Dylan's Christian period

Toronto 1980 (all Jesus songs), Earl's Court 1981 (mix of Jesus songs and older stuff) are the best of the ones I've heard. Really like the live stuff from this period! "When He Returns" is a fave, as is "Ain't Gonna Go To Hell For Anybody."

Also, "Angelina" from the Bootleg Series is one of my fave Dylan songs, period.

"Solid Rock" and "Every Grain of Sand" are the keepers. Dylan himself (and Bono) adores Shot of Love's title track.

Agreed that Saved is fantastic. Gospel Dylan is just fine by me. Personally I think his singing in this period is about as good as he ever got - it's the sweet spot when his voice was grizzled enough that he doesn't have to force it (like on his very early albums, where you think his barely post-pubescent voice is going to crack when he tries to growl like an old bluesman) but before the last intact vocal cords snapped somewhere around the late 80s/early 90s. I love his intonation and phrasing here, the band is on fire, the backup singers are a perfect foil, and he rarely rocked harder than on tracks like "Solid Rock".

I got Slow Train Coming about a year ago and love it. which is weird cuz in general I'm not a fan of this particular production/arrangement style but the plastic-y 80s vibe coupled with a sleazy-sounding Dylan in born again preacher mode really works.

love Gotta Serve Somebody especially

Those are all beautiful songs. On the album take of "When He Returns", Dylan sounds like he's going to break down, and with lyrics like those, it's clear he was going through something heavy.

"Truth is an arrow and the gate is narrow that it passes through."

Is that an outtake from the KJV? "Verily I tell you..." I mean: truth is an arrow, that is, sharp, piercing, it flies fast, and it's shot by someone. There are deep mysteries there. Why is it shot at the gate? If this is speaking of the trajectory of faith, then the narrowness of the gate shouldn't be a concern since the arrow is going to pass through anyway. And then the echoes of Augustine's conversion ("how long, how long"):

"How long can I listen to the lies of prejudice?
How long can I stay drunk on fear out in the wilderness?"

Dylan is exhausted; it's why if we were drinking I'd be arguing that Street-Legal is really the start of the Christian period, that "Changing of the Guards" announces the change ("Eden is burning").

Saw him in May 1980 in Providence, just before Saved came out. Almost everything he played was from that album and Slow Train Coming. It was a great show — the band absolutely smoked — even though I couldn’t make out his damnation/hellfire speeches between songs due to the poor acoustics. For the last song, “Pressing On,” he took the microphone and started dancing in front of the stage. It wasn’t exactly a representative Dylan show, but it was my first.

"Gotta Serve Somebody," however is a stupid song.

xpost haha, yeah there are a few truly wacky apocalyptic rants on bootlegs. On that 1980 Toronto set, he starts explaining how Russia invading Afghanistan is all predicted in the bible.

Gotta Serve Somebody," however is a stupid song.

I don't think it's that bad - but I prefer "Precious Angel" and "I Believe in You" from that album.

stupid? I like the resignation in it.

Yeah, like a fuckin' slave. And, man, I love that period's studio-rock, but Dylan's backing band here defines antiseptic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXd25Jqi7G0

I love Dylan's deadpan delivery on "Gotta Serve Somebody", especially as the rhymes get a little funnier towards the end, eg. the way he sings "milk" and "bread" in this:

Might like to wear cotton, might like to wear silk,
Might like to drink whiskey, might like to drink milk,
You might like to eat caviar, you might like to eat bread,
You may be sleeping on the floor, sleeping in a king-sized bed

I don't take Dylan as a theologian particularly seriously. As far as the lyrics go from this period, what I like is how mystified Dylan seems by what he's saying. There's conviction there, but whatever he experienced, his lyrical voice was having trouble expressing.

I like the music on Saved a lot more than on Slow Train Coming, on the whole. I think Wexler understood Dylan's vision better on this one.

Shot of Love > Slow Train Coming > Saved

and yeah, the humor on Slow Train Coming is puzzling in the context of this, like, topically heavy album. "Man Gave Names To All The Animals" is a dopey lyric, like a Basement Tapes lyric without the double entendres. But it's still good for a simple laugh. It's corny but that's our Bob.

