indie has a history of waltzing w/purity ideas no doubt but I think most indie dudes are pretty practical about it. in punk no doubt, there's still a whole "I have to talk to your booking agent to get a show? fuck that rock star shit" mentality subset that's really kinda mystifying (and dishonest & not true to its own values imo)
― combination hair (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 18:41 (ten years ago) link
grizzly bear thread "we have sufficient private income not to worry about full-time work"this thread "creeping on six figures bitches"
― reggie (qualmsley), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 18:42 (ten years ago) link
http://h30631.www3.hp.com/search/technical-writer/ASCategory/-1/ASPostedDate/-1/ASCountry/USA/ASState/-1/ASCity/-1/ASLocation/-1/ASCompanyName/-1/ASCustom1/-1/ASCustom2/-1/ASCustom3/-1/ASCustom4/-1/ASCustom5/-1/ASIsRadius/false/ASCityStateZipcode/-1/ASDistance/-1/ASLatitude/-1/ASLongitude/-1/ASDistanceType/-1
FYI HP has a couple of tech writer jobs available if anyone's interested
― SHAUN (DJP), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 18:44 (ten years ago) link
this was the other piece http://stereogum.com/1166392/debating-the-grizzly-bear-ny-mag-story-and-making-a-living-making-music/top-stories/lead-story
Doug is the frontman of Brooklyn-based experimental metal band Pyrrhon, about whom Decibel Magazine said, “Outré as they get, everything Pyrrhon do emanates from an obsidian death metal core — just that this music is that much more expressive, its impact that much more disquieting than almost anything else in the genre.” Doug Moore: The New York Mag piece on Grizzly Bear makes me feel lucky to be a member of a generation of musicians who never expected to be able to quit their day jobs.
Doug Moore: The New York Mag piece on Grizzly Bear makes me feel lucky to be a member of a generation of musicians who never expected to be able to quit their day jobs.
― flopson, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 18:44 (ten years ago) link
"What you're supposed to do is to work directly for InBev and write about music on the side on your own time and for free"
and even that might be a remotely fair argument (how much more than remotely is up to you) if InBev were routinely hiring. (the argument seems to be directed to people in their twenties, but if anything it's even more applicable to people who are older.)
― katherine, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 18:45 (ten years ago) link
― combination hair (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Tuesday, December 3, 2013 1:41 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
yeah it's super hypocritical. there was a minor controversy here because some friends of mine wrote "8$ don't be a cheap" on a show poster for a show with 3 touring bands, problem wasnt so much that it was 8$ (although ppl are still reluctant to pay more than 5$ fuck u fugazi) but that it didn't say PWYC. because of course musicians should live off of other people's generosity and their labour has no value! drives me crazy
― flopson, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 18:48 (ten years ago) link
丂んムレレӨω ЯΣЩΛг๔ร @shallowrewards 2h@RcmndedListen maybe that's because I spent the prior 15 years working a trade and doing this in my spare time.
"working a trade" ok big guy.
― call all destroyer, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 18:54 (ten years ago) link
one of the most non-unionized, outsourced trades that's benefited from a high demand/supply ratio when it comes to workers so shmucks can still get jobs
― mh, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 18:55 (ten years ago) link
he makes it sound like he's a longshoreman or something
― call all destroyer, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 18:57 (ten years ago) link
yeah I get pretty emotional about it tbh because I have some punk values and "pay people for their work" is one of them but you can get vilified for saying "look this is what my work is legitimately worth, you are asking me to short-change my family in order to get punk points from you"
but I do think that the indie music dude who looks down his nose at musicians with careers is a straw man, is my point. careerism is a different question but most people I know (nb "most people I know" equals "olds who have been in the game 20 years") have made their peace with and/or are plenty stoked about music as both realm of creativity & business space that, at least, has a better day-to-day vibe than the office
xp
― combination hair (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 18:57 (ten years ago) link
an Ott or a True or a Wellsbarf that you'd compare this guy to those guys
barf that you'd compare this guy to those guys
https://twitter.com/everetttrue/status/407630150746923008
― polyphonic, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 19:01 (ten years ago) link
*arched eyebrow*
― Ned Raggett, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 19:05 (ten years ago) link
can you start a new column with this guy, it could be the RaggOtt report
― mh, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 19:06 (ten years ago) link
Never ever even SLIGHTLY joke about the possibility of us collaborating on anything.
