In my mind, never has a band been so easily divided between use and uselessness:
USE: the debut (hell, even the pre first album stuff, it gave the Cocteau Twins their name after all) through Sparkle in the Rain, slightly flawed as that might have been (it still has "Waterfront" and a great cover of "Street Hassle," that works for me). Reel to Real Cacophony is one of the most bizarre and wonderful sophomore albums ever, like if, I dunno, Radiohead released Amnesiac after Pablo Honey or something, and Empires and Dance through New Gold Dream is as close to a surging imperial procession through a time and sound as anything else, post-punk scaled for arenas that unlike U2 placed the prominence on the music over the voice and the 'message' (no, really -- Jim Kerr so often sounds like he's being carried along by the music or is cutting across it instead of trying to dominate it).
USELESS: they record some other guy's song, score a hit with it, I learn to hate it from the moment I first heard it, and then Once Upon a Time and everything else from there on in, maybe a couple of songs aside, is a grueling extended disaster. I still have a copy of Street Fighting Years around and it's probably one of the most bombastic and utterly ridiculously over the top albums ever. They started out transcending whatever the Dublin foursome could bring to the stadia and by that time were doing even more damaging things than them, frightening. The recent covers album...oh god, don't get me started.
Trying to think of what influence if any they had is interesting. Jess inadvertantly made me thought of this on the Radiohead round table debate thread because I thought that Echo was a poor comparison to Thom and company and I realize that SM might be a better one, a band who has a public profile in the States but might not be seen as at the center of things, despite many obsessed fans...
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 5 June 2003 03:58 (twenty years ago) link
― JesseFox (JesseFox), Thursday, 5 June 2003 04:06 (twenty years ago) link
didn't they get sampled by raven maize a few years back. sorry thats all.
― gallantseagull, Thursday, 5 June 2003 04:11 (twenty years ago) link
― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Thursday, 5 June 2003 04:30 (twenty years ago) link
― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Thursday, 5 June 2003 04:31 (twenty years ago) link
I can't argue with that...at all.
― Paul Cox (paul cox), Thursday, 5 June 2003 04:32 (twenty years ago) link
Even in the good old days, though, quality control wasn't really their thing, and I'm tempted to say they were a singles band: "I Travel," "Love Song," "The American" -- those first few where they're flirting with the New Romantic movement are so great, and hold up much better than most of the club-rock of that era. And "Themes From Great Cities" should be recognized as one of the great instrumental rock tracks of the '80s (I actually used it in the early '90s for some public access cable show, and after we screened it ten different people asked me, "What was that amazing music?")
After that... well, I think they were always going to do whatever they had to do to make it big, and if that meant hopping on the Celtic Rock bandwagon along with U2 and Big Country, then so be it. So my expiration date is a little earlier than yours, though again the singles off New Gold Dream and Sparkle in the Rain were pretty fine. I still get that descending keyboard riff from "Up On The Catwalk" stuck in my head at odd times, and "Waterfront" and "Someone Somewhere in Summertime" make artsy pomposity seem so damn soulful.
But after that, toss it all: I saw them on the Once Upon A Time tour in '85 or whenever, and they were pretty bad. Shriekback opened, and wiped the floor with 'em. If they haven't called it a day yet -- and Jim Kerr doesn't seem the type to stop flogging that horse -- I say we punish him with dudness until he relents, or at least commisions a decent Best Of.
― Sean Thomas (sgthomas), Thursday, 5 June 2003 04:43 (twenty years ago) link
the stuff pre-"don't you" is somewhat hit-or-miss, but mostly pretty solid and just about every record from that time has at least something to recommend it. real to reel cacaphony, empires and dance, and new gold dream had an interesting roxy music-meets-kraftwerk sound to it. and something like "theme for great cities" was the greatest kraftwerk song that ralf und florian never made. things started getting a little bombastic around sparkle in the rain, though it's still quite good (a bit like what echo & the bunnymen would've sounded like if ian mccullough wasn't so whiny).
― Tad (llamasfur), Thursday, 5 June 2003 04:44 (twenty years ago) link
I just tried to order a couple of the re-issues online and the bastards sent me the old versions, so my reacquisition of their back catalog is on hold until I get that sorted out.
I have Sons and Fascination here on vinyl however, and I love it. It somehow complements American architecture perfectly, it's such a modernist building of an LP. A huge empty sound that fills up all that concrete and nothingness. I'm continuously surprised that freeway interchanges don't sprout from the ground whenever I play "Themes for Great Cities."
