Yeah, Charlie Varrick is a great point of comparison.
― WilliamC, Thursday, 19 March 2015 23:45 (nine years ago) link
/well, this last episode the only reason he "did the right thing" was to help out his lawyer friend Kim./You could say that he helped the Kettlemans too, at least their kids, by forcing them to accept the deal... Though of course he benefitted from that too./Walt, even after remission, never really did./Was that really case? When the cancer went into remission, I don't think the doctor said that it will inevitably come back and that Walt will inevitably die within a couple of years. It felt more like that, after the remission, the "I have no future" thing was just something Walt kept telling himself so he'd have no reason to quit being Heisenberg. Wasn't there even some episode where Walt confessed that he felt lost, because with the cancer diagnosis he had a clear direction in life, and after the remission that direction was gone?
You could say that he helped the Kettlemans too, at least their kids, by forcing them to accept the deal... Though of course he benefitted from that too.
/Walt, even after remission, never really did./
Was that really case? When the cancer went into remission, I don't think the doctor said that it will inevitably come back and that Walt will inevitably die within a couple of years. It felt more like that, after the remission, the "I have no future" thing was just something Walt kept telling himself so he'd have no reason to quit being Heisenberg. Wasn't there even some episode where Walt confessed that he felt lost, because with the cancer diagnosis he had a clear direction in life, and after the remission that direction was gone?
Well yeah that was a huge turning point when Walt went into remission. I'm not really talking about the cancer per se just that I never felt that Walt would be alive at the end of the series.
― smoochy-woochy touchy-wouchy, (sunny successor), Thursday, 19 March 2015 23:59 (nine years ago) link
the final scene with jimmy kicking the door - i wasn't entirely sure i followed this. did losing the money from the kettlemans mean he wouldn't be able to afford his new office, or was he upset because his friend was staying with the rival company?
― why dont u say something or like just die (dog latin), Friday, 20 March 2015 11:52 (nine years ago) link
i took that to mean he couldnt afford the new office
― tayto fan (Michael B), Friday, 20 March 2015 12:03 (nine years ago) link
kim had already politely declined his offer
― tayto fan (Michael B), Friday, 20 March 2015 12:04 (nine years ago) link
Betsy Kettleman is such a great character.
― why dont u say something or like just die (dog latin), Friday, 20 March 2015 12:14 (nine years ago) link
"Don't look back, honey. Always forward. Always in life, look forward."
― why dont u say something or like just die (dog latin), Friday, 20 March 2015 12:16 (nine years ago) link
yeah, that was a great line. she's wonderful.
― ƋППṍӮɨ∏ğڵșěᶉᶇдM℮ (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Friday, 20 March 2015 14:16 (nine years ago) link
Something about this latest episode tipped it over into "better than Breaking Bad" territory for me.
eh this is crazytalk
I like this show a lot but it's still just breaking bad minus the leads at this point. 7 episodes in and michael mckean is the closest thing to a memorable character who wasn't in the original show.
― iatee, Friday, 20 March 2015 23:09 (nine years ago) link
pacing feels very different from BB to me
― Οὖτις, Friday, 20 March 2015 23:10 (nine years ago) link
looking at wikipedia - only 1 out of the 7 episodes so far wasn't written by someone who worked on breaking bad
nobody is gonna want to fuck w/ the formula when it works, but if they really wanted to make a real break w/ breaking bad they shoulda put it in another city and not brought back mike as a lead
― iatee, Friday, 20 March 2015 23:15 (nine years ago) link
idg yr criticisms - it can't be better than the first series, because it's about the same people? no one's arguing that the show's not set in the same locale, with the same characters, etc. but it's tone and direction and the kind of stories/conflicts it's focusing on are pretty different. and like I said upthread, I prefer Jimmy as a protagonist to Walt, he's just more interesting/funnier/more nuanced. Walt was pretty one-note - and that was his main virtue! - but BB wasn't really interested in moral ambiguities the way BCS is shaping up to be.
― Οὖτις, Friday, 20 March 2015 23:18 (nine years ago) link
'Walt was pretty one-note - and that was his main virtue! - but BB wasn't really interested in moral ambiguities the way BCS is shaping up to be.'
I don't even know how to answer this
― iatee, Friday, 20 March 2015 23:33 (nine years ago) link
IDGI either, the show is doing something vv different from BB, even if it's using some of the same visual language and is technically set in the same universe. It's primarily going for pathos and humor as opposed to tension (as opposed to the other way around), for starters.
