He'd put a stop to all this 'compassionate lefty' business, fako!
― Mark G, Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:35 (twelve years ago) link
God I'm sick of that Chesterton quote.
Have it in my head it's a fake or messed-up one? Could be wrong, cba checking – it does have that authentic Chesterton "a-ha" quality that gets up my nose, esp when he does it four times in a paragraph.
― woof, Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:36 (twelve years ago) link
believing in 'anything' isn't qualitatively different from believing in god, at least some of the 'anything' might be true
― less of the same (darraghmac), Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:40 (twelve years ago) link
well said, Fizzles -- the Chesterton line, real or not, is an irritating smug thing that people say but that is not apparently true.
I have never believed in a god, and I don't believe in 'anything' either, supposing that 'anything' here might mean, say (as I think it does when people spout that line): mysticism, tarot, astrology, alternative medicine and other 'superstitions', or even supposing it means (eg) worshipping the royal family or celebrities.
and the same probably goes for most atheists.
― the pinefox, Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:43 (twelve years ago) link
ts: "I believe in nothing" vs "I don't believe in nothing"
― Mark G, Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:43 (twelve years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSpCXUhp2uA
― the pinefox, Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:46 (twelve years ago) link
Wikiquote agrees with you: http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/G._K._Chesterton#Misattributed
That Littlejohn quote is nuts - as Stevie says, it's praying FOR Muamba, not TO him. I mean, I have problems with the fact that people are suggesting prayers instead of, you know, trained medical assistance, but FFS Littlejohn, you are an ass.
xposts - and yes, the falsely attributed quote is stupid anyway, it's not even attempting to make its conclusion follow logically on from its premises, it's just a piece of dogma.
― emil.y, Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:47 (twelve years ago) link
xps (ty emil.y)
turns out i could be arsed. Not Chesterton, but a critic's paraphrase of this from one of his Father Brown stories:
‘It’s the first effect of not believing in God that you lose your common sense and can’t see things as they are. Anything that anybody talks about, and says there’s a good deal in it, extends itself indefinitely like a vista in a nightmare. And a dog is an omen, and a cat is a mystery, and a pig is a mascot, and a beetle is a scarab, calling up all the menagerie of polytheism from Egypt and old India; Dog Anubis and great green-eyed Pasht and all the holy howling Bulls of Bashan; reeling back to the bestial gods of the beginning, escaping into elephants and snakes and crocodiles; and all because you are frightened of four words: ‘He was made Man’.’
Less snappy that.
― woof, Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:47 (twelve years ago) link
‘He was made Man’.’
http://www.thehollywoodnews.com/wp-content/uploads/joe_pesci-237x300.jpg
― less of the same (darraghmac), Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:49 (twelve years ago) link
no, he was not made man, that was problem
― red is hungry green is jawless (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:50 (twelve years ago) link
It’s the first effect of not believing in God that you lose your common sense and can’t see things as they are
amazing, tbh
― less of the same (darraghmac), Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:51 (twelve years ago) link
what a daft, virtually incomprehensible quotation
the lameness and falsehood of it curiously seems to undermine the 'believe in anything' BS even more than I thought it had already been undermined.
d-Mac correct also.
― the pinefox, Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:52 (twelve years ago) link
not to be Cap'n Save-a-Chesterton but i wonder to what extent the outspoken antichristians of his era were on a theosophical tip, you could argue he's tilting at the New Age tendency of redirected faith rather than yr cold hard logical atheists. either way polytheism is way more fun and fulfilling than monotheism, obv
― red is hungry green is jawless (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:54 (twelve years ago) link
not believing in one thing != being willing to believe in anything. Even Littlejohn should be able to understand that. It's like he doesn't actually believe what he writes, and simply does it for the large wads of cash and to provoke a reaction.
― good luck in your pyramid (Neil S), Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:55 (twelve years ago) link
re. Chesterton, he was a fervent Cathlic wasn't he. I would suspect he'd have had problems with any non-Catholic forms of Christianity, let alone Theosophy etc.
