I thought Enya was hip again now, shows what I know.
FSOL's Lifeforms absolutely deserves to be on here somewhere.
Music for Airports is obviously important and what have you but for me On Land, Apollo and The Pearl are all superior records.
― Gavin, Leeds, Monday, 26 September 2016 14:44 (seven years ago) link
Ah well substitute Kitaro for Enya then.
I'm actually surprised at the PF love for Laraaji, I thought that was always considered as the dud one in the Eno series.
― Siegbran, Monday, 26 September 2016 14:49 (seven years ago) link
It's good, but the first half of it hardly seems to fit even the self-imposed rules that Pitchfork had for this list... it's pretty frantic for an ambient album.
― erry red flag (f. hazel), Monday, 26 September 2016 14:54 (seven years ago) link
Interesting enough list, albeit kind of arbitrary as to what fits and what doesn't. Biggest omission for me is no Labradford (unless I missed it).
― Sunn O))) Brother Where Art Thou? (Chinaski), Monday, 26 September 2016 15:45 (seven years ago) link
Just listening to David Behrman for the first time in a while - On the Other Ocean and Leapday Night are both fabulous (and both a massive influence on Jim O'Rourke).
― Sunn O))) Brother Where Art Thou? (Chinaski), Monday, 26 September 2016 15:50 (seven years ago) link
"but the more respectable end of new age is definitely back in focus."
where you been?
― scott seward, Monday, 26 September 2016 17:16 (seven years ago) link
pauline has been a hipster icon for ages in the states. jon hassell on the other hand has not. that is a more recent development. ciani-love definitely came about during the first wave of hepcat reappraisals.
― scott seward, Monday, 26 September 2016 17:19 (seven years ago) link
Replica is just the wrong choice for an OPN "ambient" album. the only straight up ambient thing he ever did was the Rifts collection and parts of R Plus Seven. Replica is a collage record.
― flappy bird, Monday, 26 September 2016 17:20 (seven years ago) link
It's a pretty good list. It's also very coherent for pitchfork, these are artists and albums they've been pushing for years, of course there's going to be missing stuff but it wouldn't make sense for P4K to give FSOL recognition, per example, when they rarely mention them or rate them high. Take it for what it is.
― ✖✖✖ (Moka), Monday, 26 September 2016 17:21 (seven years ago) link
i do wonder if people who weren't listening the first time are listening to 90's-era stuff lik gas, orb, oval, klf? do they speak to the iBud crowd?
― scott seward, Monday, 26 September 2016 17:22 (seven years ago) link
all the album links on the pitchfork list should have gone to this. and it should be #51 on the list:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peXoHKKA3d4
― scott seward, Monday, 26 September 2016 17:30 (seven years ago) link
― scott seward, lunes 26 de septiembre de 2016 18:22 (twenty-four minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
I dont think that most of the readers of p4k are actually that young anymore.
― ✖✖✖ (Moka), Monday, 26 September 2016 17:48 (seven years ago) link
i like a lot of what's on here but it's undeniably on-trend wrt new age. like, erik satie should really be on a list that's actually interested in uncovering what ambient is, just as much as eno should be. i love laurie spiegel but i don't think she's ambient at all. eliane radigue 'fits' better i think. (don't mean to weigh token women artists here.) psycho-acoustic sound art type stuff feels connected to the ambient concept imo. maryanne amacher. robert ashley was a good call. in general there seems to be a fear of experimental classical / institutional sound art that isn't outsider-y enough. i love minimalism but solely focusing on it betrays a certain predictable pov.
― savvinesslessness (map), Monday, 26 September 2016 17:50 (seven years ago) link
tbr though 'ambient' may have made sense for eno in a specific context but it's a terrible category.
― savvinesslessness (map), Monday, 26 September 2016 17:52 (seven years ago) link
Yup, too broad, too subjective. Eno had a more specific definition
― i bill everything i duck (Noodle Vague), Monday, 26 September 2016 17:56 (seven years ago) link
But when I make playlists I operate in a v subjective way with definitions
― i bill everything i duck (Noodle Vague), Monday, 26 September 2016 17:59 (seven years ago) link
I mean even playback volume comes into play here
― i bill everything i duck (Noodle Vague), Monday, 26 September 2016 18:00 (seven years ago) link
pretty broad list, a lot of stuff i dont think of as ambient. Its a little rude to characterize minimalists/pure drone artists as ambient, isnt it?
