jane's addiction: name your reasons they are so bad and hated

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That was probably a bit off the cuff. I haven't seen a AC live performance or heard their earlier work, so just consider me to be someone talking an awful load of uninformed shit here... I just think Janes aimed for a certain flashy, sprawling rockstarry "wildness" that seems absent in rock nowadays. This may be a good thing, but sometimes I'm not sure.

fandango (fandango), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 20:54 (eighteen years ago) link

let's take this literally. are hetero bands 'excluding' 'gayness'? apart from the question of what 'gayness' is, hetero bands are not, you know, gay, so i see no reason they should 'include' 'gayness', necessarily. but Janes, which is a pretty hetero band afaik (maybe i'm wrong), put on 'gayness' or at least 'polysexuality' for a reason. do you really think that had some political purpose? i doubt it. was it irony-free? hmm.

also, i'd be quick to concede that Bret Michaels is probably a bigger homophobe than Perry Farrell, given some evidence, but quick, tell me who got called 'fags' more - Jane's Addiction or Poison?

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 20:58 (eighteen years ago) link

hmm that's a tight race there

j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 20:59 (eighteen years ago) link

Jane's were basically the agglomeration of what was all happening around them in L.A. -- all of it: rock, goth (visually), paisley hippie-shit, funk-metal, etc. kinda thrown together and fronted by some skinny wanna-be Jim Morrison type for the 80s... It worked! ..for a while at least.

You can like it, shrug it off, love it, or hate it.. but Jane's were hardly a surprise to anyone when they became big.. at least to L.A. folks. It had been brewing for quite a while.

(the whole attempt at a "gay" angle is more distracting from the qualities of the band, in retrospect... what's more interesting is how they became the token L.A. rock band for L.A. anglophiles to like, instead of the Chili Peppers, Fishbone, Lock Down, or whoever else was around then..)

Dom iNut (donut), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 21:04 (eighteen years ago) link

The unspoken major influence here is the then-relatively-adventurous KROQ, who then had a major internal connection to MTV. (Lewis Largest, former DJ and program director at KROQ moved on to MTV, remember.)

KROQ just had a way of making everything they played on the radio sound like they came from either of two planets: a) Hollywood, or b) England. Somehow, Jane's were able to get fans of both sides of the listener fanbase to like them. The latter is more interesting to explore, IMHO.

Dom iNut (donut), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 21:07 (eighteen years ago) link


I used to have this one EP with some live tracks on it, and Perry is talking to the crowd: "The guy threw a Birkenstock. I mean, he doesn't even understand fashion!"

That was great.

mcd (mcd), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 21:12 (eighteen years ago) link

the "Soul Kiss" video has tons of priceless lines like that.

senseiDancer (sexyDancer), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 21:14 (eighteen years ago) link

I wonder if opinions here aren't divided more or less between those who saw them live and those who didn't. Granted, seeing them live might indicate a predilection for the band anyway. But for those of us who were willing to buy into the the whole thing — the attitude, occultism, sexual ambiguity, etc. (or who were totally caught off guard by it in '87 or '88) — the live shows were unspeakably thrilling. I feel sorry for anybody jaded enough to dismiss them for this stuff, for "not having a sense of humor about it." Was Bowie kidding about it? The Velvets? Zeppelin? Is Coil? Rock and roll is magic if you want it to be, pretentious or silly if you don't. Those shows were charged with an air of danger and possibility new not just to the hair metal crowd but to fans of their '80s alt-rock forebears: Love and Rockets, X, Bauhaus, etc.

Atmosphere aside they were absolutely ferocious live, and they knew it. I won't forget how shit hot they were at those Lollapalooza shows, and how every night they were dropping jaws on the opening acts crowded to the side of the stage — Siouxsie and Rollins and the Buttholes, etc. — all craning their necks for a better look, to be closer to whatever it was those guys managed to tap into for a very brief period.

