― scott m (mcd), Wednesday, 5 November 2003 20:47 (twenty years ago) link
― Sonny A. (Keiko), Wednesday, 5 November 2003 21:00 (twenty years ago) link
for the record, i've heard a few songs by the wrens (you know, i still have a kinda sucky but oddly comforting release of theirs called 'silver' that i bought used for dirt cheap and haven't listened to in a long time!), i was listening to different records then, but i thought they had a few nice, if relatively unremarkable, indie rock songs. i actually downloaded something from this new cd and found it lousy, maybe i've just gotten too lazy a listener to dig for hooks. and disco hi-hats couldn't hurt.
― mitch lastnamewithheld (mitchlnw), Wednesday, 5 November 2003 21:03 (twenty years ago) link
I hear ya, I know what you mean. This is very true.
I think in this case it is a virtue because the sound, method, whatever, suits the band even if the record does sound dated. They haven't changed too much with the times, but I think it works, and their stubbornness (as I imagine it) is a plus. It has a lot of personality.
― scott m (mcd), Wednesday, 5 November 2003 21:14 (twenty years ago) link
Though it should technically matter little, the Wrens are possibly the nicest group of people you'll ever met.
But, yeah, Grass. When booking a Wrens show back in 96, that Fuckwad Boss, forced the addition of Commander Venus (his newest signing) to the bill. The little band of 14-15 year olds was fronted by a pathetic, pubescent Bright Eyes. Now THEY were terrible.
― brent_D, Wednesday, 5 November 2003 22:18 (twenty years ago) link
i guess i don't care about "passionate rock music." ha ha ha, etc.
― jack cole (jackcole), Wednesday, 5 November 2003 22:28 (twenty years ago) link
That's how I feel about the Shins. But I love the Wrens' record. And I can't explain why...
― peanut (peanut), Wednesday, 5 November 2003 23:36 (twenty years ago) link
― Baked Bean Teeth (Baked Bean Teeth), Monday, 19 January 2004 05:36 (twenty years ago) link
Yeah, me too and I didn't want to like them because pitchfork was all up on them, but after further listenings I came to love Meadowlands. Secaucus doesn't do much for me though.
By the way, as long as this is The Wrens thread, has anyone else read Meadowlands reviews with the words 'emo' included? I thought this was a little ridiculous. I mean then what isn't emo?
Also I have little knowledge of Grass as a mid 90s label, but I would think It'd be much easier to rip them for being on Drive-Thru for a minute.
― christhamrin (christhamrin), Monday, 19 January 2004 08:08 (twenty years ago) link
― David Allen (David Allen), Monday, 19 January 2004 20:39 (twenty years ago) link
― andrew s, Monday, 19 January 2004 21:18 (twenty years ago) link
ha ha. this was exactly my thought when I listened to the record. It's pretty good - and it's also definitely emo. Nothing wrong with that per se, but I was extremely perplexed that I hadn't seen any review refer to it as such - like you say. i guess most of the indie review places have worked so hard at slagging and distancing themselves from emo (trashing bands solely on the basis of their genre), that they can't conceive of an emo record that they like. what a sad place to be.
― Sean M (Sean M), Monday, 19 January 2004 21:35 (twenty years ago) link
Maybe I'm one of the billion trillion people who aren't quite sure on what emo is.
― David Allen (David Allen), Monday, 19 January 2004 22:05 (twenty years ago) link
Seriously. When is everyone going to start using the term 'post-emo' - its about time. Certainly theres a lot of stuff that has been influenced by it, but it just doesn't fit to really call anything emo anymore unless it is used as an insult.
Power pop I say. Sounds like indie rock update on Big Star/Flamin' Groovies.
And if it didn't have the 6 minute long turd that seems like it lasts 13 months it'd be near-perfect.