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 00:14 (seven years ago) link
there's a LOT of stuff on there i wouldn't call ambient. but lots of good stuff so i don't care.
― scott seward, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 00:21 (seven years ago) link
yeah i know it's pretty narcissism of small differences... but somehow the act of listing ambient albums puts the definition of ambient music under severe stress
anyway here's a list
jordan de la sierra - gymnospheredj olive - sleepdj olive - buoyheathered pearls - loyalvarious - pop ambient 2002steve hillage - rainbow dome musickwaki - music for lazy peoplerobert turman - fluxdream carpets - interior fountainsjack jutson - mother officialjack jutson - mother official volume 2154 - strikeshuttle358 - understanding wildlifeadlib - adlibeno - nerolireinhard voigt - premiere worldulwhednar - withatten 1982vektroid - polytravellersshuttle358 - frameshuttle358 - chessadolphins into the future - canto arquipelagok. leimur - closed system potentialsmicrostoria - init dingcex - presumed deadrob theakston - i am waiting for you to stop being mad at me
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 00:58 (seven years ago) link
i mean
Pauline Oliveros/Stuart Dempster/Panaiotis - Deep Listening
i don't think this title is meant to be ironic!
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 01:04 (seven years ago) link
Well I don't disagree with the p4k list but as long as we're enlisting missing albums:
Popol Vuh - In den Gärten Pharaos (1971)Klaus Schulze - Irrlicht (1972)Roedelius - Wenn der Südwind weht (1981)Virginia Astley - From Gardens Where We Feel Secure (1983)Labradford - Prazision LP (1993)Susumu Yokota - Sakura (1999)Colleen - Everyone Alive Wants Answers (2003)Akira Rabelais - Spellewauerynsherde (2004)Belong - October Language (2006)Kevin Drumm - Imperial Distortion (2008)Áine O'Dwyer - Music for Church Cleaners (2012)
― ✖✖✖ (Moka), Tuesday, 27 September 2016 01:12 (seven years ago) link
"sandstorm" encoded at 8kbps... is it ambient?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldFlcR31gYg
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 03:01 (seven years ago) link
this is an interesting list for sure but yeah snubbing fsol, global communication, and fucking SEEFEEL of all acts is just kind of bonkers
― laraaji p. henson (Stevie D(eux)), Tuesday, 27 September 2016 03:15 (seven years ago) link
04. Terry Riley - A Rainbow in Curved Air07. Oval - 94diskont08. Pauline Oliveros/Stuart Dempster/Panaiotis - Deep Listening09. Tim Hecker - Harmony in Ultraviolet12. Laurie Spiegel - The Expanding Universe16. Terry Riley - Persian Surgery Dervishes20. Oneohtrix Point Never - Replica22. Fennesz - Endless Summer23. Keith Fullerton Whitman - Playthroughs25. Folke Rabe - What??28. Pauline Oliveros - Accordion and Voice31. Ashra - New Age Of Earth32. La Monte YoungMarian Zazeela - The Tamburas Of Pandit Pran Nath (An Homage)34. Charlemagne Palestine - Four Manifestations On Six Elements37. Tim Hecker - Virgins
you can certainly use these as background music, or selectively attentive music, but i don't know, just doesn't seem correct.
who cares, right?
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 03:19 (seven years ago) link
― laraaji p. henson (Stevie D(eux))
Ah Seefeel forgot about them! Used to love them back in highschool.
― ✖✖✖ (Moka), Tuesday, 27 September 2016 03:20 (seven years ago) link
persian surgery dervishes sounds really intense and ecstatic to me, for example, like let's all have a rave up with terry
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 03:21 (seven years ago) link
this is THE Seefeel ambient jam, afaic
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nm4rtr03ZV8
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 03:22 (seven years ago) link
but i don't know, just doesn't seem correct.
just doesn't seem right or wholesome to have them on an ambient list, i should say, unless you widen the tent to encompass more 'ambient is a feeling' stuff in jazz/classical/world etc
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 03:28 (seven years ago) link
or like, eagles greatest hits
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 03:29 (seven years ago) link
yeah. it makes sense as a process but feels really cynical as a category of music to me.