"Shot of Love > Slow Train Coming > Saved" seems to be the conventional wisdom and I get why that is, but anyone reading who has ears, let them hear Saved again. Although I've tried for years to buy it on CD and never succeeded in finding it.

Has "Saved" been remastered? I've actually never owned it! My older brother had it ...

eMusic has Saved - but I don't know if it's been remastered. I think Saved is better than Slow Train - and the production is definitely a lot less sterile.

I remember hating "Gotta Serve Somebody" in 1979, but I heard it on the radio the other night and thought it sounded great. I love the combination of the air-tight production and that creepy, menacing vocal. I've always resisted getting these albums but I might have to add them on eMusic.

I love the combination of the air-tight production and that creepy, menacing vocal.

yeah this is the kinda contrast (intentional or not) that finally got me to appreciate Steely Dan - this shiny, sleek, perfectly constructed light pop that's set against an actively creepy but sorta funny narrative/singer

Dylan's music is missing the harmonic complexity and jazzy solos of the Steely Dan though - with this kind of production it ends up sounding more like Dire Straits than Steely Dan, unfortunately.

I generally like the slickness of Slow Train, I think it does have a kind of menace to it.

Elsewhere, some of the surreal, Book of Revelations meets Highway 61 lyrics are really incredible -- stuff like the aforementioned 'Angelina', "Caribbean Wind", "Foot of Pride", "Jokerman" etc. Really weird, ambitious writing ...

yeah I'm going to make an extended dive into Bob's 80s this week I think, looking for more of the confusion that's grabbing me on these. By the 2000s I think he's figured out his new lyrical voice and that's probably my favorite Bob overall but I'm intrigued at present by the struggle for a new voice after Street-Legal (I need a copy of Budokan too I think).

Budokan has its moments, but overall it's pretty limp. The later US 1978 tour is waaaay better. Look for the Hush Sweet Charlotte bootleg ...

Dylan's music is missing the harmonic complexity and jazzy solos of the Steely Dan though - with this kind of production it ends up sounding more like Dire Straits than Steely Dan, unfortunately.

OTM -- what I was trying to say upthread.

sounding more like Dire Straits than Steely Dan, unfortunately.

def. the sound of Dire Straits (dunno how unfortunate that is)

A sound I would, of course, expect from the producer of Slow Train Coming.

No, wait -- Knopfler didn't produce STC.

Wexler ennit. altho Dylan specifically was going for Knopfler's sound and wanted him originally iirc

Doesn't Knopfler play on Slow Train, though? Or am I making that up.

He sure does, which explains my confusion (he did produce Infidels).

I said that Wexler better figures out Dylan's vision on Saved than on Slow Train Coming, but a better way to put what I was trying to express is: Wexler helped Dylan realize a better sound for the vision Dylan had, such as they understood it, on Saved than on Slow Train Coming. Dylan may not have agreed, since he dumped Wexler for Plotkin on Shot of Love and then, yeah, Knopfler for Infidels.

This topic has provided the only praise that I have ever seen for the 'Christian' period of Bob Dylan.

I think you'll find that serious (haha) Dylan fans have plenty of good stuff to say about this period. Obviously the evangelism of the lyrics is always going to be a turn-off for some, but it really is a fascinating time for Dylan.

The cover art is great too:

http://www.earthwaverecords.com/pictures/albumimg/d/a0115351.jpg

haha, that cover is nutso. you'd think it was some super-obscure private-press xtian rock record from 1977. But no, it's a BOB DYLAN record.

There's conviction there, but whatever he experienced, his lyrical voice was having trouble expressing.

That sounds about right. The songs seem to be either literal renderings of scripture or these terrifically confused metaphors.

Count me as a fan of Budokan (since someone referenced it upthread)--to a point. It seems like a bit of a conceptual coup, actually: rendering his '60s songs, including some protest numbers, as fully-arranged, showstopping Vegas numbers. Actually it sort of anticipates his Perry Como-esque Xmas album in its nonchalant mindfuckery.

