Better Call Saul

Sure, and I'm not opposed to that direction for the character. As I said, there's precedent. But it seems like there's been a transition with Kim that should have been shown, rather than just presented as having happened sometime between this episode and the last.

it sounded like Kim recorded Chuck admitting he set Jimmy up in regards to the break-in -- who's to say that Jimmy didn't admit to something he didn't do in order to soothe his mentally ill brother?

I thought it was also notable that there was the implication the judge who was brought in might be sympathetic to Chuck. She had that aside where she mentioned someone who was sensitive to high-pitched noises in her extended circle. Is everyone going to be as sympathetic to Chuck's condition, or believe him?

I wouldn't put it past Jimmy to have a prior doctor's report in his back pocket where someone had deemed Chuck's condition as psychosomatic. Rather than believe them and seek treatment, he's gone down the rabbit hole with his perceived illness to the point he's actively endangering his well-being

It's never been explicitly tackled, but past Chuck had obsessive-compulsive tendencies when he had a partner, and I wouldn't doubt some psychologist pegged his condition on his need for complete control of his environment. When he's lacked control over Jimmy or felt his standing with the firm was threatened, he has been better enough to go into the office, use a tape recorder, or steal a newspaper when deprived of his own

I think the fact that Chuck emphasized that there is a lower standard of evidence admissibility for the bar hearing is setting things up for it to cut both ways. They are going to use that standard against him.

Yeah, my general thought (although I'm not sure what steps it'll take to get there) is that Jimmy is angling for Chuck's disbarment.

I think it's a long shot but I'd probably stand up and applaud if he gets Chuck disbarred

more likely to die i'd say

I wouldn't put it past Jimmy to have a prior doctor's report in his back pocket where someone had deemed Chuck's condition as psychosomatic

He does, doesn't he? From the time Chuck was hospitalized in Season One?

Die because he gets disbarred is my vote. He doesn't have much else going.

SO good. This show just keeps getting better and better.

And yeah . . . FUCK Chuck.

Chuck completely breaking, ranting, turns to the panel and they're just staring

beautiful

literally shouted "fuck you chuck" at the tv. comeuppance!

Great to see Huell back.

This show is amazing.

Jimmy still caring about Chuck and Rebecca kind of sad, that little sigh when Kim tells him that Rebecca is going to hate him after this

Chuck's long-term social responsibility to take care of Jimmy is just gross, totally something he does as part of his "must uphold the legal standards but also the social contract" bullshit. Completely clueless about relating to actual human beings personally. Fuck him.

Chuck's attitude toward Jimmy is p clearly fueled entirely by resentment. The mother/deathbed scene p said it all.

p much

tbh at some point he should have just cut off his brother instead of letting him stick around as an object of loathing

or given him his start in his law office

"Great to see Huell back."

I liked the obv clue that he was coming back from the vet "is the job in a tight spot?"

What a classic ep, again.

Better Fuck Chuck

I found the end of this episode powerful not only because of the schadenfreude for Chuck, but out of sympathy for him, because we all know he's right: Jimmy is an inveterate conman who will hurt others and himself. And he gets away with it because he's charming. He's charming the viewers of this very show, even though we all know what kind of person he turns out to be.

Yep. I'm very much on Team Jimmy but I've got to admit that Chuck sort of has a point

But then again maybe Jimmy would have become a pillar of the community if he'd gotten the job at HHM. It seems unlikely though

yeah was gonna raise that. like the stealing from the till and all that stuff, it's just so real that one brother is this pompous charmless jerk who plays by the rules and he hates his charming sympathetic younger bro who has a crooked streak.

so like - wouldn't the bar frown on jimmy's way of setting chuck up? it doesn't exactly dispel the idea that he's shady as fuck.

I had a similar thought--but I suppose the disbarment hinges on the tape, and if the antics, however questionable, discredit the tape, then that's all that matters.

I'm wondering if the nature of the proceedings will get back to Mesa Verde, and if they might look askance at Kim for participating in this sort of thing.

