They're savvy guys, I'll give 'em that. The main Chapo dude comes from a media family, so that's not surprising
― carpet_kaiser, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 16:51 (six years ago) link
I just think the whole dynamic of endlessly rehashing the Democratic primary is extraordinarily toxic.
― Treeship, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 16:53 (six years ago) link
It's not "rehashing the Democratic primary," it's bigger than that. The schism between actual progressives/lefties and Clintonistas is real, and if it's not fought to a decision, hello President Pence.
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 19 July 2017 16:55 (six years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpKJUa6IoBs
― ToddBonzalez (BradNelson), Wednesday, 19 July 2017 16:58 (six years ago) link
If UK labour experience is any guide, bitter conflict within party may actually be sign of vibrancy (yeah I know, I was surprised too)
― The Adventures Of Whiteman (Bananaman Begins), Wednesday, 19 July 2017 16:59 (six years ago) link
treeship otm
Stop Trump by acting like Trump. Makes sense. Or rake in a ton of money using a model that's clearly worked recently.
― carpet_kaiser, Wednesday, July 19, 2017 12:50 PM (nine minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
yeah this is exactly not what i said. Trump is a bully - hosts of CTH are not bullies.
― flappy bird, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:02 (six years ago) link
hosts of CTH are not bullies.
― carpet_kaiser, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:03 (six years ago) link
I don't like them but I don't agree with that.
They are a backlash to a liberal establishment that had become too scolding, moralistic, and obsessed with cultural issues.
They're popular because people are mad at this establishment for failing to stop Trump, perhaps the most disgusting person to ever seek the presidency.
I think they fall short because they are only increasing the false divisions between people concerned with economic issues and those concerned with ending discrimination of all forms. These goals are related, not opposed, a fact that is obscured as long as liberals and "bernie bros" go meaninglessly back and forth about petty shit that had more to do with social media than American politics.
― Treeship, Wednesday, July 19, 2017 9:48 AM (two minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
i think the "cultural issues" thing as a some sort of dividing line between bernie bros and centrists is a bit of a canard. the chapo/bernie bros criticism is generally that a) wokeness of many centrist libs, especially on twitter, is glib and insubstantial and b) focusing on economic issues helps all marginalized groups
― -_- (jim in vancouver), Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:04 (six years ago) link
Is there a new book/article or did the internet detectives finally figure out Matt Taibbi is *that* Matt Taibbi?
I read a bunch of exile stuff years ago, and there's no way I'd want to read it now as an adult in my 30s, but Taibbi's writing after his return to the US seemed like a clean break from that execrable shit and I've read it without character judgments on his past, just taking the writing as-is.
as far as podcasts in the political vein go, I haven't had a chance to check this out but am surprised it hasn't been mentioned:https://www.patreon.com/tarfureport
― mh, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:04 (six years ago) link
it was mentioned elsewhere on ilx (on the thread about matt taibbi i guess).
i wouldn't listen to a matt taibbi podcast because he's matt taibbi
― -_- (jim in vancouver), Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:06 (six years ago) link
ah, forgot that thread was there
― mh, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:08 (six years ago) link
wokeness of many centrist libs... is glib and insubstantial and focusing on economic issues helps all marginalized groups
otm
― ||||||||, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:08 (six years ago) link
What do they care? They don't have any alternative ideas or guiding philosophy behind that criticism ... they just look for little things to attack and criticize. It's glib and insubstantial, too.
― carpet_kaiser, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:10 (six years ago) link
yeah exactly, it's so disingenuous and calculated. and no, CTH hosts are not bullies like Trump is a bully. making fun of Ben Shapiro's height or Mike Cernovich's lisp? well, that's fine with me...
― flappy bird, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:13 (six years ago) link
― carpet_kaiser, Wednesday, July 19, 2017 10:10 AM (one minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
they care because this putative intersectional liberalism is the main content of many of these peoples politics, and the basis of their claim to be the legitimate representatives of the marginalized and "the left".
― -_- (jim in vancouver), Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:14 (six years ago) link
They don't have any alternative ideas or guiding philosophy behind that criticism
uh... i think "focusing on economic issues helps all marginalized groups" is an alternative and legitimate idea
― flappy bird, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:14 (six years ago) link
xxp
I first knew Chapo from their gang clowning of Arthur Chu on Twitter, that lasted months. Arthur Chu seemed like a tool, but other than the delight in tormenting the guy, not sure what that has to do with their better alternative to the Democrats and libs.
And yeah, like they give a flying fuck about helping marginalized groups. What history do they have with that? Picking on vulnerable weirdos on Twitter?
― carpet_kaiser, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:17 (six years ago) link
Entertainers, fine. The whole Chapo/DSA thing is utter horseshit. Talk about poisoning the well.
― carpet_kaiser, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:18 (six years ago) link
Arthur Chu is a sociopath, he's not a "vulnerable weirdo." http://theralphretort.com/it-ends-tonight-arthur-chus-wife-dumps-him-has-marriage-dissolved-11014016/
― flappy bird, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:19 (six years ago) link
Alright, he seems like a creep, but my point still stands. Blood tastes the same no matter who it's coming from.