Also, I thought the brief segment w/Christian Bale in I'm Not There captured this era of Dylan pretty well/amusingly. Although I am not a big fan of that film as a whole.

Yeah, I actually thought that the I'm Not There/Christian (!) Bale segment was the most successful in that movie. Just the utter sincerity of Bale's performance caught something vital about this period in Dylan's career. Of course, the sincerity is just another mask, but it's maybe one of the more convincing masks.

you guys are nuts that movie is awesome

"look its Allen Ginsberg!"

oh i liked it! it's like catnip for Dylan nerds.

did you guys catch moondog in the greenwich village sequence??

i've been trying to get my gf (not a Dylan nerd) to watch it so I can get a neutral assessment

yeah i honestly don't think anyone not steeped (DEEPLY steeped) in Dylan lore would get a whole lot out of the movie. Maybe I'm wrong ...

Film nerds, maybe ...

btw i'm not kidding about moondog, haynes sticks a guy in a moondog costume in one of the quick panning shots of the early '60s village. i kind of want to hug haynes for that.

I saw the film with two folks I wouldn't really characterize as Dylan nerds (ie, my wife and an old gay buddy of ours) and they both really dug it. They don't hate his music or anything but they're hardly obsessives (y'know my wife has some sorta weird childhood associations with Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid, buddy likes early 70s Dylan, etc.)

I think I was the only one of the three of us who was excited about all the detail/ephemera tho.

and yeah I spotted Moondog

yeah it's possible that I actually didn't appreciate the movie as a "movie" just because of the Dylan trivia overload that is practically every frame.

infidels is nice on CD — you really get that crisp knopfler sound. sly + robbie bringing the bounce.

eh I love lots of "you nonbelievers are going to hell" music. Tons of reggae, the Louvin Brothers, etc. Thinking of this in the context of Dylan's earlier folk "finger-pointing" songs is appropriate imo.

eh I love lots of "you nonbelievers are going to hell" music. Tons of reggae, the Louvin Brothers, etc. Thinking of this in the context of Dylan's earlier folk "finger-pointing" songs is appropriate imo.

zing touched again

Yeah, I know "Dylanologists" well say they're in the great tradition of his 'finger-pointin'' songs from the '60s, like it's hearing a Born Again "Positively Fourth Street," but they don't have the wit or sharp humor to make the comparison any more than superficial. I tried to like them, but a lot of times they just sound like sour haranguing.

RE: "Infidels," if you took out some of the worst songs (maybe the ones with the bizarre crackpot lyrics on the evils of space travel) and replaced them with better outtakes like "Blind Willie McTell," "Foot of Pride," etc. it would be an excellent album.

I'm sorry, but if you can't find humor in Dylan's christian songs . . .

Shakes, if you like going to hell stuff, check out Dylan's between song rants/sermons from his christian period on youtube. Like this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75_ceACC7-o

Dylan: [rambling story about the Antichrist.]
Combative Audience Member: "Rock and roll!"
Dylan: "You can go down and rock and roll. You can go see KISS. You can rock and roll your way all the way down to the PIT!"

Followed by Dylan asking for the house lights to be brought up so he can see the people heckling him. It's just like Dylan with the Hawks in 66 except Jesus is his backing band.

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3p37uv

The above one is great. Rambling story in which Dylan compares biblical prophecy to the recent Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, during which Dylan cites a list of great philosophers such as "Plato . . . who else now . . . Jimmy Reed? . . . Nietzsche . . . ." Then the band tears into the best version of Solid Rock ever, almost heavy metal.

Or maybe it just ain't funny, but comedy's subjective. I'm sure "Man Gave Names to All the Animals" is a riot with plenty of people.

I grew up in the 70s and early 80s in a non-denominational evangelical church that was a lot like this. Most of the members of the church (including my parents) were ex-hippies who came to the Church in a type of rejection of the excesses of the 60s.

