School me on SONOS and other home streaming systems

you can use the desktop app to connect to your cca or other spotify connect devices

http://i.imgur.com/hXxHtSh.png

I got the Chromecast too, and so far I've been pretty happy with it. I find it a bit weird that there's no off switch though. Even when I'm not streaming anything it stays warm, there doesn't seem to be any "go to sleep after 30 minutes of inuse" setting or anything. I guess it's not that dangerous or anything, but it still feels stupid there's no timed sleep state, since even mp3 players have it these days.

I found that that if you don't want to spend too much money and you're okay with 320kb mp3 quality stream, the best option is Google Play + Chromecast Audio. Even with if you only opt for the free account, Google Play allows you to upload 50,000 songs from your own library to their server, which you can then stream to Chromecast. So this way you don't have to keep your computer on, and you can still listen to music you've ripped from CD or bought as files. But the downsize to this is that if you're an audiophile and want to stream FLACs to the Chromecast, you can't do that even with a paid Google Play account, the highest quality is always a 320kb mp3 stream.

I acquired the 30 day trial account for Google Play's music service, and so far it seems fine, can't really see that much difference to Spotify. It seems the amount of music available is roughly the same too. (Google Play claims they have a 35 million track catalogue, the latest info I could on Spotify says it has 30 million, but this is from last June. It's weird that Spotify don't mention their catalogue size on their own site?)

But since I'm somehat an audiophile, I like to have the option to stream my own music library as FLACs. It seems there are three options how to do this:

1) Get a paid account for Dropbox/Onedrive/Google Drive or some other cloud drive, upload your library there, then get an app for your mobile/pad that can stream music from cloud to Chromecast. This option means you don't have to have your computer on while streaming music, and of course you can listen to your library through the mobile outside home too. The downside is that this'll cost you at least 10 euros per month for the cloud drive.

2) Get one of those NAS things. This has the same benefits as solution 1, the only difference is that you don't have to pay a monthly fee for a cloud drive rather one payment for the NAS. But they are quite expensive still, the cheapest solution for me would still cost something like 250 euros. It's tempting, but I guess I'll wait to see whether their prices go down. Also, since the NAS has to be plugged in all the time, it'll raise your electricity bills, but so does keeping your computer on to stream music from there.

3) Stream FLACs from your computer with a music database software + an app that lets you control it from your mobile. This is what I'm doing for now, because it's much cheaper and more flexible than options 1 and 2. I'm using Subsonic, which is an open source database/streaming software that allows you tweak it quite a lot, which I like. It costs 1 dollar per month, but it also lets you to stream movies to your bluray player/smart TV and lossless music to your amplifier, if it has network connection. So basically I could play all the music through my amplifier without needing the Chromecast at all, but the amp's simplified interface allows me to browse folder only, which is quite a hassle when you have thousands and thousands of tunes on the computer. So I find using Chromecast + a mobile app that works with Subsonic (I used one called DSub, it cost 3 euros, but it's more versatile than Subsonic's official free app) to be much nicer, plus it can do stuff like playing a shuffled playlist of all the tracks tagged under one genre, which is nice if you feel like having a quiet ambient evening or whatever.

There are some free database/streaming softwares that do roughly the same as Subsonic, but I haven't liked as much. Plex only allows for mp3 streaming (like Google Play), so no lossless music through that. And while Logitech's free alternative does stream FLACs, it's user interface is very bad.

So yeah, those seem to be the options with Chromecast, as far as I can tell. If you some new info or tweaks to add to this, I'd love to hear about it.

If you don't mind keeping your computer on you could use it as a server with software like Serviio

Re uploading stuff to google play - what happens if you upload your pirated collection?

Re flac/cd-quality streaming, Tidal has a hifi subscription that will give you cd quality streaming (HD/24 bit is on the way) and should integrate with cca soon

Re uploading stuff to google play - what happens if you upload your pirated collection?

I don't know, I don't have any pirated files. :) But if I did, I guess I wouldn't upload them, though I can't seen how Google would differentiate those from legal files... It's not like they're gonna ask me to send receipts for everything I've uploaded.

Re flac/cd-quality streaming, Tidal has a hifi subscription that will give you cd quality streaming (HD/24 bit is on the way) and should integrate with cca soon

I checked into Tidal when I was looking into various Chromecast streaming options, and it looks they've been promising Chromecast support for over a year now, so I wouldn't cross my fingers. Of course, if you have an Android mobile/pad, you can mirror whatever you play on any app into Chromecast, but this method seems much more prone to freezing than using apps with official Chromecast streaming function.

