Taking Sides - HD-DVD or Blu-Ray?

It's the industry's own doing. Blu-ray players were/are priced so high because the patent holders are, erm, holding tight to those patents. Proprietary greed, etc.

― Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, November 4, 2009 6:27 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

also the whole format fiasco that this thread was created to address!!

Also, you sort of need a 1080p ready TV to get the most out of the format, no? Just a big clusterfuck all around, I'd say. I can't imagine a worse roll-out of a new technology. It all felt/feels so ... premature.

where in the world will i be able to buy a 1080p tv?? hmmmm

Some of us have HD TVs already that aren't 1080p, and aren't inclined to upgrade the TV just to get the most from the video, which seems sort of backwards. This shit isn't impulsive "let's buy a new TV!" cheap, either, which is of course why the economy is stalled. I should buy a new TV and Blu-ray player ... for my country! If they were smart, they'd market the format in the U.S. as patriotic.

I don't care how much better an disc format is, I hate having around all those discs. I use netflix, download, and stream media. I can't really see myself buying any type of dvd ever again.

Josh i think blu-ray's still gonna look pretty sweet on a 720p

i just realized i've turned into the devil sitting on your shoulder

If they were smart, they'd market the format in the U.S. as patriotic.

Red, White, and Blu-Ray?

2012? Two years of digital evolution from now? Really? By then they'll be beaming HD content straight into our brains.

― Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 4 November 2009 19:53 (Yesterday) Permalink

Cable companies and satellite don't even have the bandwidth for multiple HD channels that are in 720, so they downgrade the signal on as many channels as they can get away with. Even FIOS, the only service I know of that delivers full 1080p on multiple channels without nasty compression, has a limited number of channels compared to the other services. And all the internet streaming sites don't want to have to shell out true HD. Hell, youtube is losing millions a month on hosting fees for shitty hypercompressed mpgs as it is.

So just how are people going to be able to stream 1080p movies in the near future? If they have no internet service and the copper cable is solely devoted to streaming one movie at a time, maybe that will work...

So what we're saying here is that HD online and on satellite TV is essentially a lie, because even if there are 1080 lines, they're shitty compressed lines?

I have a 26" full-HD compatible television with a very good DVD player; there's no reason whatsoever for me to shell out for BlueRay.

So what we're saying here is that HD online and on satellite TV is essentially a lie, because even if there are 1080 lines, they're shitty compressed lines?

I have a 26" full-HD compatible television with a very good DVD player; there's no reason whatsoever for me to shell out for BlueRay.

― exploding angel vagina (Scik Mouthy), Thursday, November 5, 2009 7:54 AM (19 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I've found that on cable, they'll usually give you 2 or 3 really good channels, like ESPNHD. They look pretty much HD to me. But they'll compress other channels, so you'll get pixellation. Which defeats the purpose, obviously.

Once I got an HDTV, it really revealed the limitations of DVD. To each his/her own; I know there were people who never really saw a difference in video quality between VHS and DVD (they just liked having movies on a disc instead of a giant tape).

btw, a fun story I've heard is that cable companies are actually paying stations to not broadcast in full 1080p, because then people might notice that they're getting a better signal on FIOS.

>I know there were people who never really saw a difference in video quality between VHS and DVD (they just liked having movies on a disc instead of a giant tape).

a friend of mine resisted buying a dvd player until 2007, her reason being that she treasured her VHS tapes and liked "to hear them wind" in the machine...

I can see the point of HD if you've got a 32inch TV or larger; I just don't really like enormous TVs.

I was at a presentation about a year ago on the future of TV in a streaming context and one guy was talking about what comes after HD, which is when you project onto a full wall and can sit 2 feet away from it and see every detail. Why would you want to?!

Of course, this all handily ignores the fact that not all Blu-ray transfers are created equal. Sure, Pixar is aces, but there are lots of shoddy Blu-ray transfers about. Getting better, I admit, or at least more consistent, but Blu-ray does not always equal top quality. My biggest fear, to be honest, is that the unctuous push toward Blu-ray wil mean less work on DVD transfers in order to win hearts and minds for Blu-ray. We'll see, I guess.

Total coincidence, but my friend just invited me over to check out his new Blu-ray player and A/B a few discs (he kept his DVD player connected to watch .avi files). We watched a few Pixar shorts, and he showed me the level of detail Blu-ray achieves. Even he admitted it was sort of minor but still noticeable if you look for it. We then compared the Blu-ray of "The Shining" to the DVD, and it's largely the same, with some real minor differences on the Blu-ray - glimmer around the eyes, that sort of thing (which was also the biggest dif. between the DVD and Blu-ray of "Blade Runner"). "Spinal Tap," obv., was not some reference quality transfer, but "Pinocchio" looked good. Again, not significantly better than the new DVD transfer, but the difference was there if you looked for it.

In the end, he conceded it was mostly a new toy. I wasn't exactly blown away myself, though if they found a way to integrate the technology better with the special features, at least as more than just a weak promotional vehicle, the format might be more enticing. I know Neil Young fans are feeling hosed over the dearth of downloadable content to the Blu-ray Archives set, for one.

>We then compared the Blu-ray of "The Shining" to the DVD, and it's largely the same, with some real minor differences on the Blu-ray - glimmer around the eyes, that sort of thing (which was also the biggest dif. between the DVD and Blu-ray of "Blade Runner")

Wow, this genuinely surprises me, because I've got blu-ray and dvd of both those and the difference (to my eyes) is immense, not just in terms of sharpness and resolution but also in colour depth, contrast, lack of visible artifacts etc.

