Marvel Comics blabbery

And I'll acknowledge again: this attempt was never going to work as a fully-satisfying narrative. Part of its charm is its reflection of the ultimate futility of grand human endeavor. I find it humbling.

so you would prefer for it to continue indefinitely, no matter how awful or stupid it gets?

it doesn't matter if there's all this shit that happened as long as you're telling new stories without specifically requiring readers to know all that history in order to enjoy your new work

I mean, it's cool if something in your story is kind of a macguffin but there's a little footnote explaining it's a reference to, say, a prior story from years past that you could pick up in trade paperback. Or not read at all! Knowing backstory should be complementary, not mandatory

For instance, I've been reading Jason Aaron's stories in the new Thor comics and there are some callbacks to Thor history (and additions) but, secret shame time, I've never read the full Walt Simonson run or many other classic stories. All I know is that Thor is a norse god dude with a hammer and he (well, she in this case) is a good guy. And it's all perfectly enjoyable

having past continuity doesn't mean you have to write all your stories in service to it, or even acknowledge it in depth

I mean, most novels set in the real world assume you know a bunch of shit about class, social norms, cities, but are still comprehensible if you lack that grounding.

I very much agree with the above two comments -- and have read some recent titles that do clever things with old history (e.g., "Patsy Walker Aka Hellcat") -- but I also think the deep continuity can get in the way sometimes; like when you end up having to suspend disbelief and try to reconcile the idea that (to pick a random example) today's Hawkeye is "the same guy" as the '80s Hawkeye.

Also, the Thor titles are a good example of something -- for me, Marvel's gonzo continuity begins to feel more like a "mythology" (with bits and pieces that can be referenced or discarded/ignored at will), than it does any kind of "real" history that all these characters could possibly have shared... and that mythology approach seems like a more natural fit for something like Thor, than for human/earthbound characters whom we saw in 1960s NYC and somehow they're still only in their early '30s.

I'm new to Marvel (in the past two years). I read regularly USG, Black Panther, Ms. Marvel, Moon Girl, Mockingbird, Spider-Man, Black Widow, and Dr. Strange. I started/stopped three times as many series in the same period because of crossovers, new number ones, proliferation of new lines, and specialty events. Non-Marvel titles I read are: 4 Kids Walk Into a Bank (limited), Backstagers, Lumberjanes, Bitch Planet, Gotham Academy, Paper Girls, and a bunch of weird indie stuff. I'm deliberately trying to cultivate a feminist collection, and these are the only titles with which I've been able to continue due to frustration and/or fatigue. There've been lots of other attempts (Jane Foster Thor, Mockingbird, Vision, Spider-Woman, Captain Marvel, Luke Cage, Nova, Silk) that've petered out due to the fact they were *planned* as a limited run or lost their initial talent. Nothing at all in DC is interesting to me, and I gave Wonder Woman a hell of a shot after reading the Jill LePore book on the title.

oh, i also like the slott/alread silver surfer but i can't afford to keep up

You might want to check out Mariko Tamaki's new (She-)Hulk series.

I started/stopped three times as many series in the same period because of crossovers, new number ones, proliferation of new lines, and specialty events.

Sounds like empirical (or a least anecdotal) evidence to support the thesis of the article linked above!

There've been lots of other attempts (Jane Foster Thor, Mockingbird, Vision, Spider-Woman, Captain Marvel, Luke Cage, Nova, Silk) that've petered out due to the fact they were *planned* as a limited run or lost their initial talent.

I'd probably still be reading Silk today if it hadn't lost its original artist. Mighty Thor continues to be good (and AFAIK has retained its original talent), but I find the Jane/Thor character to be fairly ill-defined (almost a supporting player in her own book), so I can see how it wouldn't necessarily appeal from the feminist / "strong female character" perspective (also a focus for me).

Have you read "Patsy Walker"?

Also, "The Unstoppable Wasp" is cute (and ties into the same backstory as Black Widow); though it's so gentle as to barely even qualify as a "superhero" comic. The series promotes STEM education for girls / young women -- both in the story itself and back-of-book material (several women scientists/engineers are interviewed at the end of each issue) -- which is an interesting angle, even if not very relevant to me personally (an older dude who's bad at math).

Also...no mentions of Squirrel Girl?

Did USG mean Unbeatable Squirrel Girl?

Doreen is chill

USG did mean Unbeatable Squirrel Girl. I haven't read Patsy Walker yet, but it's in the hopper. I tried the Riri Williams Iron Man (Iron Heart?) line too, but Bendis's racial blundering put me off.

Check out the "L.A. Woman" volume of Matt Fraction's HAWKEYE run (it's the book with Kate's adventures in L.A.).

(There's also a current/ongoing series featuring Kate, but I have not read it. Waiting for the TPB.)

Is that where should I start w/ Kate Hawkeye? The Fraction TP? I haven't really ventured into the Avengers universe except for incidentally. The sheer amount of history and number of different titles are pretty intimidating. I don't, frankly, know anything about Hawkeye except that he shacked up with Bobbi Morse, that Jeremy Renner plays him in the MCU, that he wears a t-shirt and has a dog, and that sometimes he is a woman.

also he was dead for a while, is from Iowa, and has a villain brother named Barney

hawkeye series is good, it has comedy russian mobsters and a dog

OT: how do you guys do that thing where you make a humorous pseudonym appear next to your (login handle)?

site preferences, under "profile" it's the "display name" you can set

Thx!

good pick

also he was dead for a while

He was also deaf for a while (which plays a role in the Fraction series a bit).

