Mad Men on AMC • Fifth Season Thread

Lane's greatest moment, RIP:

http://cdn.wg.uproxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/PETE-CAMPBELL-KTFO.gif

I could watch that all day.

pete punch v. crotch steak

ppl like characters on this show? TV is weird.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01hfwQL1QUg

"It shall be too late to run!"

and the way he puts up his fists, Marquis of Queensberry style is AWESOME

More Lane awesomeness:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31cCUWDyyrQ

I just remembered that Don's brother also hanged himself after Don tried to wash his hands of him. Has he killed anyone else?

good christ, i'd completely forgotten about that

a friend of mine speculates that the series is driven by an Ayn Randian ethos, and Don is a Randian hero.

Burt Cooper is a Randian hero

in his mind

iirc

a friend of mine speculates that the series is driven by an Ayn Randian ethos, and Don is a Randian hero.

interesting speculation. "i owe you nothing because i can take care of myself" seems to be a big part of don's operating philosophy.

Dick Whitman (and N.Korea) are responsible for the death of the real Don Draper.

Don would have to not be miserable all the time to be a Randian hero. You're supposed to ENJOY the fruits of your principled capitalist labor.

randian thing doesn't really scan to me.

randianism has appear specifically as a fascination of cooper's and he's a bit buffoonish.

I miss Bert Cooper's OG office where you had to take your shoes off and it was like visiting Japan to have a meeting with him

"Dick Whitman (and N.Korea) are responsible for the death of the real Don Draper."

How was Dick Whitman responsible for the real Don Draper's death? He didn't drop a bomb on the guy.

why Dick Whitman is responsible for Don Draper's LIFE! (And Dick Whitman's death.)

randians aren't quiet about their bullshit generally and weiner himself is mum on this subject.

what about don is specifically randian as opposed to being.. rich?

oh no, i don't suppose that either don or mad men is explicitly/intentionally randian. it's still an interesting parallel to consider: a protagonist whose strength and superiority are inseparable from his heroism brought low by the craven, grasping weakness of those around him

his dismissal of lane was about as compassionate as he could reasonably be, really.

oh no, i don't suppose that either don or mad men is explicitly/intentionally randian. it's still an interesting parallel to consider: a protagonist whose strength and superiority are inseparable from his heroism brought low by the craven, grasping weakness of those around him

― spextor vs bextor (contenderizer), Tuesday, June 5, 2012 3:25 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m4tgjzQ7q71r8j1jb.gif

that one's getting a lot of work today.

anyway, i do like the idea of don as rand-esqe (let's say) hero. strong, visionary, unbound by the petty rules that govern the behavior of lesser men...

Don's brought himself low plenty of times. And has also shown himself to be generous, even charitable, on multiple occasions.

also, to some extent sympathy for the poor and whores and the rejected and the outcast kind of comes very naturally to him - he sees himself in them - and that is explicitly NON-Randian

your summary of what about don is randian has never happened on the show

no, i'm speculating idly about the eventual course of things. either he'll triumph over the lesser men around him, or else he'll stumble. at this point, it's all speculative. i agree, fwiw, that he's far from the perfect randian hero.

and sure, if you strip off enough of the specifics that make a "randian hero" specifically randian, then he just becomes a plain old ordinary hero - which is certainly the more sensible description of don at this point

"Dick Whitman (and N.Korea) are responsible for the death of the real Don Draper."

How was Dick Whitman responsible for the real Don Draper's death? He didn't drop a bomb on the guy.

Splitting hairs here (this was all Weiner's fault anyway), but iirc, Dick was being reprimanded by the real Don when they were attacked. Prior to that, the real Don had been working on something else at a (as it happened) safer place in camp. He was only in fatal danger because he was having to deal w/Dick.

By that same token though, you could argue that if the real Don wasn't with Dick, and only Dick had been killed, the real Don would have been seriously damaged in an albeit different way.

he's barely a hero. this has been maybe his most "heroic" season in the sense that he hasn't been a complete shitbag and has tried to be nice/helpful to some people.

Don doesn't do everything on his own here either tho... not sure where the last few campaigns would be without Ginsberg/Peggy/Pete.

wow xposts

xp - yeah, definitely. i'd thought of don as the show's villain prior to this season.

Anti-hero rather than villain really. If the show's had a more-or-less consistent villain, and I'm not sure it does, then it's Pete, but even Pete's character cuts against that on occasion. Admittedly not very much this year.

Actually reading summaries you appear to be right. No recollection of him blowing the real Don up, but it's been a while...

not sure where the last few campaigns would be without Ginsberg/Peggy/Pete.

As someone pointed out way upthread, it's been a long time since Don had a real idea. His worth to SCDP now is his ability to sell the ideas created by Ginsberg and Peggy.

basically having to rely on a team in such a way is pretty anti-randian, no?

life is anti-randian

How was Dick Whitman responsible for the real Don Draper's death? He didn't drop a bomb on the guy.

Didn't they both survive the bombardment, and then Dick lit a cigarette that caused an explosion that killed the Real Don Draper? Or did I just imagine that?

you imagined that

i think you're thinking of a cartoon.

haha okay I'm being a literalist.

As someone pointed out way upthread, it's been a long time since Don had a real idea. His worth to SCDP now is his ability to sell the ideas created by Ginsberg and Peggy.

don came up with the devil concept that he sold to treat manufacturer instead of ginsberg's (clearly hawaiian punch-inspired) snowball in the face pitch.

and that throat-ripping general purpose pitch to dow was all don (for better or worse)

the Dow thing wasn't really an idea...

i think it was. he pitched a concept: you're not happy. you can't be happy with less than everything. we're hungry enough to know that and to fight for it on your behalf.

what kind of tagline is that

"You're Not Happy"

Dow Chemical

I just remembered that Don's brother also hanged himself after Don tried to wash his hands of him.

there were a lot of careful resonances w/ this built into the episode. no doubt layne's suicide recalled his young brother's suicide to don, which makes some beautiful sense of the final scene where he lets glenn (a temporary little-brother figure) drive his car.