― christhamrin (christhamrin), Tuesday, 20 January 2004 13:15 (twenty years ago) link
― scott m (mcd), Tuesday, 20 January 2004 15:31 (twenty years ago) link
― Dock Miles (Dock Miles), Tuesday, 20 January 2004 16:09 (twenty years ago) link
― Jim Reckling (Jim Reckling), Monday, 16 February 2004 04:41 (twenty years ago) link
I just wish I could find the old CDs.
― subgenius (subgenius), Tuesday, 17 February 2004 06:15 (twenty years ago) link
― CharlieNo4 (Charlie), Sunday, 31 July 2005 16:15 (eighteen years ago) link
― kornrulez6969 (TCBeing), Sunday, 31 July 2005 22:35 (eighteen years ago) link
― arif mardin, Friday, 25 November 2005 22:33 (eighteen years ago) link
― subgenius (subgenius), Friday, 25 November 2005 22:39 (eighteen years ago) link
― erv (Abe Froman), Friday, 25 November 2005 22:59 (eighteen years ago) link
― Jimmy_tango, Friday, 25 November 2005 23:05 (eighteen years ago) link
― andrew s (andrew s), Saturday, 26 November 2005 01:26 (eighteen years ago) link
― Matt McEver (mattmc387), Saturday, 26 November 2005 02:08 (eighteen years ago) link
― lemin (lemin), Saturday, 26 November 2005 04:01 (eighteen years ago) link
― Matt McEver (mattmc387), Saturday, 26 November 2005 04:22 (eighteen years ago) link
File under: Perfect Sound? Whatever.
― nancyboy (nancyboy), Saturday, 26 November 2005 11:44 (eighteen years ago) link
― thousands of tiny luminous spheres (plebian), Saturday, 26 November 2005 23:58 (eighteen years ago) link
― mcd (mcd), Sunday, 27 November 2005 04:22 (eighteen years ago) link
Upon relistening, The Meadowlands really is a pretty devastating record. I'm really hoping these guys can keep it together long enough to make another record.
― Simon H., Sunday, 27 July 2008 03:00 (fifteen years ago) link
How the fuck has this thread gone all this time with no mention of "Everyone Choose Sides"? Agreed that devastating is as good a word as any for this.
― rogermexico., Sunday, 27 July 2008 05:21 (fifteen years ago) link
Everybody on the planet should see these boys/middle aged men live too.
― Fer Ark, Sunday, 27 July 2008 06:42 (fifteen years ago) link
I only like the distorted songs at the end of this album.
― abanana, Sunday, 27 July 2008 09:36 (fifteen years ago) link
For a lol indie band I like these guys a lot. And I fucked up and missed them at the Adelphi.
― Noodle Vague, Sunday, 27 July 2008 13:20 (fifteen years ago) link
i really like the song 'Happy' but the rest bores me
― rockapads, Monday, 28 July 2008 07:38 (fifteen years ago) link
Saw them at the borderline in london a couple of years ago; was one of the best live shows I've ever seen. Still not tired of the Meadowlands.
― G00blar, Monday, 28 July 2008 10:01 (fifteen years ago) link
i throw "the meadowlands" on a few times a year and it still sounds totally sad and real and close to the bone. saw them live in 2003? 2004? and they were totally excellent and very funny.
― Emily Bjurnhjam, Monday, 28 July 2008 10:12 (fifteen years ago) link
Boy did I forget about the Wrens. I mean, I clicked on this thread thinking, "never heard of this band", and read like five posts before I realized I once owned The Meadowlands. I must have sold it or something because I no longer have it and it clearly didn't leave an impression on me...considering giving them another shot...
― RabiesAngentleman, Monday, 28 July 2008 10:23 (fifteen years ago) link
I take The Meadowlands off the shelf, listen to "Happy" and "She Sends Kisses," and put it back. But damn am I satisfied.
― call all destroyer, Monday, 28 July 2008 14:18 (fifteen years ago) link
There are a lot of bands where the bio seems beside the point, but I know the Wrens' backstory makes the band mean more to me. My introduction to them was this still inspirationalTimes article that I can't separate from what's on The Meadowlands. Everyone Choose Sides and This Boy Is Exhausted put their daily struggle front and center, which makes all the relationship songs feel epic because you know what it took them to get to the point of being able to tell their tale. The Wrens = hope for all middle-aged rockers.
