goodfellas

leave the guns, grab the nuts

nothing to see here folks

*bites knuckle a la bowzer in sha na na*

I guess one upside of "Goodfellas" is that without it, we wouldn't have Showtime’s "Dexter," an infinitely more complex work on almost every level except visually.

Speaking of morality in American entertainment...

croup, there's all that bullshit about Vito being against narcotics trade

surprised you of all people don't believe an old guy could get arbitrarily moralistic about the good old days

and how they're really just a loving family that went astray

I really don't get how you could get this from the two films, but even if you did, that doesn't mean the film denies the thuggish nature of the mob - if anything that's the corrupting element.

godfather is definitely a more romantic movie than goodfellas, but someone could easily say that goodfellas is more cynical and cartoonish

From the first line, "As far back as I can remember, I always wanted to be a gangster," the film proclaims its limitations. Because Martin Scorsese does not do psychology, the best one could expect is a portrait of machismo in crisis situation -- which means brilliantly rendered violence from which the main characters learn nothing.

I don't get how the second part follows the first - is all of that really contained in the line "As far back as I can remember, I always wanted to be a gangster"

also lol at drawing arbitrary distinction between art and not art by inclusion of nihilism

But because I had been a first wave punk rocker, I knew those buzzes were not to be trusted

nuh uh, not gonna get fooled again, nope

The things I loved about "Goodfellas" -- the wedding where every man is named Peter or Paul and all the women Marie; De Niro getting pissed about the silencers not fitting the guns; the guys making a nice pork sauce in prison; even Henry beating the crap out of that douche bag that hurt Karen -- I still treasure. The rest I reckon I'll be dealing with from different angles, as long as I'm around to reckon.

yeah....have fun with that.

But because I had been a first wave punk rocker, I knew those buzzes were not to be trusted

lol, fuck this idiot

ian grey's moralizing in that article is super-tiresome

― If Airplanes Could Fly This Place Would Be An Airport (s1ocki), Wednesday, September 29, 2010 3:49 AM (6 hours ago) Bookmark

seriously. it's not like goodfellas isn't already a moralistic film; the second half of the movie is basically all about hill's life of crime becoming increasingly more unsustainable and pathetic.

Don't get me wrong, The (first) Godfather is a very good movie, it's just a lie. So were most of the great Cagney gangster films before White Heat.

Shasta, the fallout from Pauly's opposition to drug trade doesnt have the same weight or consequences of Vito's, so stfu

The (first) Godfather is a very good movie, it's just a lie.

Not sure Goodfellas is that much more "the truth," feels like the difference is tone rather than content in a lot of ways, but I'm glad to hear you say this. Was tempted to ask if you hated Citizen Kane for piling "phony romantic bullshit" on the newspaper industry.

that gq oral history is quite magnificent, no

well i think the difference is a lot in the details croups... i get the feeling that mario puzo was just making stuff up as he went along whereas the specifics of gfellas is what makes it great.

that's fair to a point, and I can see why someone would prefer either. But the idea that Goodfellas is inherently better for reveling in the thuggish, criminal side rather than an immigrant dynasty feels as moralistic and arbitrary as Mr. Grey's reasons for acclaiming Casino and Shutter Island.

feel like morbs def has a point here, tho its maybe overstated, a lot of peoples love for the godfathers is on a 'arent these people magical' type level due to the flakey romanticism of the thing

that's so weird to me

i like 'the godfather' and 'goodfellas'

everyone in the godfather is completely miserable

not sure a lot of people's Goodfellas love is any more considered

xpost

no but godfather def has this 'family' thing that gives it a warm glow. i agree. and that might be dishonest. but it is why people love it so much. you want to be hanging out with these guys. you want to be tom hagen, the adopted member of the family.

the sheen of power fascinates - while i certainly enjoy some godfathers feel like slocki has a strong point re the positive atributes of verisimilitude

plenty of goodfellas fans want to hang out with those guys, some because they wish they got kick the shit out of people all the time