Also: at first I was very satisfied that the photos of the house that Mike took just ended up being sent to Rebecca. But then it looked like they actually were entered into evidence. That surely wouldn't escape the notice of someone like Chuck, but he said nothing about it. Then again, maybe he just figured they were pictures Jimmy took back when he had regular access to the house. But that all doesn't sit quite right with me.

tbh my prediction accuracy has been pretty low lately but I seem to be simpatico with the writers of this joint

yeah like, why even have the mike as workman plotline when that angle of questioning led to nothing whatsoever? seems a bit weird.

xpost

it's not an actual legal proceeding, so the provenance of the pictures is neither here nor there. it's part of the plot to show Chuck's not a clear-thinking person, even in his EMF-free cave imo

all the details were mostly there to get Chuck to crack, or to further the line of questioning -- Chuck has a condition but he's reasonable? no, he has this condition and is doing crazy shit like putting gas lanterns on top of newspapers

or more accurately "has this condition"

i can see that but i guess they maybe dismissed the pictures a bit too quickly, like the panel didn't even look at them really. felt like they were almost useless given we had a fairly long scene showing how they were taken.

I just mean it doesn't seem in Chuck's character not to notice the pictures in the evidence, recognize that they were probably taken recently, and make something of that. It might have fit nicely into his meltdown at the end--"where did he get those pictures of my house anyway? he hasn't been there in weeks! he sent someone into my house to take pictures!!!!" etc.

I thought the idea of the pictures, and the phone, was to challenge chuck's sanity in ways they knew he could handle to begin with - the battery thing hits harder because it comes after chuck's triumphant performance

I don't think they knew for sure how much it'd take to get him to crack, having a bunch of small pieces sure helped

this show is fuckin' great

I found the end of this episode powerful not only because of the schadenfreude for Chuck, but out of sympathy for him, because we all know he's right: Jimmy is an inveterate conman who will hurt others and himself. And he gets away with it because he's charming. He's charming the viewers of this very show, even though we all know what kind of person he turns out to be.

― JRN, Tuesday, May 9, 2017 2:32 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

This is a very well-stated mission statement for the show in general.

Gilligan & co. really do a fantastic job of walking the line between making the viewer root for Chuck's downfall while also sympathizing with his plight.

yep good post JRN

Yeah chuck is as repulsive as Jimmy is likeable, a sanctimonious hypocritical control freak (his yammering oblivious "you'll thank me one day" speech reminded me of Walter white) but at the same time he's - I don't want to say right because it's a self-fulfilling prophecy but let's say not wrong. And he's mentally ill and it feels weird to be cheering the tormenting of a vulnerable person no matter how shitty they are (I still am lol)

Jimmy's a con artist at heart and by the time of BB is facilitating all kinds of felonious shit that ruins lives and gets people killed, but he's a mate

In the flashback, when Jimmy was asking Chuck whether he'd prefer that his ex think he's mentally ill or a raging prick, I couldn't help but think that the two are by no means necessarily mutually exclusive.

witness our president

lol

wouldn't the bar frown on jimmy's way of setting chuck up?

jimmy setting chuck is is morphologically identical to chuck setting jimmy up, which chuck has just (rather smugly) talked us through -- they can't really denounce one and accept the other, i don't think

why even have the mike as workman plotline

having mike as workmen indicates an increasingly overlap of jimmy's and mike's spheres, which is presumably an element in the story to come (albeit not directly picture-related);
at this stage, though. jimmy's professional relationship to mike is quite slight, not much greater than his relationship to huell: he knows him as an expert fixer he can rely on and trust, and employed him as such -- the story dwelt on the mike-as-workman scene more bcz mike's activities are also a focus of our interest in this series, than bcz there was a big jimmy-related reveal coming (as opposed to a meticulous-detail reveal)…

^^^aware that this is a slightly forced explanation, bcz we can't help feeling set up for the big picture-related reveal we didn't get (unless something else is coming down the pike)

(adding: obviously this was a terrific episode, the classic catharsis of courtroom drama -- plus shenanigans and reverse shenanigans -- coming out the direction yr rooting, but, haing mentioned mike, i found myself thinking that i did actually miss the mike half of the show, i don't want a show that's just jimmy for more than an episode at a time)

just joining the chorus of "this episode ruled"

never been a fan of courtroom dramas, but this show really brings it

Classic BB-style setup with the phone battery planted in Chuck's inner pocket. Everything had to go improbably just right, but was inner pocket really easier than outer pocket?

It had to be his breast pocket

the constant twists and hijinks are getting a liiiiiiittle gimmicky but this show is still great

one thing i've noticed over the past few weeks is kim increasingly compromising herself to help jimmy. this is not going to end well for her and i think we're gonna hate jimmy at the end of this