― dad a, Monday, 28 July 2008 15:19 (fifteen years ago) link
The Meadowlands is: totally fantastic, totally emo, totally not indie-pop. The beginning of this thread is: totally hilarious.
― St3ve Go1db3rg, Monday, 28 July 2008 18:10 (fifteen years ago) link
i still haven't heard Secaucus... i liked meadowlands fine (it did seem a tad over-hyped at the time) and i'll pull it out every six months or so.
saw em live last year in Philly in the basement of a church(?) and they were pretty fuggin great
― will, Monday, 28 July 2008 18:32 (fifteen years ago) link
I didn't get Wrens - that Meadowlands was overrrated - i cheated it in the wrong sequence - then i saw them (THE WRENS) live. Oh man. The reasons I love music
― Fer Ark, Monday, 28 July 2008 21:23 (fifteen years ago) link
Noodle Vague.
Next time Jacko does one hold a Vague banner.
― Fer Ark, Monday, 28 July 2008 22:17 (fifteen years ago) link
I'm ashamed at the number of "though it was overrated"s in this thread
― skygreenleopard, Tuesday, 29 July 2008 16:53 (fifteen years ago) link
Don't be ashamed ^ we all got there in the end but maybe not as quickly as you. Well Done
― Fer Ark, Tuesday, 29 July 2008 17:03 (fifteen years ago) link
Are we not liking this record now? For crying out loud, what the hell is there not to like? It's on the shortlist of best records of the 2000s, people! Geez louise!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
― kornrulez6969, Tuesday, 29 July 2008 17:17 (fifteen years ago) link
ten tons against me and you've goneI put your favorite records onand sit aroundit spins aroundand you're around againstruck dumb while drugs run at how high reedscue every memory at half-speedsjust like....charles, hold-me-downsI'm-coming soundscut crap, who's filling shoes like these anymore?past clumsy crushes beneath Thrill Pierhopes pinned to poses honed in men's room mirrorsa sophomore at Brownshe worked Lost & FoundI put your face on her all yearfrom five rows of photos when you wroteof posed you, dressed blue, a backyard boatsigned at the bottom with this quote:(#4 North Shore) a cape may addressyour new one I guess'all's well in hell and all here's hoping'she sends kissessome signed 'with Love, Beth oooooo xxxxx'she sends kissesour oldest jokesome signed 3 sixesour shore town knockdown sure was funyeah, white trash, what have youI fired replies back gun by gunpast Seven Wrecks I read your four answers: 1. your move 2. I'm tres involved 3. move on 4. love, BethI walk it downthis tourist town'just thought I'd' callsjust friendsshe sends kissesand all at once back doors blow openshe sends.... in envelopes stamped w/ 'Hope & Hearts' - ripped right openshe sends...but I'm corrupt - I wrote back good luck
― DUDE, I DON'T LOSE (call all destroyer), Friday, 12 June 2009 20:43 (fourteen years ago) link
ok sub pop/the rest of the band really should have just insisted on bringing in a producer to sift through all of this and give charles some perspective because this is brilliant even if the mixes are really rough
― ufo, Saturday, 16 September 2023 06:17 (seven months ago) link
should have just insisted on bringing in a producer
maybe kevin shields?
― mookieproof, Saturday, 16 September 2023 06:40 (seven months ago) link
i'm pretty sure bissell has already spent more time going mad over these songs than shields did with m b v
― ufo, Saturday, 16 September 2023 06:44 (seven months ago) link
certainly looking forward to his solo album for the finished versions of most of these tracks & more but it's absolutely tragic it's never coming out in this form. the the versions of some of kevin's songs here are better than the versions on the aeon station album
― ufo, Saturday, 16 September 2023 06:48 (seven months ago) link
but still holy shit!!! the 4th wrens album, which i thought we'd never hear, is fantastic and totally lives up to expectations even in this slightly rough form.