I guess it really is horses for courses though, and if the benefits aren't visible there certainly is no point "upgrading" - you'll save some $$$ for sure.

How big is his TV Josh? My impression is that you need a pretty big one to see a real noticeable difference.

Big TV and proper HDMI cabling is urgent and key otherwise yeah, no point bothering.

Do Blu-ray players actually have composite outs?? That would be lolsome

They sure do. I've a friend who complained that they were unimpressed by the picture from their PS3, had it hooked up to the HD TV by a scart cable...

Wow, this genuinely surprises me, because I've got blu-ray and dvd of both those and the difference (to my eyes) is immense, not just in terms of sharpness and resolution but also in colour depth, contrast, lack of visible artifacts etc.

^^^ this, in fact for all the Kubrick stuff. Blu-Rays of "2001" and "Full Metal Jacket" are really, really amazing compared to the DVDs. (Which were, in all fairness, pretty damned well-mastered themselves.) The barracks scenes in FMJ just pop in a way that the DVD never did for me with the increased contrast.

Hmm, well, maybe I misworded it. The difference was apparent, to my eyes, but not significant. Like, hardly a deal breaker, superior but not to the extent that the DVD looked outright inferior.

I think his TV is 42", which is pretty much the cusp, isn't it, for amplifying the superiority of the Blu-ray. Though it wouldn't surprise me if he, like 99% of people, had it connected/calibrated improperly. I haven't seen an HD store display yet that wasn't calibrated improperly, to some extent. And like stereos, in the end - different eyes, different light, different combos of media ... beyond reference quality Pixar stuff, there are lots of variables in play.

remarks about hd cable otm: when you start getting used to 720p/1080i being piped in on hundreds of channels all day every day, going back to regular DVD, you realize the huge difference.

just do not get suckered into paying like $50 for a premium hdmi cable... they are all created equal. buy one for $5 on ebay.

and also ya you do NOT need 1080p to see the benefits, 720p/1080i still looks worlds better too.

ALSO if you want to really see what blu-ray can do i still recommend "planet earth." or "dr. no." i was watching north x nw last night and it looked pretty phenoms too.

and UP looked INSANELY great. don't forget it's not just the resolution, it's the color space as well.

i watched a Blu-Ray rip t.o.r.r.e.n.t. of Up the other night on my 26" 720p TV and the picture was just DINGGGGGG like a fucking diamond - sick

so like a full-res rip? yeah, i watched a 1080p rip of children of men that looked amazing. obviously a bit compressed but still wowzer.

i dunno, i guess so! of course i haven't seen the normal DVD - it's probably pretty nice too

yeah i remember how good the upconverted incredibles DVD looked on my hdtv. they really know how to encode their shit at pixar. doesn't hurt that they skip the telecine step either.

josh,

frankly - and i have access to like a shitload of really expensive TVS at work all the time....i don't think there is a marked difference between 720p and 1080p if the TV is smaller than about 46 inches...

say if you have a 32 or 36 i really don't think you will notice that much of a difference.

in fact you might be able to get a pretty sweet deal right now on, say, a 36 inch 720p Sony or something since ppl are so uptight about 1080p and getting the "best" resolution...

at 46 or especially over 50 inches, you will see some differences between 1080p and 720p....but either way 720p is always preferable to 1080i.

So is this blu-ray thing here to stay? My previous DVD/home cinema thing died and I've gone for a better one - with a Blu-Ray player. Got myself BBC's Planet Earth and Life series for showing off the spex, the Ice Age and Mummy trilogies for the mindless enjoyment and ordered a couple of the favourites so check for differences (the thirtheenth floor, dark city, the cure's trilogy), but I'm now a but uncertain about where to go now.

This obviously isn't the new DVD format (I mean, Bad Santa on Blu-Ray? Why?) - there's some kind of upscaling going on so the better DVDs look pretty great (Nine Inch Nails' Besides You In Time looks fantastic) and their surround is also quite fabulous sometimes, but still: is Blu-Ray the 320 kbps of physical media?

to check for differences <- typo

http://www.tvshowsondvd.net/graphics/news3/MadMen-S1_Bluray.jpg
http://www.criterion.com/library/bluray

Wow! Thanks for the link!

Unfortunately:

26. Are Criterion’s Blu-ray discs region-encoded?
Yes. Criterion is licensed to sell most of its editions only in North America.

that's a bummer :(

It does mean there's a HD version ready, waiting to be picked up by a European distributor, though.

ROFL @ the oh-no-you-don't vote here (scroll down to see the customer review scores).

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000X9FLKM/ref=s9_al_bw_ir01

Also, a message to whoever decided that some (all?) Blu-Rays shouldn't remember any settings or resume where you stopped watching: way to fuck up your shiny new format, idiots.

I think this comes down to if the disc is mastered to use the Java BD functionality ie. if it is, then Resume will not be possible. I've got about 60 or so blu-ray discs and only a handful allow a dvd style Resume. Something you can try, Stan, is setting a bookmark before you stop playback - if you press the green button on yr remote it will do this (again if the function is implemented on that disc!).

I think most of the disney / pixar stuff is mastered tht way

anyway just got a PS3 and I think I'm gonna crack my BD virginity with... MOON

http://i39.tinypic.com/2uiar6d.png

HD-DVD iirc

should have to reach into gloop-filled egg to retrieve the box imo

when when when ?

ha, ste you wouldn't buy that would you?!

HA well no not really, but surely they'll release a normal box too. or is this all a big TEASE ?

should have to reach into gloop-filled egg to retrieve the box imo

Should shoot out on a spring and hit you in the face tbh.

should insert itself into your torso and spring out from your chest in a gruesome and bloody fashion, killing you, imo