― fuck me, archipelago (Simon H.), Friday, 20 March 2015 23:38 (nine years ago) link
anyway another issue w/ the show is that it kinda boxed itself in w/ the timeline - some stuff is gonna happen, jimmy will become saul, but there's kinda only so much that can happen. it's really hard to imagine this lasting for 5 seasons and not because 'it's not good' but just because we already now where it ends and it's not a particularly exciting place.
if it had been a sequel it would probably be harder to sell it as 'a different show' but the writers would have a lot more room to go wild w/ the character and locations.
― iatee, Friday, 20 March 2015 23:39 (nine years ago) link
It's primarily going for pathos and humor as opposed to tension (as opposed to the other way around), for starters.
yeah but the pathos and humor is exactly the same pathos and humor that the character had when he was on a show called breaking bad
― iatee, Friday, 20 March 2015 23:41 (nine years ago) link
if they really wanted to make a real break w/ breaking bad they shoulda put it in another city and not brought back mike as a lead
yeah: also not brought back Saul, and called it Better Call Saul
big mistake there, I bet they feel embarrassed
― oochie wally (clean version) (sic), Friday, 20 March 2015 23:53 (nine years ago) link
No there is def a different level of pathos to saul on this show
― Οὖτις, Friday, 20 March 2015 23:57 (nine years ago) link
He was never shown wrestling w his conscience on BB
― Οὖτις, Friday, 20 March 2015 23:58 (nine years ago) link
re: the timeline, I may eat my words later but I'm willing to bet the series catches us up to a certain point and then leapfrogs to after the events of BB
― fuck me, archipelago (Simon H.), Saturday, 21 March 2015 00:02 (nine years ago) link
(I mean, it kinda HAS to at some point, given he flashforward that opens the series, but I'm hoping it does it significantly before the end of its run)
― fuck me, archipelago (Simon H.), Saturday, 21 March 2015 00:03 (nine years ago) link
they probably don't feel embarrassed cause they were cool w/ the fact that a show w/ the same writers, producers, actors and characters, set in the same city was gonna end up a lot like breaking bad
― iatee, Saturday, 21 March 2015 00:03 (nine years ago) link
while I'm complaining about a show that I actually do like - kim wexler feels like a totally empty character who got sucked into this universe from some later era l&o season or something.
― iatee, Saturday, 21 March 2015 00:12 (nine years ago) link
Poorly written female characters v much in the tradition of BB
― Οὖτις, Saturday, 21 March 2015 01:06 (nine years ago) link
tbh can't wait for him to ditch his conscience, and by that I mean commit his brother and become a bus stop bench-advertising sleaze
― mh, Saturday, 21 March 2015 02:31 (nine years ago) link
"I'm not Slippin' Jimmy anymore!"
wait until he's into the Saul persona, has the ads, and has a nightmare with "Slippin' Jimmy" written on a billboard
― mh, Saturday, 21 March 2015 02:33 (nine years ago) link
Would love it if the last couple of seasons were just the breaking bad storyline told from jimmy's perspective.
― why dont u say something or like just die (dog latin), Saturday, 21 March 2015 03:06 (nine years ago) link
iatee and Otic both very much off the money in this thread
― why dont u say something or like just die (dog latin), Saturday, 21 March 2015 03:07 (nine years ago) link
That said kim wexler codes very similarly to Carrie Mathison in Homeland for me right now and I'm having the same disorienting effect as the first time I encountered Saul and had trouble separating him from GOB in Arrested Development as a character. It's not that any of them are the same, just first impressions and certain traits had me thrown at first.
― why dont u say something or like just die (dog latin), Saturday, 21 March 2015 03:10 (nine years ago) link
how so? the whole Saul character did a lot of wincing and eye-rolling and hemming/hawing throughout Breaking Bad, and the entire setup of that show was that all of the characters, even the sleazy lawyer, had a conscience and background even if the show didn't spell it out. idk if it translates, but Saul's "jokes" about how in hiding he'd be working at a Cinnabon in Nebraska -- which proves true at the beginning of this series -- is an admission that his life is going to go straight to purgatory due to how he's lived. not hell, because he's schemed and bought his way through life, but he's not worthy of anything better due to some past actions and his BB lifestyle couldn't give him enough money to climb any higher.
I do feel bad for the Kim character so far, really does seem like an aspirational type ripped from a different show, where she might date a down-on-his-luck cop and not the future Saul
― mh, Saturday, 21 March 2015 03:14 (nine years ago) link
Saul and GOB are not at all alike other than being American, tallish, and having receding hairlines
― mh, Saturday, 21 March 2015 03:15 (nine years ago) link
DL is it possible that if two characters look vaguely similar and are american you think they're the same? You just pulled that trick with two blonde women.
