MAD MEN on AMC - Seasons 7(a) & & 7(b)

ya and when it didnt work out he's like fuck you bye

i have to admit that this show is tops in terms of limning tangled interrelationships among characters and giving them complex motivations

of course, when you last 7 seasons you can do that

yeah cutler shuts lou down there cuz lou is getting all 'my name is my name' but he doesn't fire him. it was pretty low level humiliation. i wanted to see him bleed, start answering to 'reek', etc.

lol yesss

that scene with cutler and lou really underscored how delightful these actors are in depicting assholes exhibiting prime asshole behavior

remember when pete was the no. 1 asshole on the show?

Seems like we could have a mad men assholes poll when this thing is all over.

Most of the characters in this swing between being brilliant and inept at their jobs and I just assume Harry is just boringly competent and probably responsible for a lot of their success but doesn't get the credit for it because he's such a weak character. A lot of offices have a Harry.

He's needy, emotionally and professionally and doesn't know how to hide it -- his bosses throw the ball for him just to see how far he'll run to get it

probably responsible for a lot of their success

there is literally nothing to base this conclusion on, idg why this keeps coming up except that people know that media buying is important and he is in charge of that and therefore if they are successful it must be because of their media buying strategy...? which sort of runs counter to what is actually shown on the show.

McCann hasn't been after Harry for 5 years. None of their press or awards or other industry recognition from outside of the firm has ever had anything to do with Harry.

Neither Lane nor Joan - the two people who follow the money - ever had any praise or recognition of Harry.

there is literally nothing to base this conclusion on, idg why this keeps coming up except that people know that media buying is important and he is in charge of that and therefore if they are successful it must be because of their media buying strategy...? which sort of runs counter to what is actually shown on the show.

― Οὖτις, Wednesday, May 28, 2014 6:44 PM (9 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Here's the Thing: Media Buying for Television is going to explode in the '70s. Starting in late '68 with the folding of the weekly edition of The Saturday Evening Post, print media enters a gradual decline in importance. By '73, both Look and Life magazines have folded (although the former lives on various states up to today) as TV became a bigger moneymaker. And what print work there was became less important from a creative standpoint as clients began to stretch ad's runs (For example, say Chevrolet would go from commissioning 30 or 40 different ads quarterly to maybe 20-30 a year with many ads running for months on end in certain publications).

Ok but this show is not set in the 70s

of course, when you last 7 seasons you can do that

― display name changed. (amateurist)

shhh don't tell David Thomson

XP It'a long range reveal: Harry the schmuck is a visionary, and only Cutler sorta gets it.

I get that. What I am arguing against is that Harry has been historically invaluable to the firm, even though there is zero evidence for that on screen.

So awesome that Peggy got those account men to tear up a little with the intro to her pitch. Let's see a computer do THAT!

Leave us not forget: the best thing Harry ever did, non-professionally, was, when he discovered that his former colleague (who got left behind for McCann, when Sterling Cooper etc escaped the Brits' sale, and took some of the staff with them) was also in the clutches of an increasingly aggressive cult, and losing his mind---Harry talked the guy into taking his Star Trek drafts to Hollywood, and gave him a lot of money(if he still went crazy, at least he could go in style).

Agree that was his finest moment

"What I am arguing against is that Harry has been historically invaluable to the firm, even though there is zero evidence for that on screen."

Who has been "historically invaluable" to the firm based on the on screen evidence (even Don is ultimately replaceable as this season proves)? Everyone's vision of their own self-worth is either grossly inflated (Bert, Roger, Pete, Harry) or they've actually LEFT the firm for periods of time and it just marched on (Joan, Peggy, Ken).

Welcome to the machine

I get that. What I am arguing against is that Harry has been historically invaluable to the firm, even though there is zero evidence for that on screen.

