The purpose built next generation interstellar Dawn Richard thread

Message Bookmarked
Bookmark Removed
Not all messages are displayed: show all messages (2172 of them)

Cumulatively it's wearing, hence not as effective as Armor On; at times her vocal melodies are barely there

I agree with this I think, I must have played this six or seven times through now and I'm still finding it a slog from start-to-finish. Kinda think the preponderance of stately widescreen walking-pace epics leads it feeling a bit ponderous as a whole (Goliath ffs). Armour On, whichever mode Dawn and Druski are in, is so much more limber an album. It's stronger as a piece and the individual songs are better throughout as well. I doubt Goldenheart would suffer at all from culling a third of the songs, rhythmically it feels kind of square a lot of the time, melodically it's workmanlike rather than sublime more often than not.

The outtro is a really brave move but also kinda shows up Dawn's melodic limitations. It's beautiful because Clair de Lune is a beautiful piece but its melodic and harmonic scope is so much vaster than anything here. I'm not going to hold not being Debussy against anyone but Dawn sounds dwarfed by the piece and content to wander round a tiny fraction of its melodic landscape.

My favourite bits here are when Dawn is at her most unashamedly soppy - Break of Dawn, In Your Eyes, 86 - or showing a bit of spirit (I want at least two or three more songs like Northern Lights).

Matt DC, Saturday, 19 January 2013 14:15 (five years ago) Permalink

lol the wiki for her 2005 album as "Dawn Angeliqué":

The featured guest as composed by alternative singers and rappers, are them the rapper Jon Jon, the ragga singer B'Shipe and the signed in DJ Khaled's Terror Squad, Pooh Bear, who also handle the production of album. The album was not widely recognized, nor had decent sales, but it leveraged her musical career, which was later expanded with Sean Combs.

the legend of bigger yansh (some dude), Saturday, 19 January 2013 14:16 (five years ago) Permalink

Also I should rep for 300 as the stately walking-pace epic that works because its upward sweep is so great.

Matt DC, Saturday, 19 January 2013 14:17 (five years ago) Permalink

Yes "300" is another highlight for me.

Tim F, Saturday, 19 January 2013 14:35 (five years ago) Permalink

This record sounds sooo good, girl's engineer is some kind of genius.

friday goodness thank it's (flamboyant goon tie included), Saturday, 19 January 2013 15:41 (five years ago) Permalink

First listen today. Gorgeous! Melodies out the ass imo.

abcfsk, Sunday, 20 January 2013 05:39 (five years ago) Permalink

this album is kind of inscrutable to me. i haven't really found a way in yet.

The Reverend, Monday, 21 January 2013 06:08 (five years ago) Permalink

The more I listen to this the more I think the best comparison pts aren't LTTP or any r+b records but auteurish singer-songwriters like Kate Bush and Tori Amos at their most sonically adventurous - not just in terms of songwriting loftiness but also the internal logic of how various sounds are used. Even the obvious references - the 80s stuff, the house stuff - feels more like Dawn bending external influences to the needs of the world she's created. And songs like Gleaux, the beats wow you not so much in terms of reminding you of anything else but in terms of how emotionally in sync they are with the song.

lex pretend, Monday, 21 January 2013 11:04 (five years ago) Permalink

And Rev is right that this is an inscrutable album to an extent; so were Kate and Tori, both of whom made songs I don't feel like I've got tothe heart of decades on.

lex pretend, Monday, 21 January 2013 11:05 (five years ago) Permalink

Agree with Tori and Kate Bush, also reminds me at times of 90s vocal dance music, possibly progressive house or breaks (sorry)...

MikoMcha, Monday, 21 January 2013 11:10 (five years ago) Permalink

Also a really pertinent cf point: RAY OF LIGHT

Same impermeable stateliness even on the bangers, same sense of amniotic winding down/expanding into space as the album progresses, same sense of trying to capture something ~beyond~ the artist themselves (indulgence, yes, but in such a way that the indulgence is key to what makes the album great)

Druski was raving about the production on Frozen on twitter recently too

lex pretend, Monday, 21 January 2013 11:43 (five years ago) Permalink

Oh it's late 90s to a tee. The first imogen heap album, happy rhodes' 'many worlds are born tonight'...