Dr. Gene Scott (shinybeast), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 21:25 (eighteen years ago) link

Forget all the countercultural/shaman/goth whatever associations for me in terms of getting into them. It was as simple as having heard a bit about them, yes, but in early 1989 (freshman year, UCLA) having a friend who had the album playing it full blast at work. And I just thought, "Goddamn that's loud. And good!" The rest followed. (I did finally see them live twice in 1991, first at the Universal Ampitheatre and then at ye olde first Lollapalooza.)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 21:26 (eighteen years ago) link

Was Bowie kidding about it? The Velvets? Zeppelin?

no, and I'm not much for them because of it. to the extent I do like them, it's despite the fact that they're not kidding. Zep is the only one that really does it for me, though, and the stuff I like best is when they tone down the bullshit (Rock 'n Roll) or knock it the fuck over (Levee)

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 21:38 (eighteen years ago) link

the former two were ironic, tho

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 21:40 (eighteen years ago) link

or camp, etc

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 21:40 (eighteen years ago) link

i talked to my first girlfriend for the first time because she was wearing a janes addiction t-shirt. untill she threw that on i assumed she was little beyond her cheerleading outfit.

we aren't really mentioning the fact that janes was a goddamned buzz clip and was on almost every morning right before i left for middle school. and as i was only just then getting to know about contemporary music that wasn't complete rubish, they were mind blowing. everything about them was. i see it differently now, mind, but at the time the seemed to present exactly what i wanted from a rock band. and i could find their records in the mall.

how they got there is, of course (sorry), a good question. that album on XXX is far enough away from GNR to let me think record co.'s thought they could market to the same audience. maybe it was the KROQ...i never understood how LA works.

btw, Ian..i think i still have a couple old bootlegs on tape under my couch...one form lollapalooza in Atlanta...perry pretends to talk to moses...and they do the "don't call me nigger, whitey" cover with ice-t...classic (sonds kinda crappy, but...)...ill try and get it to you


xpost: hah...see the teenage me thought that was an amazing thing to say (re: the sandle)

bb (bbrz), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 21:43 (eighteen years ago) link

maybe its too late as the discussion's progressed, but with regard to them trying to be artsy and subversive, maybe they were trying for that and maybe some were into them for it (actually, i know that is the case), but it always seemed to me the cover artwork and antics were more in the random and shock area taken to extreme but still within the usual rock n roll aesthetic, rather than having any kind of hard worked at real message or intent. and yeah pretty soon their aesthetic got unappealing to me too. re: gayness. maybe i just felt it to be gay b/c at the time i'd never experienced that kind of west coast openess in art and their particular melding of shit strong/girly/gay/masculine seemed to be somethign that would never come out of the generally straight influenced hard rock world. mabye it was similar to what had come before - some metal/bowie/trex (that's probably way off!), but it was different too. its like the singsongyness JANE says, i'm THRU with blah... RAGdoll and subject matter - its not like ok as a contrast to this i'm still hardrock. and also what fandango says there.

Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 21:45 (eighteen years ago) link

Rock and roll is magic if you want it to be, pretentious or silly if you don't.

I get my "magic" from, well, beauty. Not an "air of danger and possibility" (which was certainly better-purveyed by, you know, W. Axl Rose etc.). I'm sure there was a strong communal element to Janes shows, and I might well have gotten off on that if I had been there. But I prefer my community to be composed more of people who are seeking things they weren't offering.

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 21:47 (eighteen years ago) link

but at the time the seemed to present exactly what i wanted from a rock band. and i could find their records in the mall.

This is the reaction that I had, too. I think if the Pixies had made it to my town, it woulda been them. But listening to Jane's Addiction now is akin to looking at photos of my old hair-dos.

mcd (mcd), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 21:56 (eighteen years ago) link

air of possibility better purveyed by W. Axl Rose? not in my world.

Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 21:59 (eighteen years ago) link

xpost That's cool. I get my magic from beauty too. (This is getting weird.) Anyway I didn't mean to suggest the "magic" was DERIVED from the "air of danger and possibilty." They are the same thing, resulting from the music, the band's energy, etc.

How many Charisma points do you have?

Dr. Gene Scott (shinybeast), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 22:05 (eighteen years ago) link

air of danger I was referring to mostly. I'm not sure what possibility associated with an air of danger would be good.

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 22:17 (eighteen years ago) link

exactly gabbneb. when I saw them on the Ritual tour they weren't dangerous but the crowd was. In fact, the communal element I noticed in Omaha (yes, OMAHA!) was one of adolescent violence and "we're away from our parents so let's be wantonly destructive!" kind of an atmosphere. The slam dancing, the whole ugly testosterone overdrive fueled by beer/speed/whatever wasn't magical or arty anymore. I didn't like that community at all and have avoided it ever since.

don weiner (don weiner), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 22:22 (eighteen years ago) link

Anyone know what happened to Jane? Did she kick? Still seeing Sergio?

