HBO's adaptation of Game of Thrones - Thread 2. There are a lot of nerds.

eh iirc there was a period when the dragons were still pups and she didn't quite believe her own hype and she'd say "I am the mother of DRAGONS" like she was trying to convince herself and more powerful people thought it was cute.

Her transition in the books is a wee bit more nuanced and gradual, so maybe I'm projecting that onto the TV version, I dunno. And I agree that her story's been stalled for the last two seasons, and I don't think Clarke is a particularly good actor. Despite all that im still very fond of the characters and am rooting for her.

Where her character development might not be evolving much anymore, hopefully her storyline does the heavy lifting by finally moving her forward (on the map) again.

i did not read the books so will certainly defer to the likely possibility that she's more engaging there. i find Clarke to be the weakest actor on the show and the symbolism of the great white emancipator to be one of the greatest missteps in the mythology.

Dany's storyline keeps veering between reality of foreign occupation and Neocon fantasies of killing badguy leaders and people falling to knees in awe.

the symbolism of the great white emancipator to be one of the greatest missteps in the mythology.

it's totally problematic, yes, and is kinda shown that way. That's what makes it interesting to me, moreso than some of the more standard medieval fantasy storylines, and especially ... Dorne.

a deposed noblewoman in a foreign country going quasi-native and turning herself into a liberation/cult figure is a cool-ass idea but none of the people writing this shit are smart enough to make it interesting!!

Didn't Heart of Darkness do that already?

sarahell otm

I like the idea of Dany and I do like looking at her but there's also this sense that she's the least intelligent person with any sort of power in Westeros and having her "win" this thing would sort of go against everything the series has set up so far.

was thinking a bit about how the show presents different philosophies of rule and power. almost as if cersei (matriarchal, aggressive, protective of family, self-interested, power as its own legitimacy) and ned (patriarchal, concerned with order and law, hierarchical) represent those two extremes, with other characters with power (Tywin, Dany, Jon) falling along that continuum. Maybe Jon's big flaw is that he's too much like Ned, too trusting of impersonal systems of power at the expense of random, emotional or personal elements (and maybe he's over that now). Dany is parallel to Jon and also seems to be on a narrative that seeks to balance these impulses. Power as Law/Order/Tradition vs Power as something more chaotic but also more substantial, power as Will--one without the other always fails.

she's the least intelligent person with any sort of power in Westeros

she's a teenager! And I would hardly call her the least intelligent, she actually is capable of learning from experience.

http://i.imgur.com/q3i0htD.jpg

^ there's dozens of these to be found

that one bizarrely leaves out cersei!!

as if a 3x3 grid wasn't nerdy enough ...

wtf are these new alignments

There is a frustrating (if unavoidable) contradiction at work in this show right now. It's awesome that developments have sped up. But if the end-goal remains what many have more or less predicted, then that sort of undercuts any drama and just leaves escapist entertainment. Which is fine, but weakens portent, because the faster it goes, the more fun/entertaining it becomes, yet the less room they have to maneuver around and tie up all the loose ends and mythology, if they're even going to bother. And some of those loose ends have become (imo) kind of tedious (like the sparrow's countless sit and talks, or Ramsey being evil). Some of the fan/viewer favorite compelling characters, like Dany and Jon, have become dead ends, because they *can't* die (again) and the pot of gold at the end of their story-rainbow is just waiting for them. And some of the show's best schemers, like Littlefinger and Tyrion, have been reduced to (un)canny operators with no clear role. I suppose the show could just upend any of these things, since it's already going away from the books,, but that would just in a way lessen the stakes even more and make things more chaotic.

Anyway, I'm enjoying this season, but all the early fealty to GRRM's machinations and twists and family trees and history and stuff has backed things into several different corners. Which could make a fun endless show, but ill-serves an episodic narrative that seems to be heading right where you think it's heading. Did like the question broached by a viewer in the Ask the Maester live chat: is Dany actually a bad guy? That would be kind of an interesting twist/idea, but don't know if they will/would/can go that route.

mordy otm

She's from a lineage if mad rulers!