If you don't mind keeping your computer on you could use it as a server with software like Serviio

Yeah, this is the same as what Subsonic does, but I chose it because its Android apps have Chromecast support, so you don't have use the mirroring trick I mentioned above. Don't know if Serviio apps have that function too?

I quite like the AppleTV, the 'hockey puck' ones (version 2 and 3) work great without a TV attached. You'll need an amp that has digital inputs (HDMI or optical) but then you're set. And they're hitting the second hand market in large numbers now that the new one is out, you can pick a perfectly good one up for 40-50 bucks.

what happens if you upload your pirated collection?
Nothing, except that it refuses to upload MP3's that were bought on Google Play and subsequently distributed.

Everything about setting up Sonos has been a dream, the app is amazing, sound quality is great, recognises my server and my shared music fine.

Except for some reason the simple act of trying to add a second phone controller is an absolute fucking nightmare. Anyone else had this problem?

part 1 : phew.
part 2 : no idea.

oh, and this morning i had an update of the app (windows pc as opposed to phone) : it now will connect to Apple Music.

Also the Soundcloud and Mixcloud integration is fantastic. Just started listening to random old Essential Mixes on my stereo just for the sake of doing so at the touch of a button.

damn, never even thought about connecting sonos to my mixcloud/soundcloud accounts!?

time for mouldy old dough on the stereo properly ...

basically, i have never looked into the services as i only ever use it to play my local archive ..

Assuming your second device is connected to your wifi network, what happens when you launch the Sonos app? I didn't have any issues adding a second controller.

Hmmm. There was no problem here with other devices - we've got three phones, and ipad and a laptop successfully controlling it.

It just couldn't find the Sonos, tried several times. Might have been a brief blackout or something but I'll try again tomorrow. My phone stopped seeing it at the same time.

Also right now I'm really regretting allowing 15 years' worth of shitty metadata build up.

Re uploading stuff to google play - what happens if you upload your pirated collection?

I don't know, I don't have any pirated files. :) But if I did, I guess I wouldn't upload them, though I can't seen how Google would differentiate those from legal files... It's not like they're gonna ask me to send receipts for everything I've uploaded.

i have tons of said mp3s on my google drive

re soundcloud : bloody hell, if you have not connected, then bill brewsters account is stuffed with brilliance !

hearing this stuff via my stereo as opposed to crappy laptop is a revelation.

right, makes sense - the one annoyance was moments of it not quite connecting, but I've fiddled with router positioning a bit and that helped.

re router chaos :
if the wi-fi is acting up, then turn your electrical power points into a direct ethernet connection to your router.
hello tp-link.
has transformed my house.
advert over.

Also, check the channel your router is set to. I think SONOS works best on 11. There's documentation about this on their support site.

Which TP Link do you have? Tell us more, I could use something like this.

Like Google remotely gives a shit about your pirated music, they know all about it anyway.

Everything about setting up Sonos has been a dream, the app is amazing, sound quality is great, recognises my server and my shared music fine.

i'm always fairly impressed by the sound quality. i have one sonos 1 and you can get huge volume and quality - i would say two of them would be a great setup - i keep intending to buy a second one.

Which TP Link do you have? Tell us more, I could use something like this.

i use this to extend my wi-fi, and hardwire my sonos connect into the router via an electricity power point :

http://www.tp-link.com/en/products/details/cat-18_TL-WPA4220.html

there are non wi-fi versions which i have a few. they are a bit cheaper :

http://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-LINK-PA411KIT-Powerline-Adapter-Starter/dp/B0084Y9N3O

Yeah I plugged mine straight into my existing system and it seemed to take little bit of time to warm up, quality-wise, but now it sounds great. Will probably buy a second speaker for the kitchen though.