Yeah, me too. This wikipedia page about Lonnie Frisbee talks about the genesis of that movement, which had its epicenter in Southern California. Dylan's gospel period always seemed completely if not normal then at least not weird, because I grew up hearing people talk like that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lonnie_Frisbee

That song is a great childrens song

I think sour hectoring is a fair assessment and hey sonetimes thats what I want tbh

Xps

Oh man great links PBKR! Thx

Lonnie Frisbee, another real life Pynchon name

Lol yes

Followed by Dylan asking for the house lights to be brought up so he can see the people heckling him. It's just like Dylan with the Hawks in 66 except Jesus is his backing band.

― Biden my time/Drinking her wine (PBKR)

the hawks in '66 rocked harder than christ ever did

https://frinkiac.com/meme/S08E17/145494/m/QUxMIFRIRSBCRVNUIEJBTkRTCiBBUkUgQUZGSUxJQVRFRCBXSVRICiBTQVRBTi4=

https://frinkiac.com/meme/S08E17/145494.jpg

Apologies, is there any way to delete my last two posts? I'm still new at this and completely botched a post that's no longer worth posting.

wow thanks for the tip on the Sinéad cover of "I Believe In You", that's a devastating performance. it also appears on some kind of maxi-single for "Thank You For Hearing Me" from 1994, along with a remix of "Fire On Babylon" that's making my hair stand up.

Listening to O'Connor cover now.

Lots of otm 2019-20 posts (as I said at some length on Rolling Bootleg Series, I think another ilox's "cocaine dreams" sums up a lot of the giantor box sampler, despite frequent musical excellence). Re gay, he mentioned still hanging out with Ginsberg, and when interviewer asked how he squared that, replied to the effect that no prob (think he might be into Personal Priesthood Principle, like it's up to *you* to Choose---but might be projecting my own pre-Moral Majority experience as Southern Baptist)(It's still a thing with
at least some of them; not all churches are in the Convention, which itself currently tries not to issue so many Assholy statements, having driven so many congregants away).

*gigantor* box sampler

Something like individual gays, old friends etc. no prob, but as political masses, uh-oh (am reminded of Delany recalling a pre-Stonewall bust, down by the trucks---so many guys came swarming out, that even he got scared, and he was one of 'em).

My band is actually working up a version of “Man Gave Names...” It’s not a song we find stupid, or funny or whatever. We just like it.

Cool, please post at some point. For some dark reason, my computer will no longer let me post YouTubes, but
here's this round-up (it's also on spotify, apple, play)
https://www.google.com/search?q=Townes+Van+Zandt+Man+Gave+Names+To+All+The+Animals&oq=Townes+Van+Zandt+Man+Gave+Names+To+All+The+Animals&aqs=chrome..69i57.31557j0j1&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

shot of love may be the best one of these, and i love them all! "property of jesus," what a jam!!!!

eh idk if it's the *best*... I mean, it has Lenny Bruce on it

count me among the few weirdos who likes "lenny bruce." the lyric is.... yeah, but the arrangement feels kinda proto-paul westerberg solo somehow

trouble no more is, forgive me, a revelation

shot of love may be the best one of these, and i love them all! "property of jesus," what a jam!!!!

― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson),

Pleasantly ephemeral -- I like the gutbucket mix. "Every Grain of Sand" and "in the Summertime" though.

"every grain of sand" has been one of my fav dylan songs ever since i heard emmylou harris' cover, i was happy to love his version. "in the summertime" is amazing. heavy van morrison energy to these records (i guess it's all the gospel?)

supposedly there's a Clash version of "In the Summertime" with a howling Joe Strummer plonking away on the piano

I mixed this down to a wieldy 4hrs w/ segues and some other odds-and-ends, it never leaves my phone

hmu anybody if you would like!

