DEM not gonna CON dis NATION: Rolling UK politics in the short-lived post-Murdoch era

This is like a chinese burn they weren't expecting.

It's like that Day Today vignette (or was it Brasseye?) with the minister walking out of No 10 and letting loose a volley of f-bombs.

Life imitates Chris Morris, I guess.

someone's got to replace Malcolm Tucker now he's off to play Dr Who.

LOOOOOOOL they don't like it up 'em, do they?

What they forget because of their hatecrush on Len McCluskey et al: Miliband won the leadership not because of 'trade unions' but because he was the only viable candidate who didn't have dirty hands over Iraq.

there is virtually nothing more despicable than uk govt pussyholes getting upset because they can't get to participate (provide 1-2% of ordinance and a political filigree) in a bombing campaign

dude it's a regrettable and measured response to an unspeakable violation of international law, i'm sure none of these guys get a bone-on at the thought of playing armchair missile command

they've got intelligence dossiers and everything

Downing Street also released a statement, based on the formal legal advice by the attorney general, Dominic Grieve, that limited military strikes to deter future chemical weapons attacks would be in line with international law.

This always makes me laugh. iirc Dominic Grieve's specialism is occupational health and safety regulations. He'll have asked for expert advice from someone whose answer he knew would be "yes" in advance. Had he wanted a "no" he'd have asked the expert advice of someone else.

there's probably no chance of an internation lawyer being appointed attorney general precisely because they might be expected to know something about international law and be more obviously compromised when they have to sign off on something unlawful

International law has so many grey areas you can usually find someone with excellent credentials who will say that the case you're trying to make is, at least, arguable. The fact that the case will never actually have to be argued in front of a court makes it easier.

The expert who signed off the invasion of Iraq genuinely believed that there was a case for saying that it was legal. He was one of the top people in the field, too. He was just in a tiny minority who felt that way.

are there lawyers/barristers/solicitors that will tell you that a case is not arguable? if you are offering them money if they will argue that case?

yes but that was christopher greenwood not the attorney general imbecile goldsmith

goldsmith doesn't seem to have any international law background which would have helped in coming to the conclusion that the iraq war was lawful

Yes, absolutely. The AG generally doesn't have any kind of academic or legal reputation in any field, i think. They aren't really expected to know anything other than who to ask for the right advice.

Which is understandable given the breadth of their role and the narrow specialisms most lawyers have.

with syria i would guess the international law bros are more eveninly split than they were in iraq, and the evidence for assad's use of chemical weapons is probably better than the iraq 'evidence'

Yeah. The Iraq justification was based on a creative interpretation of a UN resolution. This is being justified under the idea of humanitarian intervention which is much harder to rebut. There is no law that lets you intervene in civil wars unilaterally but, at the same time, it has been done quite a few times in the past so you can point to precedent.

tempted to suggest that specific expertise is usually avoided when making any ministerial appointments

else you end up with someone like estelle morris whose experience of teaching caused her to realize she wasn't very good at administering education

haha sometimes i love the guardian still

Miliband was already angry after a government source used expletives overnight to criticise Miliband. A government source told the Times on Wednesday night: "No 10 and the Foreign Office think Miliband is a fucking cunt and a copper-bottomed shit."

the phrasing 'a government source' makes it sound like they had a cabinet meeting and that was their official conclusion, time to write up the press release.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-23892783

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9u5zqKvC7E

British MPs have voted to reject possible military action against the Assad regime in Syria to deter the use of chemical weapons.

A government motion was defeated 285 to 272, a majority of 13 votes.

Good stats for context here - http://nottspolitics.org/2013/08/29/why-the-outcome-of-the-commons-vote-on-syria-is-difficult-to-predict/ - and interesting line on the rise of backbench since 2003. Govt hasn't lost a vote on military action in 100 years.

haha

Stunning scenes. Michael Gove overheard shouting at Tory rebels outside Commons chamber: “You’re a disgrace, you’re a disgrace”.

difficult to see how obama can continue without the universally respected moral imprimatur of the uk

grats uk

Michael Gove remains a cockfarmer.

looking forward to footage of a bunch of crusty old Majors pulling down Cameron's statue at central office

From the I'm Rubber, You're Glue department, I give you Mrs Michael Gove:

@SarahVine Pathetic losers who can't see past their own interests.

someone should tell her that not everyone has shares in BAE systems

this is an excellent surprise but i'm loathe to believe it's going to drastically alter fealty to america

The implications could be significant if it adds pressure to put any / all military action before parliament in the future.

that has become a sort of convention by now anyway, a prime minister isn't likely to exercise the royal prerogative unless there is extreme urgency

So, he's gone "Sod it" and marched off back to his holiday..

http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/1233435_10151862719880148_1229351955_n.jpg

we wont fight them, to the beaches

*skips three meals*

I know nobody takes any notice of them anymore, but what about the old Lib Dems? Have they got anything left at all now? About all they had left was the "We were the party that opposed the Iraq War from the start" routine, but now we can see, as soon they get into government, they're up there on the barricades rattling their sabres with the best of them. They should just crawl off and die.

iirc the old Lib Dems did vote against last night? i thought it was just the Tories in disguise who tried to prop up the Cameronator?

Nine of them, but all nonentities, apart from Sarah Teather and she cashed her chips in some time ago when it came to having a Career In the Liberal Democrats

i like the way you had to qualify that some LD MPs were nonentities

Nonentities without portfolio.

Some good news though, Paddy Ashdown has said he's depressed about the outcome of the vote, and Paddy Ashdown being depressed can only be a good thing.

see? there's an old school Lib Dem who was never afraid to bomb Johnny Foreigner if the role called for it

LibDems tend to be slavishly loyal even when they're physically repulsed by something, it's all part of this misguided collaborative politics thing that has seen them rubber stamp virtually every authoritarian Tory policy of the last three years.

tbh i'm more worried that this great nation may not have a place in the world. won't sleep tonight. where will we live?

Rowena Mason @rowenamason

Cameron told Ed Miliband "you are letting down America" when informed over phone on Weds Labour would not back Syria motion - Labour sources

Pretty sure they've got enough bombs of their own.

Jeremy Bowen @BowenBBC

Have been getting reaction to UK vote against military intervention. Regime people very pleased.

insight

Yeah, sure. Like, someone in front of the firing squad gets told "You know the fourth guy along? He's not going to shoot"