― savvinesslessness (map), Tuesday, 27 September 2016 03:31 (seven years ago) link
like a list of 300 'spiritual' albums would have been so much better + more coherent
So an interesting closing of the loop... Back in 2000 I was in college and just getting into ambient music vie extreme insomnia. hyperreal.org (which is still up - although it says "Copyright 1992-2004 Hyperreal" at the bottom of the page) was an electronic music/rave culture/drugs (via the connected Erowid) site and had DJ sets to download as 'instructional material'. I downloaded an ambient one in Real Audio (yep) format by a guy called Tim Fothergill and listened to it a lot - an awful lot. As I learned more about ambient music I started to recognise a lot of the tunes as Aphex Twin, Eno etc., but eventually I got a big CD and MP3 collection and forgot about this crappy Real Audio file.
Fast forward to two years ago and I found it by accident - I tracked Tim down on Twitter, and he posted up a much higher quality version on Soundcloud: https://soundcloud.com/tim-fothergill/evolution
Some of the track ids of this 20 year old mix were lost to the mists of time, but we got nearly all of them (including using Shazam for a few). I still think it's a nice intro for a beginner, and personally for me it's very evocative of an era:
00:00 Brian Eno - Neroli01:00 u-ziq - ?03:40 Aphex Twin - 1-10 SAWII05:00 Speedy J - Grogono07:30 Aphex Twin - 1-5 SAWII09:30 Slowdive - Albatross10:50 Speedy J - Lanzarote13:00 Aphex Twin - 1-3 SAWII15:00 Neutron 9000 - She Trails Flowers17:50 Dreamfish - Underwater(20:00 The Orb - Sticky End)(21:35 FSOL - Bird Wings)(22:50 Woob - Creek)25:00 Aphex Twin - 2-4 SAWII27:00 Aphex Twin - 2-9 SAWII28:30 Brian Eno - Tal Coat32:30 The Orb - Valley35:00 Brian Eno - Unfamiliar Wind (Leek Hills)36:00 Aphex Twin - 2-6 SAWII38:30 Woob - Depart39:30 Dead Can Dance - Piece For Solo Flute41:30 Woob - On Earth44:00 Slowdive - Avalyn II46:00 Aphex Twin - 1-12 SAWII47:30 Cabaret Voltaire - Project 80(49:00 FFWD - What Time Is Clock)51:20 Woob - Strange Air55.00 Wagon Christ - Aerhaart, From Within57:00 ?59:00 Wagon Christ - Glass World61:00 Psychonavigation - Angel Tech63:30 Slowdive - Losing Today65:45 ?67:00 Cabaret Voltaire - Exterminating Angel (Intro)69:00 Woob - Odonna71:30 The Orb - Back Side Of The Moon73:00 FFWD - Meteor Storm75:30 The Young Gods - Moon Revolutions77:00 Slowdive - Golden Hair78:00 ?80:00 Woob - Emperor82:00 Aphex Twin - 1-10 SAWII84:00 Woob - Odonna86:00 FFWD - Hempire88:30 Harold Budd & Brian Eno - First Light91:00 Aphex Twin - 2-12 SAWII91:30 Brian Eno - An Ending (Ascent)
If anybody has an idea what the remaining ones are then let me know!
― the_ecuador_three, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 14:33 (seven years ago) link
I also used to read the reviews at Ambience for the Masses and listen to the associated 24/7 Sleepbot Environmental Broadcast stream which unbelievably seem to be going strong almost two decades later as well.
As for the Pitchfork list, I'm sure they'll have a top 50 New Age albums list next with all your missing favourites.
― the_ecuador_three, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 14:46 (seven years ago) link
― savvinesslessness (map), Monday, September 26, 2016 1:50 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
Yeah if they're gonna go broad with the definition there's quite a few 'non outsidery' notated compositions that'd fit right in. Rothko Chapel, Les Heures Persanes, Egdon Heath, Musica Callada, A Haunted Landscape...
