thread of getting sw0le

like i'm not rly unhappy w/ my strength or anything but I want my v small belly to git and idk it'd be cool to have petite biceps who knows. also my lung capacity is 50% what it should be (bcz ribcage) so while I have a good amt of endurance, intense anything (like sprinting a block) makes me very very winded

in many exercises it seems that good form is a corollary to good posture. the bad form I tend to see (including my own at times) is a direct result of people so used to hunching over they don't even realize they are doing it and basically it takes a lot of mental re-wiring to overcome that.

― ryan, Wednesday, February 24, 2016 8:13 AM (4 days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

This is otm, especially the "mental re-wiring" part -- trying to learn lifting is really making me more aware of certain brain-body connections and of how hard it can be to do seemingly simple kinds of movement that I'm not used to.

Hey Stevie - Not an expert, but here's my two cents. The most important thing when you start going to the gym is to find a routine you can stick with and commit to. Basically all you're trying to do, imo, is get to the gym and keep going to the gym. What you do there doesn't matter much at first. No point overloading yourself with schedules and goals you can't realistically stick with. Going to the gym really sucks at first, but once you get into the habit of it, it becomes pretty easy. Go there, spend an hour there, and count is as a victory when that hour is up.From there you can refine your workout and find something that works for you.

Three times a week for an hour is a perfect starting goal. It is very, very doable, and you'll see results fast. Four times some week is better but maybe unrealistic at first; two times you won't see any returns at all. So three is a great start.

For strength exercises, I like full body exercises and compound exercises (discussed up thread) that work multiple muscle groups. Think push-ups, bench presses, planks, dead lifts, squats, etc. Don't get too caught up in all those machines that only work one small muscle, at least at first. Compound exercises are much more efficient.

If you're trying to lose weight, maybe do a half an hour of strength and a half hour of cardio? I don't do much cardio, but if you can do it for 20 minutes, you get a small endorphin rush that makes going further a little easier. Think of it as your reward for sticking with something shitty. Do a different workout every day you are there. The more variety you get, the more muscle confusion you create, and the more returns you see.

Diet wise, just cut out most refined carbs and all flagrant added sugar from your diet. Focus on protein and veggies.

A few simple steps and you'll see a lot of results (that belly will go away really fast). But again, don't get too lost in the weeds to start. Just force yourself to go for an hour three times a week, and that's 70% of the battle.

^ 95% of the entire diet/workout industry made irrelevant in one post

muscle confusion is not real. it's ok to do the same thing every time. or alternate every other time. you can even go twice a week if 3 is going to overwhelm you. i sometimes go once a week because my job is hard and it still works.

in fact, you will make better progress and be able to track progress more effectively if you do not just fuck around with a new thing every day

agree with that.

my advice to all is do something you're going to keep doing, that is fun and productive. stevie you won't get that huge doing some weights unless you try to. free weights are fun. you can do dumbbells. like db bench press, standing press, rows, goblet squats, lunges (s0re), etc. just start with something light and go up the next time (however it is hard to do this every time with 5 lb increments so you can do less reps when you increase). good thing about all of those is you can do any of them every time you go to the gym if you want. and how to do them is all over youtube & pretty intuitive. also not scary. most of the dudes in the free weight area have no clue what they are doing. i am a gym anthropologist.

i might get a new job soon. or at least this year. when i do i'm going to go to a new gym and go like all the time. it's all i care about!!!!!

btw i did some sprints yesterday. because it was warm. i have not run all winter. i thought 30 seconds would be easy. oh boy. i felt like my lungs were on fire. i'll try 15 seconds next time.

my advice to all is do something you're going to keep doing

― #amazing #babies #touching (harbl), Monday, February 29, 2016 7:19 AM (5 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

most important thing^, second most important thing is dont get injured

do free weights tho not machines lol

machines are fine, tbh, depending on your goals (ie esp. if concerns are mostly aesthetic) - plenty of bros do nothing but machine circuits and look 'good.'

There's no such thing as toning or any of that - if you want to get rid of a belly/beer gut, it really boils down to 'eat less'/'eat better.' Some form of relatively low-carb whole food is the easiest way for most people that I've seen.

machines r bad

I feel more inclined to use machines bcz it seems like they wd be safer and I'd be less prone to injury?

Also thinking abt paying for like idk 5 personal trainer sessions and being like "ok this is my body and this is what i want, help me"

machines promote injury

just watch youtube like everyone else stevie jeez, go slow and dont do anything crazy and youll be fine, like you can start out lifting some light ass dumbells nbd

Don't pay for a personal trainer. Your average gym trainer is going to do you more harm than good for lots of money - they try and rush you through a bunch of circuits in half an hour and generally are immune to giving you simple, basic weight progressions.