YOU POPPED YOUR CHERRY!!!

a lot of peoples love for the godfathers is on a 'arent these people magical' type level due to the flakey romanticism of the thing

This was certainly a trope in the public response to The Godfather 35 years ago; no one cares now.

the first half of goodfellas is like that, basically all warm and family-ish, but um then it changes. but because it's first-person, um, that kind of changes shit. 'the godfather' has a totally different attitude to its material.

feel like i never see middle age dudes get all sparkly eyed reciting lines from goodfellas

no, just college students

no but godfather def has this 'family' thing that gives it a warm glow

The oldest brother's a sociopath, the middle one's a wuss, the youngest glowers. Meanwhile the sister is fucking Frank Sinatra. I never really felt the glow.

Maybe the glow was from the cannolis in the oven.

alfred people really care, they sure care for real, especially older italian type guys

and yeah maybe we do like that warmth and people accept the romanticism, a bit

that's part of how films work, and why they resonate

someone alert the authorities

if the goal is apparently to find a mob movie that doesn't make the mob glamorous, goodfellas aint it.

well ya, the whole POINT of goodfellas is what a great life these guys had, how untouchable they were, what the attraction was

its like drug movies, whether you revel in the puke and DTs or suggest junkies are fun-loving saints, you're saying drugs are a BIG DEAL, that taking them gives you a great story.

the first godfather starts at a wedding. the second at a catholic bar mitzvah. there's tons of scenes of vito tenderly attending to his kids in 2. i mean, the family gets mad corrupted and fragmented, but dont tell me people dont dig on the family vibe. thats what really set it apart from your other gangster movies.

I was going to say: Drugstore Cowboy flits in and out of romanticism really well.

Henry Hill: [narrating] Anything I wanted was a phone call away. Free cars. The keys to a dozen hideout flats all over the city. I bet twenty, thirty grand over a weekend and then I'd either blow the winnings in a week or go to the sharks to pay back the bookies.
[Henry leaves the witness stand and speaks directly to the camera]
Henry Hill: Didn't matter. It didn't mean anything. When I was broke, I'd go out and rob some more. We ran everything. We paid off cops. We paid off lawyers. We paid off judges. Everybody had their hands out. Everything was for the taking. And now it's all over.

can't believe henry hill doesn't 'learn something' at the end

as a former punk rocker, i was appalled

there's tons of scenes of vito tenderly attending to his kids in 2. i mean, the family gets mad corrupted and fragmented, but dont tell me people dont dig on the family vibe

But that's why, I think, Coppola uses the present-day stuff as counterpoint: the family feeling was brief and intense. Post-Vito it's all a sham, and probably always was. Because it's your dad's life at stake and because your oldest brother's a doofus, you're going to slowly assume control of the family. Not a heartwarming message.

gomorrah is a p good mob movie that doesnt romanticize the mob much. really at all.

though i think a lot of ppl around here hated it.

oh for sure.

dont get me wrong, i agree.

but i still think people like to dwell on the warm family stuff.

people def vibe off the power of goodfellas, but theres an absence of romantic longing - also in godfather love theres an aspect of we all know and agree this is THE quality filmmaking isnt that great, which grates - feel like w/goodfellas theres more sheer delight

i dont think these problems totally indict the godfathers or anything, but they certainly spark suspicion that there might be something deeply lame going on

ya gomorrah rather aggressively tries to de-romanticize it.

i mean godfather is a fall from grace movie. vito's era is definitely seen as a golden age.

Did Tommy tell you about my painting?

Look at this.

It's beautiful.

One dog goes one way and
the other goes the other.

One's facing east, the other west.

He's saying, "Whaddya want from me?"
The guy's got a nice head of white hair.

Beautiful. The dog looks the same.

gomorrah more like boremorrah

longing for an era when both dogs went the same way