Mark (MarkR), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 22:23 (eighteen years ago) link

i'm working on a profile piece on her now...it'll be in the next issue of raygun

bb (bbrz), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 22:29 (eighteen years ago) link

According to Wikipedia, she's clean now. No mention of Sergio.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jane%27s_Addiction

o. nate (onate), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 22:30 (eighteen years ago) link

Don't treat her like a rag doll...

Brian O'Neill (NYCNative), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 22:36 (eighteen years ago) link

i love that the man in the pictures above could inspire farm boys in Omaha (OMAHA!!) to riot. i really haven't said enough good things about them.

Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 22:41 (eighteen years ago) link

I wouldn't say he inspired them. I'd say that that was the kind of crowd the Janes were attracting in greater numbers by then.

don weiner (don weiner), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 22:57 (eighteen years ago) link

ok fair enough. and i can see how their crowd could be really really awful/obnoxious/dumb.

Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Tuesday, 17 January 2006 22:59 (eighteen years ago) link

i am so proud of this thread.

Special Agent Gene Krupa (orion), Wednesday, 18 January 2006 01:54 (eighteen years ago) link

Fuck the haters.

Pashmina OTM.

J-rock (Julien Sandiford), Wednesday, 18 January 2006 07:55 (eighteen years ago) link

most crowds i was in durring that era were mostly awful. all the idiot moshing, etc...twas the times and the kids.

bb (bbrz), Wednesday, 18 January 2006 13:59 (eighteen years ago) link

I witnessed violent moshing at a fucking VELOCITY GIRL show circa 1991-2.

senseiDancer (sexyDancer), Wednesday, 18 January 2006 17:40 (eighteen years ago) link

i thought i might die at a goddamned cracker show (like '93....some festival thing...violent femmes sset also amazingly violent)

bb (bbrz), Wednesday, 18 January 2006 17:45 (eighteen years ago) link

i was crushed to the point of blacking out at a posies show.

lauren (laurenp), Wednesday, 18 January 2006 17:52 (eighteen years ago) link

strangled at a Young Fresh Fellows show

senseiDancer (sexyDancer), Wednesday, 18 January 2006 17:54 (eighteen years ago) link

sorry lauren but im finding that too damned funny and i dont even know exactly why....perhaps no more coffee for me....

frosting, beaters...oh, i best go outside

bb (bbrz), Wednesday, 18 January 2006 17:56 (eighteen years ago) link

I actually recall a pit developing when I saw The Posies at CBGB's when touring for the first Geffen disc. So it's not impossible.

Brian O'Neill (NYCNative), Wednesday, 18 January 2006 17:58 (eighteen years ago) link

definitely not impossible, as it actually happened.

lauren (laurenp), Wednesday, 18 January 2006 17:59 (eighteen years ago) link

no...totally possible...i think frente could have drawn up such a situation back then...

bb (bbrz), Wednesday, 18 January 2006 18:09 (eighteen years ago) link

aren't you guys a little too old for this?

Special Agent Gene Krupa (orion), Thursday, 19 January 2006 00:53 (eighteen years ago) link

I feel sorry for anybody jaded enough to dismiss them for this stuff, for "not having a sense of humor about it." Was Bowie kidding about it? The Velvets? Zeppelin? Is Coil? Rock and roll is magic if you want it to be, pretentious or silly if you don't.

For me this is the most OTM thing on this thread. I'd like to add that I also feel sorry for people who can't seem to like a band unless the frontman is idol worship material. Who cares if he was a cracked-out asshole? I'll never understand people who let that figure into the equation.

Mustapha Peabody, Thursday, 19 January 2006 18:21 (eighteen years ago) link

only the old man (well i don't know about lauren)..im not THAt much older than you, ian


the cracked out downfall only matters if yr looking for an idol rather than a soundtrack. most people, esp when they're young, like their bands to be idols. so figuring that in is only as stupid as the worship itself.

bb (bbrz), Thursday, 19 January 2006 18:35 (eighteen years ago) link

This is one weird thread. People making out they were into them as kids and are now too grown up for 'em, you may as well call Led Zeppelin music for children then. I'm in my 40's and I consider them as one of the very best rock bands of the last 25 years and a class above The Pixies (who are brilliant - not quite as good as Jane's though). They were original and good musicians too. They also were a big influence on The Smashing Pumpkins and Tool. And for a band that you supposedly heard everywhere in the late 80's/early 90's, their records were remarkably unsuccessful commercially (look at chart placings). Hmmm......strange..

des, Monday, 30 January 2006 18:26 (eighteen years ago) link


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