I disagree that machines promote injury any more than barbells and dumbbells.

real talk: 'this is my body and this is want I want,' a good trainer is just going to tell you to do the stuff this thread has recommended. Eat less, do light cardio (walking/biking/etc.) pretty much every day, lift weights a few times a week

machines promote injury because they encourage unnatural unbalanced repetitive motions

Don't worry too much about injury at this point, just stay in the range of weight that's challenging but not excruciating, and do standard, established exercises and don't try to reinvent the wheel. And use youtube to improve your form.

omg stfu man ALWAYS WORRY ABOUT INJURY, shd be the primary thing u worry about, if you get injured you cant exercise, getting injured is massively counter producutive

i started bench pressing w 20s/25s and within three months was up to 50s/55s. thats still not much but i have a freakishly long wingspan for my height so chest exercises have always been a hassle. used to use machines and never saw those kinda gains, you have to use all kinda different body parts to stabilize a free weight, so much better all around imo

xp

most weight machines are designed to allow seated users to push or pull loads with a few isolated muscles, without requiring them to stabilize their spines or engage other muscle groups in the synergistic ways required by activities like running, jumping, climbing, moving heavy non-gym objects, fighting, doing manual labor, etc.

people who only train on machines won't improve their performance on those kinds of tasks and are potentially more vulnerable to injury if they attempt them (because their large sw0le muscles may be able to generate more force than the small deep muscles supporting their joints and spines have been conditioned to support)

lag∞n OTM re injury

"i started bench pressing w 20s/25s and within three months was up to 50s/55s. thats still not much"

These are great gains. Too much heavier than this and you'll need a spotter to help you get the weights into place.

"They don't work stabilizers" and "there's no crossover to <x>" are only relevant if you start doing things that make them relevant. If you've only used a machine bench press, no, you should not move over to a barbell bench at the same weight. You should also not move from a barbell bench press to dumbbell bench press at the same weight, because the former doesn't work the same stabilizers there, either. If you don't go climbing, lack of crossover to climbing is irrelevant.

If you're lifting to improve the way you look without a shirt, there's absolutely nothing wrong with a machine program and serious lifters concentrated on machines for damn near 30 years before free weights started coming back into vogue.

As far as athletics go, most S&C programs are a mixture of machines, free-weights and bodyweight movements. Walk into a college or pro football gym and it's not going to be devoid of machines.

I don't know of any medical sources that strictly recommend against machines - theoretically "repetitive motion" could cause injury, I suppose, but so could improper knee tracking during a barbell squat. It would be hard to take anyone seriously who said they knew a bunch of free-weight users who had never injured themselves.

my casual reading has suggested that eg a standing cable chest press is actually better/safer than the bench press, and you don't need a spotter

TBC I didn't mean injury is not a concern, I just meant that injury is not that likely in a low-level beginner workout as long as you're warming up, following a reasonable routine, using reasonable amounts of weight, paying attention to form etc.

I agree, it's easier to get hurt with free weights than with machines, but in one sense that's a safety feature ... people tend to approach free weights more cautiously and concentrate more on correct form. Weight machines can protect users from many possible injuries, but they can also teach people how to move heavy loads without stabilizing their bodies with respect to gravity ... this can be counterproductive when they get off the machines.

The injury risk I'm fretting over comes from training primarily on machines and then trying to do stability-challenging movements ... this is most likely to affect people who are using weight machines to look good but who occasionally want to play basketball or whatever.

These days I think a lot of pro S&C coaches try to make their programs as functional as possible, in the sense of helping athletes work on movement patterns that resemble performance skills ... there's no substitute for squats, dead lifts, etc. for hypertrophy and strength, and machines can definitely help too, but task-specific power is what differentiates the best players, and that comes from spending as much time as possible training high-quality movement.

i started bench pressing w 20s/25s and within three months was up to 50s/55s.

ˆthis is v impressive, an example of somebody who really did their eating, much respect due

using free weights, being cautious about injury (no need to ramp it up until you've plateaued for at least a few weeks), and only paying for a trainer if you can afford it/it's the only way you'll get into the gym: all good advices

It was also noted above that the absolute most important thing is just to get to the gym regularly over a prolonged period of time. For me this is by far harder than figuring out what to do when I'm in the gym, and it's really about establishing an automatic habit. I have some tricks I have used, maybe some corny or quirky, but they have worked well for me. They are largely about reducing "resistance" to going and giving yourself pavlovian signals and rewards for going.

