even true)
― mookieproof, Thursday, 20 September 2018 15:02 (five years ago) link
this thread is interesting but buruma doesn't seem like a dutch guy through and through.
his behavior is more simply explained by the fact that he is an old man and the apparent cultural consequences of polder model sound a lot like what you see everywhere else.
you remember my writings, discussions, rants, and other assorted peeves I got with Dutch media's mechanism of "debate"? Buruma, a Dutch guy through and through, tried to polder model sexual abuse and now has to contend with the fact that it is not an acceptable approach https://t.co/d6O4WOdgy6— Flavia Dzodan (@redlightvoices) September 19, 2018
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Thursday, 20 September 2018 15:16 (five years ago) link
how would "campus kids" even stage a boycott of university presses?
(lol except by not doing the reading i guess, a boycott without a discernible effect in many cases amirite?)
― mark s, Thursday, 20 September 2018 15:26 (five years ago) link
(sidebar: i love the word "polder" and the various dutch concepts that supposedly arise from it)
― mark s, Thursday, 20 September 2018 15:30 (five years ago) link
w/Flavia there are no simple explanations (one of the best things about her).
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 20 September 2018 15:34 (five years ago) link
I was quite interested recently to find POLDER as a term within SF criticism.
― the pinefox, Thursday, 20 September 2018 15:49 (five years ago) link
Link please, if possible
― Harper Valley CTA-102 (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 20 September 2018 17:01 (five years ago) link
if "polder" does not appear somewhere in a Fall song I will eat someone's hat
― cheese is the teacher, ham is the preacher (Jon not Jon), Thursday, 20 September 2018 17:26 (five years ago) link
donne piece contains a section of pure Empson, arguing a controversial textual reading via dramatising an imaginary but commonplace scene (he does this with Shakespeare a few times):Whereas, if we look at the matter the other way round, every step is intelligible. One evening around 1600 Donneβs boss, the lord keeper, was giving a dinner party for some other top legal figures and invited his secretary to read them a few of his poems afterward, before the music. Donne felt that this poem, put among some more romantic ones, would suit the old buffers very well, so long as the point of it was left out; as a porner they would like it, but they would feel positively insulted if told that the affair was innocent. So, while dressing for dinner and considering what to read, he drew a line through due to and wrote βmuch lessβ over the top, merely to remind himself on the occasion. He could speak these words so as to sound encouraging and conniving, though they might look bad to a reader; he had no intention of altering his poem permanently. Maybe he crossed out the addition next morning, leaving a complete bafflement for the copyists.it makes you gurgle at the effrontery and audacity of it, almost trolling, and the thing of it is, that i think his reading is (must be actually) the right one, which reverse engineering from that conclusion means he may well not be wrong in his scene (or if not the scene, the motivation for the emendation).
― Fizzles, Saturday, 24 October 2020 10:25 (three years ago) link
couple from the archive: pieces by john gregory dunne on policing in LA, written just after the king beating but before the uprising
https://www.nybooks.com/articles/1991/10/10/law-disorder-in-los-angeles/https://www.nybooks.com/articles/1991/10/24/law-and-disorder-in-la-part-two/
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Saturday, 24 October 2020 21:24 (three years ago) link
also everything by freeman dyson is at least good fun, if not better
https://www.nybooks.com/search/?size=n_10_n&filters%5B0%5D%5Bfield%5D=author&filters%5B0%5D%5Bvalues%5D%5B0%5D=Freeman%20Dyson&filters%5B0%5D%5Btype%5D=all
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Saturday, 24 October 2020 21:26 (three years ago) link
this was true of lots of people who wrote for the nyrb but most notable to me in dyson, perhaps because he lived so long -- the fucking ground they covered was just incredible. dyson would be like 'this one time i was having beers with niels bohr and enrico fermi . . .' yes please tell me everything about your personal interactions with a guy who won his nobel 90 years ago
― mookieproof, Saturday, 24 October 2020 21:58 (three years ago) link
Ha, I just dipped into his review of the James Gleick Newton biography and βWe knew that the fat young man was second in command to Sir Oswald Moseley in the British Union of Fascists, and if his friend Adolf had successfully invaded England he would probably have been our Gauleiter. Being well-brought-up English children, we listened to the fat young man politely and never showed him our contempt.When I was bringing in the harvest and listening to the fat young man, I did not know that he had been the owner of the Newton papers. I learned this two years later from the economist John Maynard Keynes.β
― circles, Saturday, 24 October 2020 23:17 (three years ago) link
Lmao perfect
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Saturday, 24 October 2020 23:38 (three years ago) link
lol
― mookieproof, Sunday, 25 October 2020 02:10 (three years ago) link
Even as a long-term fan, I was beginning to find Patricia Lockwood insufferable in the LRB, but her piece on Nabokov in the new issue is simply delightful.
― Piedie Gimbel, Wednesday, 28 October 2020 19:25 (three years ago) link
I ended up sorta logging boring reactions to my read of the Charles Rosen archive (with links to the relevant pieces)
Terrific piece on Burton and 17th century prose, time to chase protestants:https://t.co/tMURjGOVXR— non consumiamo marx (@xyzzzz__) October 26, 2020
― xyzzzz__, Friday, 13 November 2020 17:56 (three years ago) link
Are you still able to read NYRB pieces? For some reason I can't log on..
― xyzzzz__, Friday, 13 November 2020 17:57 (three years ago) link
Is it really the βNew York Review of Each Otherβs Booksβ?
short answer: yes
― mookieproof, Friday, 29 April 2022 01:44 (two years ago) link
Oh my God? https://t.co/cMhQTen7ne pic.twitter.com/7b8yYqnz7p— Brandon (@blgtylr) May 20, 2023
― mookieproof, Saturday, 20 May 2023 20:01 (one year ago) link
πππ
― xyzzzz__, Saturday, 20 May 2023 20:14 (one year ago) link
Just a little fight.
https://www.nybooks.com/articles/2011/12/22/defending-anthology/
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 25 April 2024 10:07 (one month ago) link
Searched it after I saw that they made up hours before Vendler passed away.
What an extraordinary, touching and generous exchange between Rita Dove and the dying Helen Vendler, a great critic whose loss we mourn. pic.twitter.com/MSH8bbwceu— Ian Duhig FRSL (@ianduhig) April 24, 2024
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 25 April 2024 10:08 (one month ago) link
me and snrub when i die
― mark s, Thursday, 25 April 2024 10:18 (one month ago) link
Lol
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 25 April 2024 12:06 (one month ago) link