Anyway, I like the Breakfast Club theme, but agree it was their downfall. I'd try and make the case for Once Upon a Time though... I don't like the album so much, but I love the double live release that has many songs from it.
Also search "Hunter and the Hunted" from New Gold Dream.
― fortunate hazel (f. hazel), Thursday, 5 June 2003 06:01 (twenty years ago) link
― fortunate hazel (f. hazel), Thursday, 5 June 2003 06:03 (twenty years ago) link
I recently played 'I Travel' for the first time in about 10 yrs and was astonished by how bloody thunderously good it is.
Oh and I really love 'Don't You Forget About Me' - even though Kerr's hooting is pretty silly.
― Dr. C (Dr. C), Thursday, 5 June 2003 06:07 (twenty years ago) link
― willem (willem), Thursday, 5 June 2003 06:25 (twenty years ago) link
That is all.
― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Thursday, 5 June 2003 10:07 (twenty years ago) link
― Pripton Weird (flowersdie), Thursday, 5 June 2003 10:14 (twenty years ago) link
― Patrick South (Patrick South), Thursday, 5 June 2003 11:21 (twenty years ago) link
R2RC would probably still make it as one of my 25 favourite albums - jagged and carnivalesque with that last-gasp-of-the-70's electrourban concrete-subway harshness & alienation scattered through it
E&D has a looming thunderous quality and depth of sound which anticipates the best that 80's production was to offer (eg Fear Of Gods sounds like prototype-Propaganda to me)
S&F/SFC was like listening to big-idea architecture(+ great as accompaniment to overnight motorway drive - nr-empty urban stretch of M6 level with Manchester/Liverpool at 4am while 'theme for great cities' or 'sound in 70 cities' blasts out = wonderful)
their swelling up into tinselled plum puddings starts on some of NGD(albeit glorious title track uses those tendencies in a way that works)
the rest should probably have been silence
― Snowy Mann (rdmanston), Thursday, 5 June 2003 12:06 (twenty years ago) link
Dr. C is OTM as always. I remember the po(m)p and drama of New Gold Dream came as a pleasant surprise at the time but their subsequent descent into U2-style bombast and vacuity was sadly rapid.
― Stewart Osborne (Stewart Osborne), Thursday, 5 June 2003 12:52 (twenty years ago) link
― Rockist Scientist, Thursday, 5 June 2003 13:03 (twenty years ago) link
(I could find an analogy in history yesterday when my friend asked me this question: "Is you going on about early Simple Minds the same as Jode going on about early Whitney Houston?" (!!!) (or should that be (??)).
― Cozen (Cozen), Thursday, 5 June 2003 13:03 (twenty years ago) link
Once Upon a Time - a huge letdown. Joined the ranks of OMD.
― dave225 (Dave225), Thursday, 5 June 2003 13:10 (twenty years ago) link
― Cozen (Cozen), Thursday, 5 June 2003 13:12 (twenty years ago) link
No.
Ned has summed it up pretty well. I used to like "Don't you forget about me" when I was a kid, but now it seems silly and I can't help but associate it in my mind with some horrible 80s yuppie aesthetic.
― Nicole (Nicole), Thursday, 5 June 2003 13:12 (twenty years ago) link
― Rockist Scientist, Thursday, 5 June 2003 13:13 (twenty years ago) link
― Andy K (Andy K), Thursday, 5 June 2003 13:28 (twenty years ago) link
― Sean (Sean), Thursday, 5 June 2003 14:00 (twenty years ago) link
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 5 June 2003 14:28 (twenty years ago) link
― Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 5 June 2003 16:16 (twenty years ago) link
Sparkle in the rain is execrable apart from Waterfront which is one of the records from that period which tried to take on U2's bombast and actually suceeded.
Aren't they back to doing some trancey electro stuff now?
― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Thursday, 5 June 2003 20:43 (twenty years ago) link
I totally disagree with Ned, "Don't You Forget About Me," while totally cheesy, is the only Simple Minds song I'd care to hear again (ok, MAYBE "Alive And Kicking" if I get to dance around Bono-style to it).
― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Friday, 6 June 2003 00:16 (twenty years ago) link
See, this is the problem, which you must overcome. ;-)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 6 June 2003 00:24 (twenty years ago) link
― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Friday, 6 June 2003 00:31 (twenty years ago) link
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 6 June 2003 00:35 (twenty years ago) link
― Sean (Sean), Friday, 6 June 2003 01:31 (twenty years ago) link
― Sean Thomas (sgthomas), Friday, 6 June 2003 01:52 (twenty years ago) link
― fortunate hazel (f. hazel), Friday, 6 June 2003 01:55 (twenty years ago) link
― ara, Friday, 6 June 2003 02:54 (twenty years ago) link
― blutroniq (blutroniq), Friday, 6 June 2003 04:32 (twenty years ago) link
I'll defend Real Life somewhat - couple of the songs on there are OK and are mostly salvaged by Mel Gaynor's incredible drumming (he's #1 on my unheralded drummer list)
― Chris Barrus (Chris Barrus), Saturday, 7 June 2003 06:05 (twenty years ago) link
― Snowy Mann (rdmanston), Thursday, 12 June 2003 12:29 (twenty years ago) link
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 12 June 2003 13:31 (twenty years ago) link
― frenchbloke, Thursday, 12 June 2003 13:53 (twenty years ago) link
* This may not be true, but I can't prove that it's untrue either.
― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Friday, 13 June 2003 00:22 (twenty years ago) link
― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Friday, 13 June 2003 00:25 (twenty years ago) link
Definitely one of the best in my book, though choosing between it and Empires and Dance is nearly impossible.
― Andy K (Andy K), Friday, 13 June 2003 00:26 (twenty years ago) link
― Sean Thomas (sgthomas), Friday, 13 June 2003 00:30 (twenty years ago) link
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 13 June 2003 00:36 (twenty years ago) link
― Andy K (Andy K), Friday, 13 June 2003 00:40 (twenty years ago) link
What in tarnation?
― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Friday, 13 June 2003 00:42 (twenty years ago) link
TS: Miccio's Bono-dancing or Paul Stanley's foxy-dancing!
― Tad (llamasfur), Friday, 13 June 2003 01:57 (twenty years ago) link
― fortunate hazel (f. hazel), Friday, 13 June 2003 02:09 (twenty years ago) link
Where I come from I Travel was nauseatingly ubiquitous. It's cool though. Decades have passed.
― everything, Friday, 11 December 2015 23:00 (eight years ago) link
Holy cow, the X5 box is going for $75 and up. I guess print runs these days are miniscule.
― Gerald McBoing-Boing, Sunday, 24 January 2016 02:36 (eight years ago) link
And even more on Amazon! Glad I picked it up.
― Austin, Sunday, 24 January 2016 02:52 (eight years ago) link
Listening to the 5x5 live album. I'm not a big live album guy but this is shockingly fun. Whoever's doing the bass lines is killing it. It's more guitar focused than the studio takes but it all sounds great and the song choices flow really well.
― Gerald McBoing-Boing, Sunday, 20 August 2017 19:52 (six years ago) link
the bass player was some guy from danny wilson if you can remember them. can't be easy filling derek forbes shoes though
― plp will eat itself (NickB), Sunday, 20 August 2017 21:19 (six years ago) link
It's an enjoyable album if you can overlook the fact that Jim sings songs like Factory and Calling Your Name like they were on Street Fighting Years
― PaulTMA, Monday, 21 August 2017 14:36 (six years ago) link
love that bass guitar ZAP sound that occurs at the end of every (other?) measure during "seeing out the angel".. simple but badass..like getting electrocuted but funky
― brimstead, Monday, 21 August 2017 23:38 (six years ago) link
simple minds, demigods of bass slappage and poppage
― brimstead, Monday, 21 August 2017 23:39 (six years ago) link
So there's a new album, and there's a new promo photo.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DPGfT72VQAIzOrV.jpg:large
This has garnered various reactions. A friend made an edit:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DPGslppVoAALtpb.jpg:large
― Ned Raggett, Monday, 20 November 2017 21:06 (six years ago) link
Oh yeah, this band are still going and didn't break up in 1984 like I often pretend they did.
― Gholdfish Killah (Turrican), Monday, 20 November 2017 21:11 (six years ago) link
rotten bastards - surely one of them could have helped jim up off the floor?
― damian green is people (NickB), Monday, 20 November 2017 21:12 (six years ago) link
Charlie's not paid enough for that now.
― Ned Raggett, Monday, 20 November 2017 21:13 (six years ago) link
after all jim's done for him too
― damian green is people (NickB), Monday, 20 November 2017 21:14 (six years ago) link
Man, do I dislike their Breakfast Club anthem
― morning wood truancy (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 28 March 2018 01:02 (six years ago) link
You don’t seem to say much about the song itself (you know, musically)?