Tim F, Monday, 21 January 2013 12:31 (five years ago) Permalink

Late nineties yes, ROL no. Madonna wrote nearly a whole album's worth of hooks. Goldenheart is like a whole album of "Mer Girl"s.

the little prince of inane false binary hype (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 21 January 2013 12:45 (five years ago) Permalink

you really can't hear the hooks in this? it's not the most immediate album, but i assure you they're there.

lex pretend, Monday, 21 January 2013 12:51 (five years ago) Permalink

Surely hooks are immediate by definition?

Matt DC, Monday, 21 January 2013 12:54 (five years ago) Permalink

have you never heard a song you didn't remember the first couple of times but after a while you couldn't get out of your head?

sometimes i think "hookiness" is THE most subjective musical quality

lex pretend, Monday, 21 January 2013 12:56 (five years ago) Permalink

(esp as it's treated as the most objective)

lex pretend, Monday, 21 January 2013 12:56 (five years ago) Permalink

I always think of the hook as the bit that first gets your attention, rather than the bit that burrows its way into your head after a few listens, although they can often be the same bit of the song. The bits that stick out immediately on Goldenheart tend to be musical rather than vocal - the opening bars of Gleaux are way more immediate and memorable to me than the chorus.

Matt DC, Monday, 21 January 2013 13:05 (five years ago) Permalink

I'm not dismissing this yet! I'm living with it for a few more days.

the little prince of inane false binary hype (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 21 January 2013 13:06 (five years ago) Permalink

I agree with that general principle.

This album is not at all like "met girl",
other tunes on ray of light though sure -
maybe "nothing really matters", "sky fits heaven".

Tim F, Monday, 21 January 2013 13:06 (five years ago) Permalink

That was in response to lex

Tim F, Monday, 21 January 2013 13:06 (five years ago) Permalink

question: wikipedia's credits are wrong, yeah? b/c they list druski as sole writer, give dawn no credits and don't seem to list peter gabriel as a co-writer on 'in your eyes'

i saw an interview with dawn where she said 'in your eyes' isn't a cover b/c they'd get sued, and the lyrics are all different (and the verse melody too, I think) but isn't the chorus obviously enough lifted from the original that they'd need to give some credit? i'm confused.

twinkin' and drinkin' and ready to fly (Alex in Montreal), Monday, 21 January 2013 16:00 (five years ago) Permalink

which - when we're talking catchy/singleworthy/etc. 'in your eyes' just keeps growing on me. the house productino works so damn well and it's got just as much propulsion as anything on armor on

twinkin' and drinkin' and ready to fly (Alex in Montreal), Monday, 21 January 2013 16:01 (five years ago) Permalink

if we're talking catchy, I seem to be the only one who thinks "86" isn't hooky at all, could name at least 6 more immediate entry points

katherine, Monday, 21 January 2013 17:51 (five years ago) Permalink

("Riot" for the obvious "Faith" radio bait, "Northern Lights" for the banger, "Frequency" or "Tug of War" as slow jams (the latter is mostly a slow jam, just in disguise), "Pretty Wicked Things" just because, I'm sure some people might find "Gleaux" immediate though it took a while...)

katherine, Monday, 21 January 2013 17:55 (five years ago) Permalink

"PWT" was immediate for me as a standalone single, "86" was not (took ages to open up for me, and only really broke open in album context)

"riot" and "in your eyes" are the most obviously immediate but like "faith" there's a bit of...this straightforward house stuff isn't what dawn's about, even if they're superior takes on it (all that percussion going off like fireworks in "in your eyes"!). like, is the fact that i find them incredibly transportative and exultatory based on the album sequencing?

i'd choose "northern lights" as an entry point for people who want mind-blowing production, "frequency" for people who want something more sensual

lex pretend, Monday, 21 January 2013 17:58 (five years ago) Permalink

"Gleaux" basically rules, that synth kora + footwork intro is my favourite sound

friday goodness thank it's (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 21 January 2013 18:19 (five years ago) Permalink

reminds me a bit of a Vespertine track

the little prince of inane false binary hype (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 21 January 2013 18:20 (five years ago) Permalink

I'm not a fan of Vespertine but I can see what you're saying

friday goodness thank it's (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 21 January 2013 18:21 (five years ago) Permalink