― ufo, Saturday, 16 September 2023 07:42 (seven months ago) link
is this how people who liked m b v felt
― ufo, Saturday, 16 September 2023 07:50 (seven months ago) link
Haha can you share? Soulseek producing zero results
― Evan, Saturday, 16 September 2023 12:48 (seven months ago) link
if you search for 'wrens album 4.5 demo' you should be able to find it on soulseek
― ufo, Saturday, 16 September 2023 12:58 (seven months ago) link
this is the tracklist:
IntroDog End June Twice MeasuredOld DeathLeavesIn Pairs to the PalestraFace FactsMaille Singing Old Death The GCrescentAs Ive KnownHaitiThree Types of Reading AmbiguiSophieGregs BalladAnd Its All Guns & ArrowsJanuary PianoIts The Whole Thing, Its TheDecember SleepWhite Fem Age 61
some of the track titles were cut off and idk what they're all supposed to be. "Its The Whole Thing, Its The" is known to be actually titled "At Irish Exit". it's "Three Types of Reading Ambiguity" obviously. "Leaves" was on the Aeon Station album almost unchanged, along with "Face Facts" (retitled "Air") and "Haiti" (retitled "Empty Rooms"). "Sophie" was re-recorded as "Queens".
― ufo, Saturday, 16 September 2023 13:07 (seven months ago) link
OK yeah it popped up... weird that "wrens 4.5" didn't work but that did
― Evan, Saturday, 16 September 2023 13:13 (seven months ago) link
i can't wait to hear how charles has ship-of-theseused all these songs in the decade since (if these versions really are from 2014) as well as the new songs that are going to be on it. i hope they're also all 7 minutes long and have these sort of ambitious ideas
― ufo, Saturday, 16 September 2023 13:57 (seven months ago) link
I was one of the people that went to his house and listened to cuts in his lil studio room years back, where he personally told us that he was going to submit it to the label and it would be out within 6 months from there or whatever, then I came back here and was like “I think it’s really happening guys”... anyway these sound familiar and I wonder how different they are from the samples we heard or if they’re the same more or less, it’s hard to remember. Can’t imagine anything he’d have landed on anything relatively minimal or simplistic after all this.
― Evan, Saturday, 16 September 2023 14:08 (seven months ago) link
Yup, it was 2017. Sigh.
― Evan, Saturday, 16 September 2023 14:10 (seven months ago) link
there are two versions of "three types of reading ambiguity" that he previously released in 2015 and they're both relatively close to this, though one is two minutes longer and the other is a minute longer. both have a bunch of kalimba overdubs that aren't on this one at the very least. the final version is going to have kevin's bridge cut out though (it's "hold on" on the aeon station album) and i think he mentioned scrapping some of the verses at some point? he also released an instrumental of "at irish exit" in 2016 and he's clearly swapped a lot of the guitar parts there compared to this one. there were other fragments of songs that he posted on soundcloud after bits and pieces got cut from the album (a scrapped bridge from "and it's all guns & arrows" among other things) but i can't track those down now.
also worth comparing the "crescent"/"as i've known" here to the version from 2010/2011 - he's added a ton of overdubs since then, including some great new parts, but it's also so much denser
― ufo, Saturday, 16 September 2023 14:23 (seven months ago) link
ufo thanks for all this including the insight - but I gotta know - where did the leak come from and how do you know it was the version as of 2014 specifically?