SPOILER-ish

also, to continue with my scheme, it would make sense if the end game included some kind of union of Jon (Law) and Dany (Will).

Is that a spoiler? I thought the only thing we knew about her was that she was a targaryen with claims to the throne?

Yeah, not a spoiler.

oh i was thinking more about the role of Jon's lineage in the endgame--though it's not so much a spoiler these days.

It only is if it turns out to be true!

If it isn't it'll be a much bigger shock than if it is.

Some of the fan/viewer favorite compelling characters, like Dany and Jon, have become dead ends, because they *can't* die (again) and the pot of gold at the end of their story-rainbow is just waiting for them.

They can care about things (including, possibly, each other), and once they care about things, they can suffer even if they win.

Yeah having Young Ned climb the Tower of Joy to just find his sister dead + no baby would be hilarious.

I don't think there's any way that both Dany AND Jon survive the dragons v. zombies finale

by the time they get to it, I don't think there's any way that both the cast members will live long enough

dany and john can continue the proud targaryen heritage of incest if the rumors are true

Targaryens incest[TM] is between siblings, and Dany would be Jon's aunt.

I get so bored I find myself wondering inane things. Where are the wildlings getting food? When they invade castle black and hugely outnumber the Knights watch then where are they being fed and where does the food come from? They don't have animals and can't grow anything. I know this is a fantasy show by the way.

Diana Rigg as head of the Tyrells is fucking awesome in this. Amazing performance. Grey worm is sure,y the worst performance other than that handsome chunky london accented guy who got beheaded in in dinaerys scenes the last season. Whatever happened to the guy who beheaded him btw? I forget.

I feel a bit sorry for GRRM because whatever storyline(s) he'd come up with prior, the internet has so furiously worked out All Possible Outcomes that hes kinda fucked no matter what eventuates. He's been backed into a corner by the success of the show, and I dont blame him for freezing up on completing more books tbh. Caveat: havent read the books, the language frippery frustrated me.But at this point it seems like no matter what he does (or the showrunners for that matter) someone'll go AH HA I KNEW IT.

Fucking nerds.

BTW jed OTM about Diana Rigg. She's my favourite thing in the show at this point.

Do you think by the end of this season we'll find out whether or not Ramsay is evil?

The wildlings live off fish, game and raiding. Roughage from seaweed. Same as other societies north of arable land on our planet, I'd assume.

I'm sure GRRM has a few hundred pages on Wildling foraging and feasting

I see articles pointing out that Littlefinger said "Come and see" to Robin, the phrase repeAted in Ramsey's letter to Jon

pretty sure the 'come and see' in ramsey's letter is a revelations allusion

"come and see", yeah, an uncommon phrase like that is unlikely to be a coincidence I guess.

that was probably sarcastic but i do think that it's uncommon! at least, i've never said it, apart from when i subtly advertise my email subscription series of ocular erotica

http://time.com/4340907/game-of-thrones-pink-letter-ramsay-bolton-littlefinger/

Pink Letter
Red Wedding
White Walkers
Green Day
Castle Black
Red Woman
Red Keep
Professor Plum
Greyjoy

acc to this theory how does littlefinger know that sansa escaped ramsey and that he has rickon? inside source in winterfell?

I feel a bit sorry for GRRM because whatever storyline(s) he'd come up with prior, the internet has so furiously worked out All Possible Outcomes that hes kinda fucked no matter what eventuates. He's been backed into a corner by the success of the show, and I dont blame him for freezing up on completing more books tbh. Caveat: havent read the books, the language frippery frustrated me.But at this point it seems like no matter what he does (or the showrunners for that matter) someone'll go AH HA I KNEW IT.

This was the case even before the show, though.

OK holy shit that reveal

are they foregrounding the maesters conspiracy, which has been pretty much ignored prior to this?

That was uneventful huh folks

Yeah seriously when is the plot gonna move forward sheesh I'm so done with this show

Hold the door :,,,,,(