― I wish you could see my home. It's... it's so... exciting (Jon not Jon), Tuesday, 27 September 2016 15:29 (seven years ago) link
So, cos I had nothing better to do, here's my corny top 50 ambient albums list to complement the "cool" one Pitcfork did:
2350 Broadway - 2350 Broadway 4310 - SnorkelhouseAir Liquide - Nephology: The New ReligionAlio Die - Deconsecrated and PureAlquimia - Coatlique: Goddess of the EarthAutumn of Communion - Autumn of CommunionBaked Beans - Baked BeansBiosphere - PatashnikConstance Demby - Novus Magnificat: Through the StargateConstance Demby - Sacred Space MusicCosmic Baby - Stunde NullDatacide - FlowerheadDeep Space Network - Big RoomsDots - DotsDreamfish - DreamfishElodie Lauten - Inscapes from ExileExquisite Corpse - Inner LightFrance Jobin - The Illusion of InfinitesimalFreida Abtan - The Hands of the Dancer / The Temple of the Dreamer Gas - KönigsforstGlobal Communication - 76:14Higher Intelligence Agency & Biosphere - Polar SequencesThe Irresistible Force - Global ChillageIshq - And AwakeJochem Paap - Vrs-Mbnt-Pcs 9598 IKaitlyn Aurelia Smith - TidesKhan & Walker - Empire State BuildingThe McLean Mix - Rainforest Images Meg Bowles - Blue CosmosMeg Bowles - The Shimmering LandMinilogue - BlommaMove D & Namlook - Raumland trilogyMusic to Films - Music to FilmsNatasha Barrett - Trade WindsOliver Lieb - ConstellationOliver Lieb - Inside VoicesOrganic Cloud - Organic CloudPsychick Warriors ov Gaia - Ov Biospheres and Sacred GroovesRaica - Lucent GlancesRobert Rich - SomniumShades of Orion - Shades Of Orion 2Sheila Chandra - ABoneCroneDroneSolar Quest - OrgshipSusumu Yokota - SakuraTangerine Dream - ZeitVangelis - Soil FestivitiesVladislave Delay - AnimaWoob - Woob 1194Zalys - SublimeZenith - Zenith
― Tuomas, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 17:44 (seven years ago) link
Oh man soil festivities What a strange recording
― I wish you could see my home. It's... it's so... exciting (Jon not Jon), Tuesday, 27 September 2016 17:47 (seven years ago) link
There's a lot of FAX in it, but IMO it's pretty inexcusable for any top 50 ambient list to completely ignore the most important ambient label (and the most prolific ambient producer) of the last 25 years, so I tried to balance that a bit.
(xpost)
― Tuomas, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 17:47 (seven years ago) link
IMO Soil Festivities is Vangelis' best attempt to do "proper" ambient. Albums like Beauborg or Invisible Connection are a bit too on-the-nose avant-garde for my tastes, and stuff like The City is a bit too cheesy, but on SF he gets it right.
― Tuomas, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 17:51 (seven years ago) link
fun list, Tuomas. Zeit would go on my list as well, epic gloomy space ambient.
i must check out that Minilogue album
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 23:17 (seven years ago) link
Anima too but that's another borderline "waht is ambient" case. it's a little too lively and unstable (?) for proper zoning out. Entain is the most "ambient" of his albums, i think. just imo/ime.
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 23:22 (seven years ago) link
i was too young for the late80s/early90s period when "ambient" also referred to ambient house/techno
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 23:24 (seven years ago) link
zeit is so heavy like dark ambient ground zero kinda
― savvinesslessness (map), Tuesday, 27 September 2016 23:25 (seven years ago) link
If it has beats at all, it shouldn't be considered as an ambient album, imo. Here's an ambient mix I did this weekend with my friend. There are no beats.
https://www.mixcloud.com/biznotic/ambient-excursions-to-44/
― brotherlovesdub, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 23:39 (seven years ago) link
rong
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 23:41 (seven years ago) link
or right, i don't know lol
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 23:42 (seven years ago) link
some of the things on the pfork list are like "if it doesn't have beats at all, it can be considered an ambient album"
― brimstead, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 23:43 (seven years ago) link
I never really got why the aphex twin collected ambient work- sounding stuff like fsol is considered ambient, it's p banging and also distracting with the off-kilter beats
― flopson, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 23:51 (seven years ago) link
I wasn't there at the time but I think "ambient" mostly was being used as a prefix to -house or -techno.
Which makes a lot more sense given most of that stuff is too soft and slow to dance to (at a time when house and techno were almost exclusively conceived of as club or dancing oriented), but predates and doesn't fit in with the "intelligent" frame that started to sweep through circa 1993.
Selected Ambient Works Vol II is "proper" ambient tho.
― Tim F, Tuesday, 27 September 2016 23:59 (seven years ago) link
right, it was more shorthand... like calling hardcore techno "hardcore"
― brimstead, Wednesday, 28 September 2016 00:00 (seven years ago) link