― good luck in your pyramid (Neil S), Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:56 (twelve years ago) link
Chesterton was a convert iirc which is worse, even. but the Father Brown doesn't feel aimed at atheism in toto
― red is hungry green is jawless (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 20 March 2012 16:58 (twelve years ago) link
The Man Who Was Thursday is not too keen on "anarchists", and can allegedly be seen as a Christian allegory. As much about the politics of the Edwardian age as religion, though.
― good luck in your pyramid (Neil S), Tuesday, 20 March 2012 17:03 (twelve years ago) link
The Man Who Was Thursday was pre-conversion iirc? And the Father Brown stories, esp the first two volumes are really good. I'm a fan! I ever quite like his Apologetic book on converting to Catholicism, Orthodoxy. But that 'a-ha!' quality woof mentioned is f'ing annoying - esp. in his journalistic essays, where it's almost a tic.
― Fizzles, Tuesday, 20 March 2012 17:10 (twelve years ago) link
yeah i like Chesterton's work which is why it feels unfair comparing him to Littlejohn because i'm pretty sure GKC was, at the least, sincere.
― red is hungry green is jawless (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 20 March 2012 17:11 (twelve years ago) link
it's one thing banging out outrageous opinions for money but if Liljon has read literally anything at all about this and concluded that 'pray 4 Muamba' means that people are treating him as some sort of deity then I can't even
― Cantera: Vulgar Display Of Puyol (DJ Mencap), Tuesday, 20 March 2012 17:12 (twelve years ago) link
xpost - And yes, NV otm about the tilting at redirected faith against theosophical and New Age stuff, or, say, faith in lie-detecting machines or that violent books make children violent - he's a good defender of the metaphysical against obtuse materialism.
― Fizzles, Tuesday, 20 March 2012 17:14 (twelve years ago) link
xps
yeah, he came quite a long way round. Think the family was unitarian, so v familiar with a rational sort of christianity, off the rails for a while then Anglican for a long time, then rome.
in the story he's talking to a young 'heathen humanitarian', & just preceeding the bit quoted there's a line about 'It’s drowning all your old rationalism and scepticism, it’s coming in like a sea; and the name of it is superstition.' So I think he thinks spiritualism/theosophy – 'arbitrary without being authoritative' to quote the story again – is a necessary consequence of unCatholicism/rationalism?
modern right-wing pundits - suspect Damian Thompson's attacks on pseudo-science something like a modern equivalent to this?
― woof, Tuesday, 20 March 2012 17:14 (twelve years ago) link
sorry 'spiritualism/theosophy & superstition generally'
― woof, Tuesday, 20 March 2012 17:15 (twelve years ago) link
Hanging is too good for him IMOhttp://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-18350615
― Arvo Pärt Chimp (Neil S), Thursday, 7 June 2012 11:36 (eleven years ago) link
pretty sure I'll experience acute and genuine pleasure when Rod Liddle dies just fyi
― geezargh butlargh (DJ Mencap), Thursday, 7 June 2012 13:28 (eleven years ago) link
Next-level:
http://melaniephillips.com/america-goes-into-the-darkness
― Neil S, Thursday, 8 November 2012 14:22 (eleven years ago) link
Iran can now be sure that it will be able to complete its infernal construction of a genocide bomb to use against the Jews and the west
A GENOCIDE BOMB
― C-3PO Sharkey (Phil D.), Thursday, 8 November 2012 14:24 (eleven years ago) link
The World Turned Upside DownBy Melanie Phillips. Now in paperback with a new foreword by David Mamet
― woof, Thursday, 8 November 2012 14:25 (eleven years ago) link
do not want
― Neil S, Thursday, 8 November 2012 14:26 (eleven years ago) link
It was Christianity and the Hebrew Bible that gave us our concepts of reason, progress and an orderly world
(citation needed)
― Dog the Puffin Hunter (ledge), Thursday, 8 November 2012 14:27 (eleven years ago) link
I read that whole thing in the voice of Geoff Workman.