https://i.imgur.com/zqquwMw.jpg

1 Ain't No Man Righteous, No Not One Take 6
2 When He Returns Take 2
3 Slow Train Toronto April 18-19 1980
4 Dead Man, Dead Man Outtake
5 Making a Liar Out of Me Rehearsal
6 Are You Ready? Toronto April 18-19 1980
7 Ain't Gonna Go to Hell for Anybody Toronto April 18-19 1980
8 Watered-Down Love Outtake
9 When You Gonna Wake Up? Oslo, July 9
10 You Changed My Life Take 4
11 Do Right To Me Baby Toronto April 18-19 1980
12 Cover Down, Pray Through Toronto April 18-19 1980
13 Stand By Faith Rehearsal
14 Gotta Serve Somebody Bad Segeberg [July 15]
15 In the Summertime Boston [October 21]
16 Groom's Still Waiting at the Altar Take 2
17 Precious Angel Toronto April 18-19 1980
18 Solid Rock Toronto April 18-19 1980
19 I Believe in You Toronto April 18-19 1980
20 Shot of Love Outtake
21 City of Gold San Francisco, CA, November 22
22 Gonna Change My Way of Thinking Memphis [January 31]
23 What Can I Do For You? Toronto April 18-19 1980
24 Man Gave Names To All The Animals London, June 27
25 Slow Train London [June 29]
26 Caribbean Wind Rehearsal (pedal Steel)
27 Jesus Is The One Lorelei, Germany, July 17
28 Rise Again Rehearsal
29 Knockin' On Heaven's Door London, June 27
30 Saving Grace Toronto April 18-19
31 Radio Spot Portland, January 1980
32 Blowin' In The Wind London, June 27
33 Gotta Serve Somebody London, June 27
34 When He Returns Toronto April 18-19
35 Thief On The Cross New Orleans, LA, November 10
36 Covenant Woman Take 3
37 Dead Man, Dead Man London, June 27, 1981
38 Trouble in Mind Take 1
39 Pressing On Take 1
40 Blessed Is The Name Santa Monica [November 20]
41 Groom's Still Waiting at the Altar San Francisco [November 13]
42 Solid Rock San Diego [November 1981]/Philadelphia [October 1979]
43 I Believe In You London, June 27
44 Ballad of a Thin Man London, June 27
45 Shot of Love Avignon [July 25]
46 Help Me Understand Soundcheck
47 Caribbean Wind San Francisco [November 12]
48 Ye Shall Be Changed Outtake
49 Every Grain of Sand Rehearsal
50 Slow Train San Francisco [November 16]
51 Gotta Serve Somebody Take 1
52 Band Introduction London, June 27, 1981
53 Like a Rolling Stone London, June 27, 1981
54 Pressing On Toronto April 18-19

Pressing On is my jam

also one of the few songs from this period where I actually think the album version is the best one

Trouble No More is the perfect soundtrack to these times. "When you gonna wake up?"

coming at you chinaski

D/l now - should keep me plenty busy. An immense thank you.

"caribbean wind" is a great song, should've been on shot of love

The cry of the peacock, flies buzz my head
Ceiling fan broken, there’s a heat in my bed
Street band playing “Nearer My God to Thee”
We met at the steeple where the mission bells ring
She said, “I know what you’re thinking, but there ain’t a thing
You can do about it, so let us just agree to agree”

fuckin amazing

xxp you're welcome!

every time i hear "when he returns," no matter the arrangement, studio or live, it's the best song i've ever heard, but the live version with the burning organ on it and the second studio take on trouble no more really hammer it home

Yeah, Caribbean Wind has an amazing cinematic quality to it like some of the stuff off Desire.

Those lines Brad quoted are nearly a screenplay.

just watched the trouble no more film! bob's harmonica solo during "what can i do for you?"! literally transcendent

That is one of my favorite things of this entire period. Like he is channelling the holy spirit.

Fuck yeah brad otm wrt Caribbean Wind, just floored me the first time I heard it on Biograph

i know i said upthread that shot of love was maybe the best of these but that was initial excitement i think, even though "property of jesus" and "in the summertime" really knock me out. saved is the best one imo and is swiftly becoming... my... favorite... dylan... record?

both of the complete live shows in the box set are AMAZING. toronto 1980 is perfect, and then just the next year at earl's court all the arrangements are completely fuckin different!

Agree that Saved is the best studio and that Toronto 1980 show is the best period.

Bob Dylan acting out "Shot of Love."

If I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times: Interpretive Dance Bob Dylan is the best Bob Dylan. pic.twitter.com/QLRWlmnvN4

— HarryHew (@harryhew) August 30, 2023

Gestures aside, I find this musically scintillating.

Extraordinary that he had this much vitality after almost 20 years and numerous other career phases.