A lot of this genre experimentation reminds me of what Dirty Projectors tried-- successfully, according to many-- on Swing Lo Magellan. Different playbooks but the same sort of hilarious cross-genre splicing. I like that Dawn and Druski do it so effortlessly, though, it feels like a single universe despite its detours

friday goodness thank it's (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 21 January 2013 18:25 (five years ago) Permalink

xps I've never been at all into Kate Bush or Tori Amos tho *shrug*

The Reverend, Monday, 21 January 2013 18:27 (five years ago) Permalink

Also, last thing, sorry, but I ~love~ the lack of hooks. The albums works so well as a single listen because all the melodies are simpler, less showstoppy. The only hooky track imo is "Ode to you" and it's the low point for me, feels cloying instead of eternal

friday goodness thank it's (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 21 January 2013 18:28 (five years ago) Permalink

This producer is my favourite producer and I want hear everything he's ever done

friday goodness thank it's (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 21 January 2013 18:29 (five years ago) Permalink

I don't know of anything he's done outside of Dawn!

The Reverend, Monday, 21 January 2013 18:32 (five years ago) Permalink

he won a Grammy, did he not?

flag posts in the dust (Drugs A. Money), Monday, 21 January 2013 18:33 (five years ago) Permalink

xps I've never been at all into Kate Bush or Tori Amos tho *shrug*

you shrug like we shouldn't be talking about them?

druski interview: http://www.carltonjordan.com/2012/11/07/breaking-dawn-part-ii-how-producer-druski-helped-reinvent-dawn-richard/

lex pretend, Monday, 21 January 2013 18:40 (five years ago) Permalink

personally I don't hear the tori comparison at all, the kate comparison I can maaaaaaaaaaaaaybe see with the caveat that it's only the sliver of her career when she was trying to be peter gabriel. (which I guess means it is really a peter gabriel comparison, which is obvious but I can see, say, some stuff on Melt being reference points)

katherine, Monday, 21 January 2013 18:51 (five years ago) Permalink

xp ok so he was nominated for a Grammy in the Best Gospel Album category

flag posts in the dust (Drugs A. Money), Monday, 21 January 2013 18:54 (five years ago) Permalink

you shrug like we shouldn't be talking about them?

― lex pretend, Monday, January 21, 2013 10:40 AM Bookmark

Did I say that?

The Reverend, Monday, 21 January 2013 18:55 (five years ago) Permalink

it was just quite a dismissive shrug.

personally I don't hear the tori comparison at all

circa to venus and back? like, not the exact same sounds, but the way in which she uses those sounds - really out-there, WTF production, really effective emotionally, but you can't seem to trace it back to anywhere. inscrutable, as rev said.

lex pretend, Monday, 21 January 2013 18:59 (five years ago) Permalink

You're reading way more into that shrug than was there.

The Reverend, Monday, 21 January 2013 19:12 (five years ago) Permalink

i didn't know you'd even checked out much by kate or tori

lex pretend, Monday, 21 January 2013 19:22 (five years ago) Permalink

Well, no, I haven't. The few songs I've heard by either haven't enticed me.

The Reverend, Monday, 21 January 2013 19:26 (five years ago) Permalink

I feel like I could possibly get into Kate Bush at some point given the right conditions tho. I don't understand the appeal of Tori at all.

The Reverend, Monday, 21 January 2013 19:27 (five years ago) Permalink

oh, that's what i thought. i guess i took umbrage b/c they both have such vast & diverse discographies that it seems a bit off to dismiss either on the basis of a couple of songs, but no problems

lex pretend, Monday, 21 January 2013 19:27 (five years ago) Permalink

Yeah, I wasn't really trying to dismiss either artist or their fans. It was just an "oh well".

The Reverend, Monday, 21 January 2013 19:29 (five years ago) Permalink

Hell, what KB album should I download right now?

The Reverend, Monday, 21 January 2013 19:30 (five years ago) Permalink

I don't hear Tori in this, but listen to anything off "Goldenheart" except the clubby tracks and then listen to "A Deeper Understanding", it's uncanny (and that's a good thing)

friday goodness thank it's (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 21 January 2013 19:30 (five years ago) Permalink

Christ Rev listen to Hounds of Love and Sensual World right now

friday goodness thank it's (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 21 January 2013 19:30 (five years ago) Permalink

I'm not a Kate Bush fan myself but those records are impressive

friday goodness thank it's (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 21 January 2013 19:31 (five years ago) Permalink


You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.