― Οὖτις, Wednesday, May 28, 2014 7:12 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Let's put it another way: He created his own job title & department. Sure Joan could do it better, but only the two of them know that. In fact, since he set his own terms, it's highly likely nobody in the office quite understands his job, or that he can be replaced, He spends loads of time away from the office on the coast doing business, so he isn't under the microscope as much. And apparently when he's back he can pull a "Broadway Joe" rabbit out of the proverbial hat and save the day.

Also i think clients love him because he can make with the whores, aspiring actresses etc. on the quick.

I love that this clip is the first one that comes up when you search Harry on youtube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z47MfkSHX44

only the two of them know that - i don't think either of them know it tbh! she was disappointed but not outraged cuz ultimately she buys into the patriarchy in ways that even peg (who's hardly a radical) doesn't.

Harry seems like one of the few somewhat forward looking people at SC&P (television department, computer) and I would guess that makes him valuable to the company. I'm sure he could be replaced, but he does seem to possess qualities which are lacking elsewhere in the main characters.

of course, when you last 7 seasons you can do that
― display name changed. (amateurist)
shhh don't tell David Thomson
― guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, May 28, 2014 7:07 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i don't get the reference. what did he say about Mad Men?

my favorite example of harry's fecklessness is when he and don are trying to get the rolling stones, and he gets high and eats all the white castle burgers he was supposed to bring home to his family.

there's not going to be any resolution explaining Harry "realistically." harry is a character who (a) has done things on the show that suggest he is forward-thinking (b) is typically portrayed on the same show as a bumbler and a lech and as profoundly uncharismatic.

yeah what good would he be if he were unlikable and incompetent? he would be lou, who couldn't last longer than a half-season.

always took harry to be this joke that he's sort of behind the scenes doing all the heavy lifting that makes the agency profitable but he's boring and unpalatable so we focus on these ineffectual show ponies with tortured inner lives. maybe that's a bit fanciful.

like Harry's away from all the drama, actually making money for them, while they strut around on the "tv" he makes possible. like a meta character.

v. generous reading, lol

haha yes.

also I saw Harry, the actor who plays him, on the F train in Brooklyn once. so that supports my thesis.

you guys have the weirdest harry-blindness just because he's a shmuck

dude started the agency's tv department and forged all the links with the networks that led to very profitable media buys

otm

or yes, what ryan said

it does amuse me how he sort of enrages people in these mad men threads, maybe because he's the most like a message board poster irl??

yeah he's been a valuable employee but more importantly he's a schmuck

Always thought he was a (relatively speaking) likable schmuck tho. Don't get why people genuinely seem to HATE the guy.

he doesn't seem to have many core values, but then not many characters on the show do

i don't hate him but his comparative misfortune is funny.

from the central casting facebook feed:

*Union Submissions only*
Mandy is currently taking union submissions only for a 1960s television show. We are looking for Caucasian looking men and women who appear to be 18-25 yrs. You should also be okay with atmospheric smoke. Ladies you must be okay having your hair cut to your shoulders, and gentlemen you must be okay getting a conservative haircut. You must be available for a fitting Thurs 6/5 to work Monday 6/9. Please submit to centralman✧✧✧@gm✧✧✧.c✧✧ and put UNIVERSITY in the subject line.

is sally checking out colleges already?

It's probably for something else. I know some people attached to a "early days of NASA" pilot that's due to start shooting here later this year/early '15. There's bound to be more. #panamtaughtthemnothing

that reminds me - anyone watch the halt and catch fire pilot? any good?

Has it already aired? I thought it was this coming Sunday.

was Pan Am really that bad? i'm not sure it even aired over here.

AMC put the Halt and Catch Fire pilot up on tumblr for some weird reason

also that early days of NASA show is from a couple of Mad Men writers

c'mon everyone who works for a bureaucracy knows a Harry: "dependable," often valuable, but you groan having to sit next to him at the annual company awards dinner. He's forgettable.

led to very profitable media buys

see, here's the thing, NO ONE on the show has ever acknowledged that Harry's efforts have any significant impact on the firm's bottom line. to assume that this is the case, that he is somehow the one bringing in all the money, is just bizarre.