buying a bike

I don't know, I've never ridden carbon. I worry about long term durability of carbon, especially given the terrible quality of the roads round here. I don't want to hit a pothole, spill and have to junk the frame. Steel and Ti are not out of the question either. I guess I need a hit-list of things to try.

I worry about long term durability of carbon, especially given the terrible quality of the roads round here. I don't want to hit a pothole, spill and have to junk the frame. Steel and Ti are not out of the question either. I guess I need a hit-list of things to try.

― American Fear of Pranksterism (Ed), Thursday, March 18, 2010 9:05 AM (49 minutes ago)

sounds like me pre-carbon bike. Ed, you and I are similarly built ja? I was in the market for an aluminum frame and the shop that I ended up purchasing from has a semi-pro team and showed me 2 versions of the frame I was interested in made by a major manufacturer (*cough*cervelo*cough*) and showed me 2 frames that had been raced on (ie, not trained on, just raced): the first had major fatigue in the BB and then second had a significant fail (shorn off where the Front Derailleur clamps on to the seattube!)... and these were ridden by little guys (130-150#ers who I'm sure are wattage-monsters but still!). I eliminated aluminum from my list after that.

basically the way the shop owner put it to me is that aluminum frames are awesome if you're sponsored and can afford to race on them and retire them when the season is over, but if you are looking for long-term durability: carbon/steel/Ti.

another thing: all carbon frames are made different. some are butted/jointed/lugged, some are monocoque, some are experimental (I saw a dude riding one of those "webbed" looking frames that are transparent and look like they'd shatter over a bump but are supposedly just as strong as most carbon frames).

also, all carbon is different. there is the stuff made in Taiwan, and then there is the USA-military grade stuff that cannot be exported that Cannondale uses on their super high end which is supposedly best in class. ymmv.

ti is really real

Al work hardening does concern me as well.

i guess it comes down to:

Lower end Trek, Focus, Cannondale, Look, Felt etc. in Carbon

That Motebcane Titanium bike that Bikes Direct do and I remain slightly suspicious of (what precisely is wrong with a $2000 Ultegra Ti Bike?)

Picking up at 10-20yr old high end steel or Ti frame on ebay and building it out.

Titanium + Ultegra - x = $2000

What is x?

x = life expectancy of the child slaves welding the frame
x = weld quality
x= alloy

What's wrong with steel?

imo steel has many pros but the main con is the weight compared to the weight of the other materials. wouldn't make much of a difference with me, but for a spindly mantis-like fellow it may.

what kind of fellow are you? ;)

;_;

lol

lol

It think that should be the name of ILX's Sportive Club.

Ti seems to be cheap this year because of Market forces. So now I have a Ti hitlist:

Motobecane LeChampion Ti with FSA/Ultegra Mix, $1699
Motobecane LeChampion Ti with Ultegra, $2000

People seem to like it, a little more compliant than Carbon, semi compact geometry

Planet-X Pro Sport Ti Frame and Fork only, $1179
Veloce Build Kit, $999
Rival Build Kit, $1099
105 Build Kit, $1150

This is a Lynskey build frame, compact geometry, looks more trick than the Motobecane, etched decals

Habanero Classic Road, Frame Only $895
Habanero Classic Road, 105 $2223
Habanero Classic Road, Rival $2273

US made frame, not butted tubes, again seems to be liked, classic geometry.

Next up, carbon and steel

Carbon List

Planet X PRo CArbon Road
Specialized Roubaix
Trek Madone 4.5
Focus Cayo
Felt F5
Felt Z5
Scattante CFR
Raleigh Competition
Fezzari Foré CR2
Motobecane Immortal Spirit

I like the idea of having a Raleigh as my first ever road bike was a Raleigh. I'm sure there is more that I could dig up. It's incredible the range of equipment standard on a c. $2000 carbon bike.

i like specialized or felt

This BMC is looking pretty sweet:

http://www.competitivecyclist.com/road-bikes/frame/2009-bmc-road-racer-sl-01-sram-rival-complete-bike-6950.html

That was almost the same exact kind of deal that was tempting me last year (08 cervelo S1 with 09 Ultegra SL) but again it came down to frame material (ie, Aluminum). That said, $1700 is a kick-ass deal.

the look 566 w/ rival on comp cyclist looks a great deal too - although that's $2700, so it's a fair jump up in ca$h unfortunately.

that BMC looks siiiick

So I've been watching Milan San Remo and researching bikes and using ILX as my notebook.I think top of my hitlist is either of the BMCs or the Felt, based on pure gut feeling and looks. The only thing stopping me from dropping $1700 on the SL01 right away is the fact I discounted Aluminium at the start of this process. There are at least BMC and felt dealers in town so I can go and try an approximation to both of these.

unfortunately BMC dealer is not open on sundays and i have committed to go biking and bike mechanicking this afternoon. Open late on Monday though. should probably try the trek and specialized as well.