― mh, Saturday, 21 March 2015 03:19 (nine years ago) link
you guys all look the same to me.
― why dont u say something or like just die (dog latin), Saturday, 21 March 2015 03:23 (nine years ago) link
The actress who plays Kim does have a similar low voice as Claire Danes, but that's about it for their similarities. Also, I don't feel her character is out of place? BCS is decidedly more mundane and less OTT than BB, so a more down-to-earth character with normal aspirations fits, IMO.
― Tuomas, Saturday, 21 March 2015 09:38 (nine years ago) link
Xps there was an interview ages ago with Gilligan or one of the writers that said the show would be set "before, during and after" BB. Tbh I hope they keep that to short flash-forwards, I'm not sure how much of gene I need to see.
― sexpost TMIing! (wins), Saturday, 21 March 2015 09:54 (nine years ago) link
Sorta get the impression that Walt & Jesse didn't take up a gigantic amount of Saul's time until the point they decided to go to war with Gus Fring, and then they basically ruined his life? So you would theoretically be able to run this concurrently with Breaking Bad, but I'm not sure how convincing it would be, and it would be virtually impossible to make it stand alone as its own show (as it more or less is up until now).
I don't feel like this is that episodic at present - the three main plot strands (Mike case, drug dealers, Kettelmans) all feel closely interwoven already.
― Matt DC, Saturday, 21 March 2015 10:27 (nine years ago) link
would watch a serious dramatic spin off on how George Oscar became 'GOB'
― AB de Villiers Terrace (King Boy Pato), Saturday, 21 March 2015 11:00 (nine years ago) link
another great episode; the direction/cinematography is consistently the best on tv.Though it sorta cheats to get there, this feels like the most successful first season of any show i can think of. Comparing BCS to BB is a bit of a fool's game for a dozen reasons, most notably that Saul hasn't really had time to prove itself but I'm inclined even at this early stage to say Gilligan has figured out how to achieve consistent excellence.the major issue is that we know the outcome of all these character's arcs so there's a lot less at stake. gilligan's smart enough to take that into account, I'm looking forward to getting us back to post Breaking Bad life where anything's possible again in s.2
― Maybe in 100 years someone will say damn Dawn was dope. (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 24 March 2015 05:48 (nine years ago) link
I really like the casual way the show reveals aspects of the backstory. We didn't have any *urgent* need to know how Kim and Jimmy know each other or why Jimmy's relationship with the firm is so poisonous, but finding that stuff out right now is particularly poignant.
― fuck me, archipelago (Simon H.), Tuesday, 24 March 2015 05:51 (nine years ago) link
copyroom scene with Hamlin was super well done imo"you want this open or shut?"
― Maybe in 100 years someone will say damn Dawn was dope. (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 24 March 2015 05:51 (nine years ago) link
I wonder what transpires between now and breaking bad where Mike is able to see Kaylee unsupervised but the mom won't even talk to him
Well I guess I got my answer tonight.
― smoochy-woochy touchy-wouchy, (sunny successor), Tuesday, 24 March 2015 08:13 (nine years ago) link
my dvr cut off during the previews for next week, but is Chuck better and outside of his house in that preview?
― akm, Tuesday, 24 March 2015 15:06 (nine years ago) link
(I know he was outside the house at the end of the episode but it's not clear what happens next)
he's outside in the previews.i took that (somewhat clunky) moment as the scene where he finally realizes this is in his head
― Maybe in 100 years someone will say damn Dawn was dope. (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 24 March 2015 15:12 (nine years ago) link
loved the way jimmy croaked how he was watching the opera while covered in adult diapers
― tayto fan (Michael B), Tuesday, 24 March 2015 18:39 (nine years ago) link
I think this was the episode where this show started to click for me as its own thing, enjoyable completely outside the bbad context
― Clay, Tuesday, 24 March 2015 19:08 (nine years ago) link
Seems like there's more comedy moments than in Breaking Bad
― paolo, Tuesday, 24 March 2015 19:27 (nine years ago) link
We pretty much knew that was going to be the case as soon as the show was green-lit.
Just watched last night's episode — this show is so good.
― WilliamC, Tuesday, 24 March 2015 21:33 (nine years ago) link
I am still kind of hoping for some "client of the week" type episodes where it's a straight-up farce
― mh, Tuesday, 24 March 2015 21:36 (nine years ago) link
that doesn't look very likely
― Οὖτις, Tuesday, 24 March 2015 21:46 (nine years ago) link