As a partially deaf person, I love a "conveniently deaf until everyone forgets" style recovery

I'm sure paraplegics were equally thrilled with Professor X's on again/off again disability.

Kate is really good in the Gillen/McKelvie Young Avengers book as well.

Hawkeye (almost wrote Popeye) started out wearing a purple miniskirt and nobody ever questioned it, which I thought was very progressive.

(x-posts)

There's a klassic FF panel in which Alicia Masters -- Ben Grimm's blind girlfriend -- reads a newspaper.

surely a trap to solicit no-prize letters

Can someone familiar with "Spider-Man: Renew Your Vows" explain the ontological status of that particular Peter & Mary Jane? It seemed like their story was just another "What If?" concept when they appeared in Secret Wars, but somehow they stuck around and got their own series(?)

Are they established to live in a different "universe" (as with Spider-Gwen or any of the many other alternate Spiderverse-folks)?

No such thing really because the last Hickman event collapsed pretty much all Marvel Universes into 616,

And then Spider-verse and the Great Web makes it all moot anyway because it established all the Spider-mans all exist in all the MUus. So they have been in 616, still might be and could always have been.

aldo, no... it didn't. the very end was Franklin Richards channeling the Molecule Man's power to recreate a bunch of other universes, so the multiverse is different but extant

the Spider-Verse is still a thing: Spider-Woman, Spider-Gwen, and Silk had a three book crossover that is old enough it just wrapped up on Marvel Unlimited. involved people infiltrating from Spider-Gwen's world to 616 to steal tech, and had a male Jessica (Jesse) Drew

afaict the "Renew Your Vows" post-Secret Wars series is an alternate universe series that implies the Parker family explored in SW is still having adventures in some sliver of the new multiverse

the tangle that is contemporary spider man continuity is really amazing; only matched by superman in its spectacularly unnecessarily convoluted imperviousness to logic

(all allusions intentional i'm sure)

re: Hawkeye's deafness, didn't Tony give him some supertech cochlear implants or something similar?

probably

I was thinking he got his hearing back after Wanda brought him back, but no... after the bad comics post-Onslaught, he was recreated with his hearing.

I think I just realized a stupid way they could resolve Secret Empire, urgh

that is, the problem with Steve Rogers having "always been HYDRA" or whatever

nothing's going to resolve the poorly-conceived story telling

and then The Clown deafened him again during Fraction's run

completely forgot or didn't read that

http://www.avclub.com/article/hawkeye-19-uses-deafness-help-broken-clint-barton--207612

IMO this issue rivaled the Pizza Dog issue

The pizza dog issue was great, but then they kinda weakened it by going over the same events "for real this time" (i.e., from the human characters' p.o.v.) later.

<i>the Spider-Verse is still a thing: Spider-Woman, Spider-Gwen, and Silk had a three book crossover that is old enough it just wrapped up on Marvel Unlimited. involved people infiltrating from Spider-Gwen's world to 616 to steal tech, and had a male Jessica (Jesse) Drew</i>

That crossover started with Spider-Woman and Silk literally popping over to Spider-Gwen's universe for lunch (and then getting "stuck there") -- that's how easily permeated the line is in the Marvel multiverse these days, it's pretty funny.

Reading a great collection of Dr. Strange stuff from '68-'74 or so. Gardner Fox, Englehart, tons of robert e. howard/lovecraft stuff, v fun. Opens w a couple issues of Gene Colan art that are fantastic.

Sounds great -- Amazon link(?)

Thought the first issue of Secret Empire was better than expected. Might have been okay as a standalone summer crossover instead of a 3-year-long epic. But at least it'll be over soon.

In other news, I read Revolutionary War, which was Marvel UK's equivalent of the Sleeper/Bluetones reunion tour - I think it came out in 2014? Anyway, it's dumb fun and is a definable story with a beginning and end (remember those?). If it's the sort of thing you like, you'll like it. God knows why but I still have a v. sentimental attachment to Death's Head. (The first one, not Death's Head II, you monsters.)

Marvel's generally not giving a fuck about long-term continuity and the consistency of its parallel universes is, I think, one of its strengths.

it's this one: https://www.amazon.com/Doctor-Strange-Epic-Collection-Separate/dp/0785194444/ref=sr_1_5?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1494004246&sr=1-5&keywords=Dr.+Strange

xp

the tangle that is contemporary spider man continuity is really amazing; only matched by superman in its spectacularly unnecessarily convoluted imperviousness to logic

― Chocolate-covered gummy bears? Not ruling those lil' guys out. (ulysses), Friday, May 5, 2017 9:40 AM (two hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

It's actually shockingly straightforward*! Spider-Verse was astoundingly coherent, given the millions of balls it was juggling.

*If, at least, you consider the period since Mephisto reset Spidey's reality as its own discrete thing separate from what came before.