BMC SL01 Rival
http://www.competitivecyclist.com/road-bikes/frame/2009-bmc-road-racer-sl-01-sram-rival-complete-bike-6950.html

Pros: looks very trick, orange is me, not full carbon, under budget
Cons: not full carbon

BMC SLT01
http://www.competitivecyclist.com/road-bikes/frame/2009-bmc-team-machine-slt-01-sram-force-complete-bike-6949.html

Pros: More Carbon, force gruppo, top tube more horizontal
cons: busting the budget, cutty will disapprove of replica BMC team colours

Scott CR1 Team 105
https://www.racycles.com/product.aspx?catid=2,445,909&pid=3725

Pros: full carbon
Cons: a bit boring looking

Felt F5 105
https://www.racycles.com/product.aspx?catid=2,441,619

Pros: Full Carbon Horizontal Top Tube, looks good, no temptation to jump up a model (too much green or garmin argyle), can try the F4 in pittsburgh which should be good for the frame sizing
Cons: can't find any

Specialized Roubaix Elite 105
http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bc/SBCBkModel.jsp?spid=39265&menuItemId=0

Pros: can actually try this in pittsburgh
Cons: busting the Budget

Eddy Merckx EMX-1
https://www.racycles.com/product.aspx?catid=2,432,608&pid=3708

Pros: natural step form my alu team
Cons: Really busting the budget, the look haitch posted is a way better deal, Merckx paint jobs aren't a fun as they used to be

Trek Madone 4.5 105

Pros: Can try this in pittsburgh, friend of a friend works in the trek store
Cons: Irrational Dislike of Trek

Planet-X Pro Carbon SL lots of gruppo options

Pros: cheaper frame, better gruppo, force under budget, only thing I found with campy, 2 year warranty on the frame, planet-x/On-one seem to have a good rep back home
cons: don't do chorus or athena, only veloce or record, record busts the budget

Planet-X Pro Ti Road Veloce, or Rival
Pros: frame looks trick, has a good pedigree
Cons: not actually in stock

Focus Cayo Team ultegra
http://www.bikebling.com/Focus-Cayo-Team-Replica-Complete-Bike-p/focus-cayo-teamreplica-2009.htm

Pros: Trad geometry, Ultegra
Cons: Milram colours

using ILX as my notebook

^^^ this is dope. v. interesting.

CR1s are really popular down here, though more in the old version - that new one you posted has more relaxed geometry apparently.

makes me want new bike, stoked 4 u ed!

only get SRAM imo

SRAM does seem to be the way to go. I just have a soft spot for campy even if there is no earthly reason to choose it.

OK, so the difference between the two BMCs on Competitive Cyclist is 500g more or less. Thats something I can loose if I stop eating breakfast for a week or don't hydrate properly. I could weight weenie that out over time if it really mattered to me. What difference am I going to feel between Aluminium (with carbon seat stays) and carbon? Bear in mind that I am used to the comfortable squish of the surly steel and don't have a good mental picture of the ride on my merckx, it's been too long.

Also, compact vs trad geometry, this is irrelevant and all about the best fit, right? I have an a prejudice against compact based on being a big fellow and not wanting too much seat tube exposed, any views in this?

sram vs. campy vs. shimano is a very complicated endeavo(u)r that comes down to a variety of variables. well, campy is easy to eliminate because of price. but w/r/t shimano vs. sram: it's all a matter of feel and comfort and taste in shifting styles. i know cutty prefers sram because he can shift in the sprint easier (although i can shift in a sprint, i think this might be more of a brifter positioning/bar choice?) and he also prefers the anatomics of the sram hood to the shimano.

i feel shimano's shifting mechanics are more intuitive than sram which was the top priority for me.

I loathe shimano shifting! the brake lever moves when u shift! gross!

not entirely true! only when your front derailleur upshifts or when your rear derailleur downshifts.

still

Three bike stores today after shaking myself out on the hazlewood avenue hill. Truly not the day to be looking at bikes, its the first sunday of spring and lots of little jimmys and janes need new bikes for the summer. Also, Pittsburgh runs a little small so this meant 2 out of three stores didn't have the right bikes in the right size for me to try. First store was the best, short staffed but swamped for them being big meant I could have the pick of the closeout stuff because they have more leftovers in large sizes. Shopgirl there seemed vey keen on putting something together to beat what I could find on the internet. She sent me off on a Cannondale carbon 6 which was an instant revelation not having ridden carbon before. So sharp, so tight, I could get used to this.

Hot, tattooed shopgirl is a stan for the CAAD 9 so wants me to come back in the the week to try that and a specialized roubaix and work out what they have in closeouts.