― carpet_kaiser, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:21 (six years ago) link
Blood tastes the same no matter who it's coming from.
what
― flappy bird, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:22 (six years ago) link
let's not rely too heavily on low rent gamergate websites
― goole, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:23 (six years ago) link
I haven't paid attention v closely but it's weird how Arthur Chu went from "adorable weirdo" on the Jeopardy thread to persona non grata on every other thread in the space of like 18 months
― Οὖτις, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:24 (six years ago) link
xp. chapo are entertainers. the podcast is not politics, it's not substantial, it's for you to have a laugh at if you're on the left and dislike centrists and the right. no-one itt is under any illusion about that.
i think their most substantive/worthwhile episodes are when they have a guest talking about important stuff in a knowledgable way, i.e. Tim Faust talking about healthcare. but those are little interludes in a sea of irreverent and, depending on your viewpoint, dumb ribbing on NYT columnists and the like.
― -_- (jim in vancouver), Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:25 (six years ago) link
― goole, Wednesday, July 19, 2017 1:23 PM (three minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
agreed, but all you need to read are his ex-wife's tweets, which are included in the piece.
― flappy bird, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:27 (six years ago) link
lol yeah
arthur chu, as catalogued elsewhere on ilx, is prime candidate for somewhat reasonable person who decided to parlay a small amount of fame into a twitter/writing career and is now hopelessly tweeting his way into a hole in the ground while hitting every rock on the way downtwitter addiction justified by it being your "job" to tweet
― mh, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:31 (six years ago) link
Also: poisoning Wells is goodd. Fuck wells.
― The Adventures Of Whiteman (Bananaman Begins), Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:32 (six years ago) link
the lol was to goole's comment about that site's provenance
― mh, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:32 (six years ago) link
icking on vulnerable weirdos on Twitter?
First they came for the Ben Shapiros and I said nothing
― El Tuomasbot (milo z), Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:40 (six years ago) link
Then they came for the Eichenwalds and I said nothing, and went back to looking at hentai.
― flappy bird, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:44 (six years ago) link
Who exactly are their better alternatives? Them? That's convenient. What better vision do they have beyond "winning" "bigly"? They're entertainers who wear a mantle of being a movement, and are doing damage to the cause they're co-opting.
― carpet_kaiser, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:49 (six years ago) link
literally everything in that post is beyond dumb
― -_- (jim in vancouver), Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:51 (six years ago) link
Must be if you simply say so
― carpet_kaiser, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:51 (six years ago) link
Are you Caleb?
― El Tuomasbot (milo z), Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:52 (six years ago) link
Yup, I am whatever bad thing you want me to be today
― carpet_kaiser, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:52 (six years ago) link
Who exactly are their better alternatives?
Bernie Sanders, Jeremy Corbyn, Keith Ellison.
What better vision do they have beyond "winning" "bigly"?
Single payer universal healthcare and a reinvigorated labor movement.
― flappy bird, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:52 (six years ago) link
They should add Matt's "this podcast doesn't count as 'doing politics'" line to the start of every episode as a disclaimer to maybe forestall some of the thinkpiece deluge
― a serious and fascinating fartist (Simon H.), Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:59 (six years ago) link
nothing leftists do counts as 'doing politics'
― sleepingbag, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 17:59 (six years ago) link
what?
― flappy bird, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 18:00 (six years ago) link
carpet_kaiser reminds me of all the 'mainstream' Dems who respond to criticism of Clintons/Obama by asking for a detailed agenda for when I am president
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 19 July 2017 18:00 (six years ago) link
They're clearly carpetbaggers who jumped on the tweeting, podcasting and being socialists $$$ train.
― President Keyes, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 18:01 (six years ago) link
idg the line that chapo isn't politics. i mean yeah it's not organizing nor electioneering nor thinktanking (or maybe...) but it's not not politics.
― goole, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 18:03 (six years ago) link
yeah, it's communications.
― President Keyes, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 18:04 (six years ago) link
i think their point is that sitting there listening doesn't count as doing something
― global tetrahedron, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 18:07 (six years ago) link
someone should tell them they're like the cnn classic crossfire but without dissenting opinions :)
― mh, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 18:08 (six years ago) link
Yeah, this doesn't even come close to what I believe.
― carpet_kaiser, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 18:08 (six years ago) link
chu went from Good to Bad for tragic unselfawareness, repeated tryhard assertions about homosexuality, and zealous defense of hillary clinton. i'd seen the tweets from his poor ex wife before but i try not to over-interpret people's private lives. calling him a sociopath is a bit much; people throw that around too much imo.
― goole, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 18:10 (six years ago) link
Reminded how Jon Stewart also always felt compelled to jump back to "Hey look I'm just a comedian".
― Nerdstrom Poindexter, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 18:11 (six years ago) link
This comes dangerously close to the late '00s Jon Stewart "I'm just a comedian," though - it needs to be clarified that podcasts and posting is not the end of politicking. Then they're no better than the libs who think resistance is buying from Starbucks because the CEO was going to be in Hillary's cabinet.
Which, to be fair, Matt at least has been heavily involved with his local DSA.
― El Tuomasbot (milo z), Wednesday, 19 July 2017 18:12 (six years ago) link
honestly the worst casualty of the left-liberal war has been amanda marcotte, who's become shockingly dishonest and disningenuous
― goole, Wednesday, 19 July 2017 18:13 (six years ago) link