― absorbed carol channing's powers & psyche (morrisp), Wednesday, 28 March 2018 01:16 (six years ago) link
I saw the Simple Minds a few weeks ago. As alcoholic dementia is setting in I'll say it was a fine show (I have no capacity to evaluate quality of live performance for bands covering their own past glory). Worked well enough but I have been obsessed with Simple Minds videos since that night due to alcoholic dementia.
In particular I have been listening to "All the Things She Said, the first line of which I have been trying to parse and can only arrive at "Don't you look back on a bagel or swirl."
This AM I googled the lyrics and apparently it's "Don't you look back on a big lost world." I think that's fucking total BS. Listen to it clearly, he's saying "bagel."
Get fucked, LyricsDB.com
― fields of salmon, Friday, 19 October 2018 00:56 (five years ago) link
From our local paper, seems like a nice guy:
The brother of the lead singer of Simple Minds has been jailed for nine years after a judge deemed he was a danger to the public after stalking two fans.Paul Kerr, brother of rock star Jim Kerr, accused J0hn Fagan of rape and murder and threatened to sexually assault his wife Julie in what started out as an online spat over the Don’t You (Forget About Me) band’s latest album.
Paul Kerr, brother of rock star Jim Kerr, accused J0hn Fagan of rape and murder and threatened to sexually assault his wife Julie in what started out as an online spat over the Don’t You (Forget About Me) band’s latest album.
https://www.theargus.co.uk/news/18141149.simple-minds-jim-kerrs-brother-paul-kerr-jailed-nine-years-stalking-fans/
― Death to (NickB), Monday, 13 January 2020 09:53 (four years ago) link
9 years is a long sentence. I was going to say that prison sentences in Scotland are usually a lot shorter than in England when I realized this trial was in England.
― Frozen Mug (Tom D.), Monday, 13 January 2020 10:45 (four years ago) link
yeah it does sound p severe for an online argument, but his previous offences are a bit of a worry:
“I note that your previous convictions both arose out of seemingly innocuous business disputes, one which resulted in the victim’s home being set alight and the second in you breaking into the victim’s home and assaulting them with a weapon.“I therefore find that you pose a significant risk to members of the public of serious harm occasioned by you.”
“I therefore find that you pose a significant risk to members of the public of serious harm occasioned by you.”
― Death to (NickB), Monday, 13 January 2020 10:51 (four years ago) link
Are we sure he never played drums for the Housemartins?
― Frozen Mug (Tom D.), Monday, 13 January 2020 11:47 (four years ago) link
haha
― Death to (NickB), Monday, 13 January 2020 12:05 (four years ago) link
the Don’t You (Forget About Me) band
ouch
― the girl from spirea x (f. hazel), Monday, 13 January 2020 15:39 (four years ago) link
fuck. reading the story the spark of the campaign of abuse was mr fagan replying to a facebook post by paul kerr saying the new simple minds album was "pure shit".
― bidenfan69420 (jim in vancouver), Monday, 13 January 2020 17:11 (four years ago) link
it's a wonder any ILXors still have unburnt houses
― the girl from spirea x (f. hazel), Monday, 13 January 2020 17:13 (four years ago) link
we don't live in houses -- unless you mean glass houses
― TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 13 January 2020 17:14 (four years ago) link
and all fagan actually wrote was:
"I’ve been a fan for more than 30 years and I think it’s a mistake to get rid of the two former band members."
― bidenfan69420 (jim in vancouver), Monday, 13 January 2020 17:16 (four years ago) link
I’ve been a fan for more than 30 years
eh, one of the new fans then, he's got no right to criticize
― Death to (NickB), Monday, 13 January 2020 17:20 (four years ago) link
haven't dug into this story myself - did anything actually happen outside of the online threats jim?
― Death to (NickB), Monday, 13 January 2020 17:23 (four years ago) link
it was a real campaign of harassment, he had became totally obsessed with them, ended with him saying he was coming to their town with a baseball bat to attack them and then him getting arrested because he had emailed two police forces to the effect that he was going to kill them
― bidenfan69420 (jim in vancouver), Monday, 13 January 2020 17:27 (four years ago) link
sweet christ
― Death to (NickB), Monday, 13 January 2020 17:28 (four years ago) link
It looks as if Fagan was trolling Paul Kerr pretty hard on Facebook, now that I Google around a bit. Not that it merited being threatened and slandered as a pedophile, but it was hardly innocuous comments about the latest Simple Minds album:
https://www.brightonandhovenews.org/2019/10/18/simple-minds-singers-brother-was-also-targeted-on-facebook-jury-told/
― the girl from spirea x (f. hazel), Monday, 13 January 2020 17:36 (four years ago) link
the plot thickens!