― Ned Raggett, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 19:12 (ten years ago) link
writing that down as a "maybe"
― mh, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 19:14 (ten years ago) link
I get pretty emotional about these things because I have literally no idea what anyone wants from me (where "me" can be substituted with "writers in general"), and because the only guesses I have as to what people want are ones that are incompatible with actually living and eating and having a roof over one's head
― katherine, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 19:15 (ten years ago) link
if you could actually make money selling out, then it might be worthwhile to aspire to a career as a music writer. as it stands, there are lots of legit reasons to warn people away from a really rough career choice without having to make them up.
― lollercoaster of rove (s.clover), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 19:19 (ten years ago) link
i have mad respect for those that keep their heads above water doing it (xposts) but seriously.
― lollercoaster of rove (s.clover), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 19:20 (ten years ago) link
The idea that people’s futures might be economically determined deeply offends U.S. sensibilities. We want to believe that individual moxie matters, that a person’s creativity, effort, and intelligence will lead to economic success. Stories of exceptional strivers, heroically overcoming a stacked deck of obstacles, divert our attention from the data. But the large mega-trends are now indisputable. If you fail to pick wealthy parents and want to experience the American dream today, move to Canada.
― reggie (qualmsley), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 19:21 (ten years ago) link
on a journey thru the past
― reggie (qualmsley), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 19:22 (ten years ago) link
worked for win butler
― da croupier, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 19:22 (ten years ago) link
canada ain't all it's cracked up to be
― mh, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 19:22 (ten years ago) link
smh @ Everett True
― subaltern 8 (Michael B), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 19:34 (ten years ago) link
kinda tangential question to the career musicians here - seeing that you're not multi-millionaires (i don't think, maybe i really misunderstand the indie economy), to what extent do you find yourself sticking to 'brand' to ensure that your career doesn't fall apart? (no judgment implied here, i'm 100% cool with musicians i like not starving to death.)
― Merdeyeux, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 20:00 (ten years ago) link
i have a day job so I don't know if I count as a career musician or not but I've been in a band that tours and puts out albums for 18 years or so, and it's a fine line between trying to evolve and playing to your strengths. since we try to have a conceptual orientation that is distinct that drives each album we kind of built into things the notion that we would change, and electronic music has such relentless trend turnovers that you can't really play catchup without seeming kind of spray-on and phony, so we don't bother too much with that. Every band is different in terms of how wide or narrow the initial genre frame already is- like if you're 60s garage rockers, you can add some country or some gospel or some soul, but there's a core there. But no matter what the genre, you can't not be aware of the fatigue issue for your fans and listeners- when they have eight of your albums, do they need number nine too? and you can start to feel threatened by your own past, as if you're competing with yourself and people's first impressions as much as with the cluttered landscape. not to be morbidly grandiose but in a weird sense every career "falls apart" insofar as contexts change and you change too and you just can't be the same person, onstage or on records, that you were when you started. cue Soft Cell's "the art of falling apart" . . . .
― the tune was space, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 20:13 (ten years ago) link
yeah i feel like the difference between how a musician navigates their career and how a critic navigates theirs are so fundamentally different that i wouldn't even want to compare them in any meaningful way. apples and oranges.
― deez the season (some dude), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 20:16 (ten years ago) link
If you fail to pick wealthy parents and want to experience the American dream today, move to Canada.
Here, I have a song for you
If you wanna be a starif you really wanna sellyou better buy the best PRyou better choose your parents well
― St3ve Go1db3rg, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 20:44 (ten years ago) link
Britney Spears to thread
"if you wanna party in France, you better work bitch" etc.
nuff sed
― the tune was space, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 21:11 (ten years ago) link
sorry, this is just happening at a particularly scary time in the writing landscape
― katherine, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 21:27 (ten years ago) link
the entire american economy sucks unless you come from family money/got a solid pre-Bush/Cheney.Crash career going
― reggie (qualmsley), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 21:40 (ten years ago) link
thank God for my solid pre-Bush
― SHAUN (DJP), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 21:44 (ten years ago) link
Bush/Cheney.Crash
common misnomer. recession, and grinding "recovery," totally due to obamacare.