― Evan, Friday, 22 September 2023 14:03 (seven months ago) link
i don't have much insight at all! i saw it mentioned on hipinion (lol) and found it on soulseek but idk where it came from or whether it really is a 2014-era version of the album (that's just what someone claimed there). the tags do say 2014 and that would seem to make sense with the other versions of some of these songs we've heard but that's very hard to say with any real certainty or anything
― ufo, Friday, 22 September 2023 23:02 (seven months ago) link
charles posted about his mental health over the past years ahead of the big album announcement happening tomorrow/friday
https://www.wrens.com/news-etc/2023/10/5/the-mh-post
― pitted (blue6ave), Friday, 6 October 2023 03:00 (six months ago) link
very glad to hear he's doing better these days
― ufo, Friday, 6 October 2023 03:28 (six months ago) link
https://www.carcolors.net/news/happyannounceday
charles walked away from his sub pop deal to revive absolutely kosher, and is also doing nfts of alt versions of tracks because he's somehow still excited by them
... of course that's how this would end up
but at least the album is on its way at last
― ufo, Friday, 6 October 2023 13:42 (six months ago) link
Very sad the band couldn’t come to terms on a 20th anniversary Meadowlands reissue.
― Western® with Bacon Flavor, Friday, 6 October 2023 18:21 (six months ago) link
the final "old death" is pretty great except the drums are mixed real weird, they're buried beneath everything else. it totally realises the ambition of the leaked version otherwise, though there are a bunch of structural changes. it's fascinating how different it is, sounds pretty much totally re-recorded. such a shame this isn't the triumphant comeback single of the wrens because it really is a triumph
the alt. version of "and it's all guns and arrows" is lovely too, way better than the leaked version. you can really get a sense of how much time he's spent obsessing over the arrangements if he has alternate versions like this lying around lol, it's quite different to the early version and i wonder what it'll sound like on the album.
"i'll bear" rules too, and that's a track that didn't make the album!
car colors is such a bad band name though, idk if that or aeon station is worse lol
― ufo, Monday, 16 October 2023 22:52 (six months ago) link
congratulations to charles for finally releasing some stuff https://carcolors.bandcamp.com/album/old-death
― pitted (blue6ave), Friday, 17 November 2023 06:38 (five months ago) link
should also add https://www.carcolors.net/news/old-death-released-unto-the-hideous-world
― pitted (blue6ave), Friday, 17 November 2023 06:42 (five months ago) link
here's the three songs, they're very good
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8X832hhLW-s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GbUtB-MFNk8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5Rq3wHp7p4
― ufo, Friday, 17 November 2023 07:18 (five months ago) link
"old death" is so fucking good. i really missed charles's voice
― is he disgruntled adrian? (voodoo chili), Monday, 20 November 2023 22:48 (five months ago) link
does anyone have a non soulseek link to the 2014 demos?
― aggravatedyeti, Friday, 24 November 2023 13:40 (five months ago) link
i think i've figured out that the source of the 'album 4.5 demo' is a cd-r charles sent to sub pop in 2015 that was supposed to be an unmastered version of the final album
still blown away by "old death" and incredibly looking forward to the car colors album which charles is still promising is being announced soon (apparently the latest delay is due to issues with vinyl production, of course). i really can't wait to hear the final version of "in pairs to the palestra" since that's one of his very best tunes
― ufo, Tuesday, 16 April 2024 15:52 (two weeks ago) link
loving Old Death and I'll Bear. Only gave them a cursory listen last Nov, but listening to them non-stop now.
― cajunsunday, Friday, 19 April 2024 14:59 (two weeks ago) link
yeah i absolutely love old death and think it's one of the best songs he's ever written.
― the defenestration of prog (voodoo chili), Friday, 19 April 2024 15:30 (two weeks ago) link
if the demos are anything to judge it by the album should be an utter classic when it eventually comes out
― ufo, Friday, 19 April 2024 15:46 (two weeks ago) link
...if it eventually comes out
― fragglerock, Saturday, 20 April 2024 11:21 (two weeks ago) link
i'm only going to worry about it not coming out if charles starts talking about fiddling with the mixes again
― ufo, Saturday, 20 April 2024 11:40 (two weeks ago) link
fair! let's hope that he doesn't.
― fragglerock, Sunday, 21 April 2024 14:42 (one week ago) link