― bidenfan69420 (jim in vancouver), Monday, 13 January 2020 17:41 (four years ago) link
facebook is making people crazy, wtf
― Death to (NickB), Monday, 13 January 2020 17:43 (four years ago) link
Hate to think what would have happened had got started on the surfeit of bad acoustic, covers and live albums
― PaulTMA, Monday, 13 January 2020 17:51 (four years ago) link
Live in the City of Light is classic tho
― the girl from spirea x (f. hazel), Monday, 13 January 2020 17:53 (four years ago) link
You can take the boy out of Toryglen...
― Frozen Mug (Tom D.), Monday, 13 January 2020 19:39 (four years ago) link
Judge Stephen Mooney asked: “How many mankinis does a man need?”
― groovypanda, Tuesday, 14 January 2020 08:02 (four years ago) link
"Big Sleep" is so great
― Robert Adam Gilmour, Friday, 12 February 2021 19:09 (three years ago) link
Yes, a wonderful song that shows how expressive and expansive they could be when they didn't have to freight everything with "importance".
― Halfway there but for you, Friday, 12 February 2021 19:35 (three years ago) link
I am in fact listening to the new one to kick off October 21, Day of Riches
it's kind of bad sure but also much more enjoyable than expected, will def get 'surprisingly good later work' kudos
― imago, Friday, 21 October 2022 08:29 (one year ago) link
the songs are nothing special but it is notably well produced and has a good sound, v bright and vigorous
― imago, Friday, 21 October 2022 08:42 (one year ago) link
It's their best album since Scary Monsters.
Just finished Graeme Thompson's book about the early Minds (stopping wisely after 'Once Upon A Time') it is definitely worth any fan's investigation.
― MaresNest, Friday, 21 October 2022 10:48 (one year ago) link
It's alriiiight
― you can see me from westbury white horse, Friday, 21 October 2022 11:08 (one year ago) link
Album that is, not book
The last TFF keeps coming to mind and I'd say they're on par
― you can see me from westbury white horse, Friday, 21 October 2022 11:09 (one year ago) link
Definitely some likable stuff on here, the mastering is absurdly bad though. Celtic fiddly bits of 'Solstice Kiss' not welcome
― PaulTMA, Friday, 21 October 2022 11:39 (one year ago) link
Solstice Kiss was the best song
― you can see me from westbury white horse, Friday, 21 October 2022 12:28 (one year ago) link
Yeah, possibly, although the title's use in the lyrics is hilariously clunky, you can imagine these old codgers trying to think of inspiration and coming up with this
― imago, Friday, 21 October 2022 12:54 (one year ago) link
Next album: Ash Wednesday Hug
― imago, Friday, 21 October 2022 12:55 (one year ago) link
Simple Minds Superfans Can Invest In A New Gold Dream: Songwriting + Sound Recording Royalties For 1977-1981 Material Now Up For Sale
As of last weekend, someone was selling the royalty rights to an early career batch of 107 songs by Simple Minds. Jim Kerr and Charlie Burchill, the current members of Simple Minds Tours Ltd. sold their catalog to their current label, BMG. These are the sorts of big money deals where rock stars of as certain age take a cash out and at least in this case, they didn’t sell to one of the upstart music IP firms like Hipgnosis. And they are becoming very commonplace.Given the list of songs, and the points in time where past members exited the band, I’m suspecting that these rights being auctioned are from original drummer Brian McGee’s shares in the band. His time ended in 1981 as he was taken to the limit in his years playing drums, and yes, driving the band all over Europe in vans since he was the one with a driver’s license. If it were Derek Forbes, it would include material from “New Gold Dream [81, 82, 83, 84]” and “Sparkle In The Rain.” McNeill only left after “Street Fighting Years.” So it has to be McGee.
Given the list of songs, and the points in time where past members exited the band, I’m suspecting that these rights being auctioned are from original drummer Brian McGee’s shares in the band. His time ended in 1981 as he was taken to the limit in his years playing drums, and yes, driving the band all over Europe in vans since he was the one with a driver’s license. If it were Derek Forbes, it would include material from “New Gold Dream [81, 82, 83, 84]” and “Sparkle In The Rain.” McNeill only left after “Street Fighting Years.” So it has to be McGee.
― Elvis Telecom, Wednesday, 26 April 2023 06:34 (one year ago) link