― Daniel, Esq 2, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 21:45 (ten years ago) link
not just obamacare but barney frank iirc
― reggie (qualmsley), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 21:49 (ten years ago) link
oh good just what this thread needed
― katherine, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 21:52 (ten years ago) link
obamacore
― reggie (qualmsley), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 21:53 (ten years ago) link
^^^^^^^^^^^^ new genre.
― Daniel, Esq 2, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 21:53 (ten years ago) link
focus, people
丂んムレレӨω ЯΣЩΛг๔ร @shallowrewards 56m
@coreybeasley @cryptochromatic I AM THE SOLUTION. I AM DOING WHAT IS A SOLUTION 2 THIS PROBLEM. NOT SELLING MUSIC IN2 AD-SUPPORTED PR LAND
― da croupier, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 21:59 (ten years ago) link
There has to be some way to articulate what kind of person finds the "replace each letter in your username with a wacky symbol shaped like that letter" an interesting and unique choice in 2013
― 乒乓, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 22:02 (ten years ago) link
witch house is gonna come back, dude ^^^
― illegalblues, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 22:05 (ten years ago) link
But he's not even using the right witch house fonts
― 乒乓, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 22:06 (ten years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88zQ_sf6BMg
― markers, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 22:08 (ten years ago) link
hey I made this choice in like 2006
oh you meant that guy, cool
― St3ve Go1db3rg, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 22:09 (ten years ago) link
if you wave this image in his face does he explode into flames
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/32/Moby_play.JPG
― mh, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 22:09 (ten years ago) link
Saw some fellow getting of the subway this afternoon, studied his upswept do and said to myself " now that, in contrast, is a happy pompadour."
― Skatalite of Dub (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 3 December 2013 22:23 (ten years ago) link
― 乒乓, Tuesday, December 3, 2013 2:02 PM (2 hours ago)
http://th00.deviantart.net/fs70/200H/i/2012/276/0/1/no_love_deep_web_by_fatal_nostalgia-d5gpzgi.png
― CANONICAL artists, etc., etc. (contenderizer), Wednesday, 4 December 2013 01:00 (ten years ago) link
We know how to read webtstats, son. *snicker* Yeah, we're BEGGING to inflate our worth. Money is made on valid stats, you think we fooled New Line Cinema with hocum? You. Are. Always (I can only assume). Wrong.― Chris Ott (Chris Ott), Tuesday, September 23, 2003 10:07 PM (10 years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
― socki (s1ocki), Wednesday, 4 December 2013 01:18 (ten years ago) link
noticed a response to the sexism accusation in the comments box of that everett true post - apparently, it's the people HIRING young women who are the sexists.
It’s quite sad to me that in aid of developing a justifiable ad-hominem position Jake and his pals have invented the position that I am “against female writers” and believes age is a relevant basis for debating intellectual and ethical concerns. This sort of gap-seeking, self-martyring nonsense is endemic in your circle. Stop looking for reasons to invalidate your critics and confront them word for word.
Elitist cliques pull this whenever someone says something to upset their harmonious network of fast friends trading self-celebration, reinforcing their position while circling the wagons. All I’m trying to point out here is the wagon.
The “authentic experience”-hunting brands and the portals they pay for (like Pitchfork and the NME) want young women on the wagon for far more sexist reasons than you might understand. Their reader base is 70% male. And these young women chose to put themselves in my line of sight, I didn’t seek them out.
― da croupier, Wednesday, 4 December 2013 01:54 (ten years ago) link
"And these young women chose to put themselves in my line of sight, I didn’t seek them out."
ted bundy quote?
― christmas candy bar (al leong), Wednesday, 4 December 2013 02:00 (ten years ago) link
And these young women chose to put themselves in my line of sight, I didn’t seek them out.
Ok I don't know if dude is actually a sexist asshole or just an asshole but this sentence is super crepey.
haha xp
― JoeStork, Wednesday, 4 December 2013 02:02 (ten years ago) link
the lack of self-awareness is kind of staggering
― it's going to be a http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1D5PtyrewSs (latebloomer), Wednesday, 4 December 2013 02:03 (ten years ago) link