Cult Fiction: Classic or Dud?

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This was prompted by the mini-conversation Sarah and I were having about Doctor Who books on the "What have you finished reading lately" thread.

Do you read cult/genre fiction? What are your favorites? How does this affect/inform your view of "serious literature"?

― VengaDan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 18 May 2004 16:00 (twenty-two years ago)

I read sci-fi. I used to read fantasy books but it all got a bit samey. I'm very happy to read trashy historical fiction.

It's all books. The main effect it has is to make me realise that genre fiction tends to be all about the story and often isn't necessarily that well written, but classics in all genres are well-written and tend to break out of their genres.

Dr. Who books I just could never quite get behind, although I hear from some of my nerdier friends that some of them are really very good.

― accentmonkey (accentmonkey), Tuesday, 18 May 2004 16:16 (twenty-two years ago)

I do have to say that one of the best books I read in 1998 was a Doctor Who book (_Alien Bodies_ by Lawrence Miles). Part of it was because he stomped all over a whole bunch of Doctor Who sacred cows and part of it was because his prose style and pacing pushes all of my "WHEEEEEE" buttons.

― VengaDan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 18 May 2004 16:19 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm also a fan of trashy historical fiction, as long as the history isn't too ballsed up. Historical mysteries are particular pleasure... (Somewhere, lurking in the depths of my house, I have a Dr. Who choose-your-own adventure book.)

― Jocelyn (Jocelyn), Tuesday, 18 May 2004 17:12 (twenty-two years ago)

Never read any Dr. Who books, but someday I'd like to. It's almost an identity issue--"Presently I have exquisite taste, of course, yet as a tot I read Philip K. Dick." Always something 'read' as opposed to 'to read'--at least that's how 'tasteful' people I know react to cult fiction.

I don't distingish. For instance, I found The Stone God Awakens by Philip Jose Farmer every bit as pleaurable/useful-to-my-life (if not more so) as my concurrent high school assignment, The Scarlet Letter. Other "trash" they can bury with me in my tomb--Robert E. Howard, Roger Zelazny, any number of Tolkien knock-offs, Clive Barker, and Stephen King. I'm looking forward to the next George RR Martin book for my next fix.

― otto, Tuesday, 18 May 2004 19:27 (twenty-two years ago)

George RR Martin! I'm reading the Wild Card series for the first time, largely due to being massively impressed with his current ongoing series and some of the narrative choices he's made (the things that the members of the central family have gone through are heartbreaking).

― VengaDan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 18 May 2004 20:33 (twenty-two years ago)

i used to read a lot of classic detective/noir fiction: jim thompson, dashiell hammett, david goodis, charles willeford, paul cain, raymond chandler. pop culture studies had reclaimed them as a viable american art form by the time i started reading them, so any stigma of trashiness was removed.

― lauren (laurenp), Tuesday, 18 May 2004 20:52 (twenty-two years ago)

Wow, I'd never heard of the Wild Card series. I was referring to his Song of Fire and Ice thing (next up--A Feast of Crows--Aug. 3rd). I did some looking into those Wild Card books, and I'm thinking about checking them out. Thanks for the tip!

― otto, Tuesday, 18 May 2004 21:39 (twenty-two years ago)

No problem! (Have I mentioned that I CANNOT WAIT FOR AUGUST 3RD????)

― VengaDan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 18 May 2004 21:51 (twenty-two years ago)

This is almost a recurring conversation on these boards. Cult vs Populist, Obscure vs Trash etc.

― Mikey G (Mikey G), Wednesday, 19 May 2004 07:35 (twenty-two years ago)

Bah, whot of Mickey Spillane in that list, Lauren?