- Have a gym bag that is always packed and ready to go with everything you need - change of clothes (if you change at the gym), lock for your locker, shoes, headphones, snack, etc. Always have it packed, like an emergency go bag.

- If you are the type of person who keeps a planner or google cal or whatever, put it on your calendar at a certain time, like it's an appointment you have to make

- Be friendly with the gym staff when you go -- there's a weird psychological effect of having the staff know your name (for some people) that makes you want to show up

- Find at least some things you actually enjoy doing in the gym. For me, when I was working out at the Y, this was basketball. Now I don't have a gym with a court, but I'm in the rhythm of working out enough that it doesn't matter.

- Set an iPhone alarm with a special tone/sound that is only for the gym, and grab the bag and go as soon as you hear the alarm

- Have something with a little bit of sugar right after your workout -- this is tricky since you don't want to be like burning 100 calories and then drinking a 400 calorie juice, but maybe a protein bar or just a small handful of trail mix that has a little bit of chocolate in it. This makes you crave going to the gym because you crave the reward.

^ Some fantastic advice, especially the gym bag thing.

Stevie, I'd worry about a personal trainer overloading you; you want to start with slow, managable, even somewhat enjoyable steps. That being said, if using a personal trainer makes you commit to going to the gym (you need to be there at a certain time, a certain amount per week), then it could be a very good thing. You'll also get some good tips as to what exercises you should be focusing on, which could be cool.

There's very little risk of you hurting yourself. Just use common sense fairly lightweights (which you want to do anyway, because you are trying to slim down, not bulk up).

just catching up after some time away... don't get me started on "long, lean muscle" lol

DJP I know I'm already That Guy itt but if you want lean/strong/breath support yoga is... kinda amazing. learning curve means it takes longer to see the results but it's worth it. nothing has done more for me purely as a vocalist.

Decided to p much start from scratch on my squat and start doing regular mobility work at home. My hips are locked up as fuck and I've been compensating in bad ways, even started to feel a little pain in the left knee. Need to swallow my pride and let go of the weight for a while.

I have found it; the illusive thread that is WRONGer than the coffee thread. Damn, dudes, you're gonna get somebody killed.

vague and pass-agg post. but unrelatedly i might start a new thread.

lol get someone killed. It's just excersise geez relaxed dude. Probably more dangerous to NOT be doing any of this.

Near-max lifts on free weights, discouraging the use of trainers and machines, recommending youtube: ok, killed is an exaggeration (unless someone is bench pressing too much alone, in which case it's a real possibiltty), but this is garbage advice that could get someone hurt.

should i c+p all the posts saying "start light" or "work with a trainer if you can or want" or "here are some resources by respected authorities on how to do this"

Near-max lifts on free weights

i don't think anyone in here is telling someone with no experience to do that.

Ok, y'all, knock yourselves out. Beginners: there are a million and six ways to get fit. Bodies are all very different. There is bad advice on this thread and competent trainers are a bigger help than youtube videos. Good luck!

you were posting on this thread months ago holmes, no idea what your beef is now

...and I've been lifting for longer. This thread wasn't circling into weird consensus, ilxor-style yet. Now it is, and people are asking for real advice sincerely, and getting weird dogmatic answers back. That's not cool.

I mean, you have every right to your new age internet powerlifting thread with now interference from me, but the thread title is misleading and bad advice is being handed out to beginners. Not good.

the thread title is hilarious and there is a whole shitton of vaguely conflicting experiences on this thread

Well, yeah. It's the Internet!

if you're mad at lagoon saying "machines are bad" 10247 times just say so. machines are fine fyi.

i will not have this thread impugned!!!

Ok. Lagoon's advice on this thread is, generally speaking, fucking wack. Others on this thread have been as wack; more have been far less wack. You like?

personally, i never would've gotten near the squat rack without going to a trainer first --- i had three sessions instructing me on the most pertinent safety issues, and then i felt comfortable enough to get started on my own

if i could afford one on a regular basis, i would probably look for a sport-specific coach instead tbh

The buff dude at your local LA Fitness and the couple that took a weekend seminar to open their Crossfit gym are not going to save anyone from injury. They're also going to needlessly complicate working out (and from what I've seen/experienced of both, push you quickly to exhaustion so you feel like you've been worked out) to justify their existence and cost.

I'm also coming at it from the POV that the average person doesn't need to be doing technique-heavy Olympic lifts and super-heavy squats, unless they're training for a specific goal (weightlifting/powerlifting comps, a relevant sport). Starting light and doing what feels comfortable isn't going to put you in a lot of danger with the simple lifts.