Forgive the dumm question but with a SONOS could I have a speaker in say a totally different room and decide I want to listen to music just on that speaker? And then theoretically someone in another room could listen simultaneously to something different?

yup

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I'll second the plug for powerline Ethernet adapters ... I use several to support my multi-room system, the bandwidth and reliability are much better than wifi

even though the spotify app nominally supports chromecast audio, for some reason i can never see the chromecast in the list of devices unless i first cast something to it from my phone. very annoying...

but i found a solution: https://github.com/andresgottlieb/soundcast

this application that allows you cast the native osx audio to the chromecast. it just puts a little button in the menu bar at the top (just like airplay) that you can press to turn casting on and off. i can now listen to music from itunes, spotify app, anything

So I went and bought an additional speaker for the kitchen at the weekend, so I guess you could call me a true believer now. Amazed at how powerful and detailed the sound is for quite a small unit (and that the whole house synced up so seamlessly).

Like, just being able to press one button on your phone and for an album to immediately play on your hifi and in another room in the house is beyond classic in a way that I hadn't really appreciated in theory.

Ha, I know the feeling. I make an effort to moderate my enthusiasm when people ask about wireless streaming options so I don't come across as a corporate shill, but it's hard to overstate the degree to which this system has enhanced the experience of listening to music in my home.

If you have access to an iOS device the Trueplay room tuning is pretty cool -- it really opened up the sound of the Play:1 in the kitchen (they haven't been able to implement it for Android because with so many manufacturers they don't have a standardized internal microphone).

I have that Marantz too, and it's frustratingly patchy on the network: AirPlay just dies/drops/refuses to connect quite a lot. It sounds great when it's working, mind.

been on an archiving groove of late.

current Sonos stats :

MAX 65000
COUNT 59123

at this rate it looks like i have another year before i have to figure out my options.

Why use a short to hold ids? It's 2016!

https://en.community.sonos.com/wireless-speakers-228992/future-the-65k-limit-6046321

limits aside, i love the sonos connect.

i think the way i will workaround this is to switch on media streaming on the NAS.

then tap into the NAS drive using the 'media servers' option as opposed to mapping the folder location as a drive.

pretty certain that will bypass the 65k limit.

i think the way i will workaround this is to switch on media streaming on the NAS.

as i approach the 65K limit i came to find out that sonos does not actually support DNLA, so switching on media streaming on my NAS makes no difference.

humph.

Wait so what's the 65k limit? If I have a laptop with a local iTunes library of say 80k, can a sonos play from that library?

its an inbuilt limit from way back when they started making the hardware (a mix of s/w and ha/w restrictions apparently!).
basically, if you have a local digital library of more than 65K individual tracks then sonos cannot index it all.
it's a massive issue for people like me with NAS based archives as opposed to the streaming options that sonos has focused on in recent times.
i am at 62K at the moment, but still have quite a lot of my cd archive to digitise, hence the eye on the horizon.
there are a multitude of options to get around it (set up a stripped back simple windows media server to index the archive, as sonos can 'see' windows media servers),
but all the alternatives are rather fiddly.
i will probably have two separate digital archives, and index then as and when i need.
not ideal, but an easy workaround.
however, if sonos enabled DNLA compatibility then all would be lovely, but i am not holding my breath.

Ugh. I was thinking of getting one but my library is like 85k do I guess it's a no-go. I don't want to do workarounds because the point of getting a sonos would be ease of use. I really just want a speaker that's good enough to fill my 30m2 room and that I can play to from iPhones and my MacBook. I don't currently have any plans for a streaming subscription.

that seems like too much music. how can you guys possibly like/consume that amount of music?

The rather similar denon alternative HEOS supports dlna

does that HEOS push a networked digital archive into a hi-fi amp ?
i don't do sonos wireless speakers stuff, just the 'sonos connect'.
as that seems to the be the best way to feed my archive into my amp easily via a desktop app.
(i used to have a set up whereby the amp could see the archive, but the album/track selection was all via an onboard 3 line display - f*cking impossible to use !)

Have you considered something like Amazon Music? They'll let you upload 250,000 tracks for $25/year and stream through Sonos. 256kbs I think though which I guess isn't enough for some people.

With me, Chromecast + Subsonic virtual server on the computer + Subsonic app on my pad allows me to cast anything as FLACs from my computer to the amp, browse music on the app, create playlists, etc. No upper limits on the library size, AFAIK. I doubt I'll need anything fancier soon.

Have you considered something like Amazon Music? They'll let you upload 250,000 tracks for $25/year and stream through Sonos. 256kbs I think though which I guess isn't enough for some people.

never seen that before.
could be an option.

ahh .. the small print seems to indicate that you have to be an amazon prime subscriber in the uk, which i have considered signing up for, but still.