― Sarah (starry), Wednesday, 19 May 2004 07:57 (twenty-two years ago)

(Is this the point where I mention that Terry Pratchett's Thief of Time is the best book I read that year? It's probably now or never, I suppose)

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 19 May 2004 10:21 (twenty-two years ago)

better out than in

― Mikey G (Mikey G), Wednesday, 19 May 2004 10:58 (twenty-two years ago)

The problem with genre books is that they write so many of them. Take Louis Lamour. He spins a good yarn, has the cowboy colloquial nailed, relays vivid action and evokes pathos in his characters. Conaugher is top notch. He describes a widow who puts poetic sayings in tumbleweeds. The image of one's heart's longings rolling across the plains with the wind is quite compelling. Of course, it causes cowboys across the west to pull stakes and take on love's quest. The scene where Conaugher takes a rope to a gun fight is a rewarding bit of literary violence. So I love the guy but when I pick up other books I find them - wanting. Forced. Cheap.

Chandler is who does it all - at least in the short stories. Stories, action, language, insight and pith. All in that '40s LA pseudo-tough talk that became the standard for hard-boiled gumshoes.

Who's more frustrating than Dick? His surreal worlds pile ideas on ideas. Your compelled to read on but in the back (and sometimes in the front) of your mind your atmitting to yourself that this part of the book doesn't necessarily follow from that part of the book.

― Robert Burns, Wednesday, 19 May 2004 11:11 (twenty-two years ago)

Am I the only person who is not that enamoured of Chandler? Absurdly convoluted plots, the deadpan schtick can get wearing... I much prefer James M. Cain or Jim Thompson. In Chandler's novels, murder is just a plot device, whereas with Cain, the murder really IS the point. Chandler and Hammett are comedy, Cain and Thompson are tragedy. I don't think Chandler ever wrote anything as good as Cain's first two novels (Postman Always Rings Twice, Double Indemnity).

― Jonathan Z. (Joanthan Z.), Wednesday, 19 May 2004 11:24 (twenty-two years ago)

Jonathan Z. I bet you are right on all accounts. I do love Chandler but I made sure to specify his short stories above because I concede that the novels are a mess. Try The Girl is one of my favorites where the detective (not Marlowe, but just like Marlowe) has a bet with a cop that he can find a murderer before the cop does (another example of murder as a device). It becomes quite poingant by the end.

― Robert Burns, Wednesday, 19 May 2004 11:34 (twenty-two years ago)

This is almost a recurring conversation on these boards.

That doesn't surprise me, given the threads I scanned before posting this. Really, I'm looking for book recommendations. ;-)

Andrew, _Thief Of Time_ is a FUCKING STELLAR BOOK and really shows that Pratchett still has the goods to spin out a great multi-faceted story. This more than anything else gives me high hopes for _Monstrous Regiment_.

― VengaDan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 19 May 2004 12:57 (twenty-two years ago)

Is cult fiction the same as genre fiction?

I always used to spit feathers at 'cult' sections in bookshops, because it seemed like such a random ghettoisation, and why will someone who enjoyed 'On the Road' necessarily enjoy 'Fight Club' or whatever other strange bedfellows are relegated to that section? or for that matter why should they be subtly directed away from Jane Austen or Raymond Carver or Dickens or whatever resides in 'mainstream'? I say bung it all in together and encourage more serendipity.

― Archel (Archel), Friday, 21 May 2004 13:27 (twenty-two years ago)

But used like that it just means "angry white student male", 'Chel!

― Gregory Henry (Gregory Henry), Friday, 21 May 2004 13:29 (twenty-two years ago)

Exactly! A category which, while obviously lucrative for booksellers, should be laughed out of existence by the rest of us.

― Archel (Archel), Friday, 21 May 2004 13:56 (twenty-two years ago)

We should all become book bandits and mix up all the categories and write completely unrelated "If you like...you'll love..." tags for the shelves.

― Jocelyn (Jocelyn), Friday, 21 May 2004 14:55 (twenty-two years ago)

Is cult fiction the same as genre fiction?

Not really; I wanted a thread title reminiscent of "Pulp Fiction"; also I was specifically thinking of Doctor Who books when I started the thread (and you can't say THAT isn't a cult!).

― VengaDan Perry (Dan Perry), Friday, 21 May 2004 15:10 (twenty-two years ago)

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