― how's life, Thursday, 8 November 2012 14:30 (eleven years ago) link
tbf to Melanie it was Christians who destroyed the library at Alexandria so she may not have heard of classical Greece
― movember spawned a nobster (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 8 November 2012 14:32 (eleven years ago) link
i'll admit i'm down with the great blood-letting, not metaphorically tho
― movember spawned a nobster (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 8 November 2012 14:33 (eleven years ago) link
if the blood-letting involves those who take the Dacre shilling, I'm all for it too.
― Neil S, Thursday, 8 November 2012 14:38 (eleven years ago) link
jfc liddle
― leave the web boys alone (darraghmac), Sunday, 22 June 2014 09:31 (nine years ago) link
bad form to drop my mask on ilx but jfc liddle
― leave the web boys alone (darraghmac), Sunday, 22 June 2014 09:35 (nine years ago) link
He's vile
What rodent would you say he most resembles physically
― Knob Dicks (wins), Sunday, 22 June 2014 09:39 (nine years ago) link
I don't feel all that strongly about most rodents and he's far too fatfaced and smug looking to pass for a rat so idk
― leave the web boys alone (darraghmac), Sunday, 22 June 2014 09:44 (nine years ago) link
What mask? Always been a confirmed omnisceptic - a thoroughly defensible position
― avicii usque ad arse (imago), Sunday, 22 June 2014 10:03 (nine years ago) link
only if you knew my backstory tbh but this is about the breathtaking rod liddle
― leave the web boys alone (darraghmac), Sunday, 22 June 2014 10:14 (nine years ago) link
link
― avicii usque ad arse (imago), Sunday, 22 June 2014 11:45 (nine years ago) link
sorry I was scoring goals ffs
today's Sunday times he outlines why he's supporting Netherlands by don't of insulting all the other countries in his own inimitable way
― leave the web boys alone (darraghmac), Sunday, 22 June 2014 12:28 (nine years ago) link
by dint predictive text is a terrible man
― leave the web boys alone (darraghmac), Sunday, 22 June 2014 12:29 (nine years ago) link
i took a look in that freebie of the Sun that they put out last week
the editorial said some guff about "loving your country used to be thought of as racist but not any more"
then every other page was full of snide little digs at other countries including a whole column of Liddle doing his "jungle starts at Calais" shtick
fuck every last one of them imo
― Kevin from Blechgium (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 22 June 2014 15:17 (nine years ago) link
There was some p. amazing trolling in that free Sun column, like a bit in the middle about "oh hey I'm just gonna use the words Britain and England interchangeably because that's what Britain is all about to me" just dropped in all casual-like
also a bit about how terrible it would be to live in Belgium, which distracted me from the rest of the article because I was too busy thinking "sounds p. good to me apart from the unpronounceable language"
anyway I was embarrassed that this got shoved through the doors of all the flats in this block as half of my neighbours are, y'know, not English
― the ghosts of dead pom-bears (a passing spacecadet), Sunday, 22 June 2014 18:35 (nine years ago) link
Dutch is closely related to English, or do you mean French?
― Barry Gordy (Neil S), Sunday, 22 June 2014 21:17 (nine years ago) link
I wonder if they bothered to deliver their garbage a mile down the road from me where the racial presence is about 90% non-white? The usual Ron Liddle bile + unrealistic jingoist crap about crap england team. No doubt most of that worthless shit was being used to line cat-litter trays within minutes.
― xelab, Sunday, 22 June 2014 21:31 (nine years ago) link
https://samkriss.wordpress.com/2016/05/23/nick-cohen-is-in-your-house/
― ghosts that don't exist (Neil S), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 08:30 (seven years ago) link
Why is it so many British Right Wing Pundits used to be Trotskyists?
― Larry 'Leg' Smith (Tom D.), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 09:12 (seven years ago) link
great piece
it's not a question of their ex politics so much as their upbringing I suspect
― Noodle Vague, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 09:30 (seven years ago) link