Shop two was the felt dealer, the guy in there was a bit less helpful but he did have to deal with a mainly teenage labour force and a mother who was insitant that her 10 year old son would have a 'proper' mountain bike whatever that is and it would last 5 years. To accomodate little jimmy's growth he rode out on something with wheels nearly up to his chest and no seatpost extension. He didn't have an F5 or F4 in my size but sent me out on an X45. A combination of it being too small and it being a tiagra bike with a massive stem rise meant I was really upright so couldn't really get a feel for it but it felt all wrong. He's going to get in a big F4 for the end of the week for me to try. (Not sure if I can stretch to the F4 be he's happier to have that in stock as he sells more of them)

He sent me out on a jamis xenith comp as well, which I wasn't that into and mercifully it flatted out after 200m with a sidewall blowout.

Then on to the trek store. No Madone anything in my size so test rode a aluminium gary fisher (carbon rear stays). Softer ride at the front end, whilst still being tight at the back, didn't dislike it but didn't drive me wild. 61 may be a better fit than the 58, I think but they only had the tiagra setup in a 61 and this again comes with the high rise stem. No other trek store in pittsburgh has a madone in my size and they weren't prepared to get one in on the offchance and I don't care enoguh to pursue it.

On then to the bmc dealer, probably on tuesday. I think it will end up being a toss up between the bmcs from competitive cyclist and whatever closeouts the first store has.

Also, this years carbon 6 is black and gold (yellow). Although it shouldn't matter it is kind of cool to be in a city where everything from the nfl team to the roller derby all wear the same colours for sports.

I don't think Tiagra requires a high rise stem?

It doesn't but the bikes that fit it tend to be aimed at a more relaxed rider so they tend to come with a stem that gives a more upright position.

I'm sure you could ask them to fit a racier stem without any worries. Tiagra's a decent groupset, but even if you're not buying a Tiagra bike it'd be good to have it at least set up like a bike you might buy.

Absolutely, wasn't going to happen today though. I think on the felt it wad too small anyway. The Gary Fisher I don't care enough about.

Also, this years carbon 6 is black and gold (yellow). Although it shouldn't matter it is kind of cool to be in a city where everything from the nfl team to the roller derby all wear the same colours for sports.

― American Fear of Pranksterism (Ed), Sunday, March 21, 2010 1:14 PM (3 hours ago)

Live strong my friend, live as strong as the Allegheny steel.

I'm really hoping the BMCs ride well because they just look so so good.

What I have learnt today, 59cm is about the right top tube length for me.

hello ILTRMB, it's been a while. I'm torn between the following 3 bikes (to be bought on the cycle to work scheme, they're pretty much making the budget as I need to get pedals, shoes etc on top). I'm really racking my brains what to get, do want something slightly different, but I do need to buy through Evans thanks to work:

Fuji Roubaix 3 - not common in the UK, but looks nicely 80s, decent groupset for the price too:
http://www.evanscycles.com/product_image/image/794/de5/271/47882/product_page/fuji-roubaix-30-2010-road-bike.jpg

Genesis Aether 10, rather nice looks, but groupset is basic. Is a ridgeback tho.
http://www.evanscycles.com/product_image/image/794/de5/271/47882/product_page/fuji-roubaix-30-2010-road-bike.jpg

last up - a felt 95, looks proper, very decent setup for the price, shame about the Garmin livery
http://www.evanscycles.com/product_image/image/e9f/892/77f/47149/product_page/felt-f95-2010-road-bike.jpg

oops, that genesis ain't right

http://www.evanscycles.com/product_image/image/165/65b/9f9/47849/product_page/genesis-aether-10-2010-road-bike.jpg

So yeah - any thoughts? recommendations?

close-run thing, i'd maybe go for the felt.

this honky tonk looks like fun!

in what godforsaken world is a welded sloping top tube bike with straight blades "retro looking"? i get that its steel with a panel paint job but...

nice bike tho

btw u nice for not replying "the world where u super old" zing etc

LOL U OLD FAT MANTIS!

Felt makes an F95 w/o the team colors…

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/multimedia/archive/01409/mantis_1409722f.jpg

dude on my club is selling this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Garneau-Sonix-6-4-Pro-2009_W0QQitemZ140393176900QQcmdZViewItemQQptZRoad_Bikes?hash=item20b015df44#ht_943wt_1072

for $1950... too bad it's a M, think may be too small for you Ed.

I think it would have to be an XL for me, but that looks sweet.

Rain has slowed this process down. Tried to try some BMCs on saturday but the local store has almost zero stock as BMC is "between distributors", which is presumably why competitive cyclist has a bunch of '09 stock cheap. I did their fit calculator on saturday and I'm leaning towards a 59cm SLT01, although I'm reluctant to buy without having ridden. However payday approaches and I kind of want to place the order then.