North Korea

There's speculation that he went to China once - but China has denied it. It's not a one-man-band, though, the Foreign Minister, Minister for External Relations, etc, travel fairly widely.

The US apparently tried to pressure China into banning the NK representative from attending a major event in Beijing (the Belt and Road Summit) earlier this year - unsuccessfully.

also speculation he had a western education (possibly swiss)

Liebefeld-Steinhölzli Schule, to be precise (but still unconfirmed and speculative)

I dunno, if he can order assassinations and demand purges and stuff like that, I'm not sure how worthwhile his proxies ultimately are. It's remarkable, regardless, how little anyone knows, like that he apparently has two kids and simple things like that.

Trump should go over there and talk to him

Beyond bluster, US, NKorea in regular contact: https://apnews.com/686ac7c761694b28b67793a1d8297145?utm_campaign=SocialFlow&utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=AP

^^^not really a surprise (or shouldn't be)

Been wondering if Bill Richardson is still communicating behind the scenes, as he's done for so long with North Korea.

i'm just gonna go ahead and pretend that he is so i can get through today without going insane

we should all tweet pleas at dennis rodman today

many xps

i just want to say that the u.s. talks to north korea, obv not the same way they talk to other states but still. there have been fairly direct links, diplomats visiting pyongyang, diplomats talking to north korean staff at the u.n. / links through china and e.u. (sweden handles u.s. consular issues in north korea) diplomats, track ii talks, leading to confirming that warmbier was dead.

north korea it is a mystery kinda but it's not like there's a dome over it and nobody comes or goes, nothing gets in or out.... you can even go there! (unless you're south korean, i suppose, and american, after september 1). once you get below superficial, the amount of material mostly stuck in specialist or academic or foreign language works on north korea, detailing how say the foreign policy or like womens mobilization squads digging ditches near the dmz or regime heavyweights' take on increasing marketization, whatever--it's impressive.

https://www.lowyinstitute.org/the-interpreter/new-sanctions-have-sparked-china-north-korea-diplomatic-row

Trump to Dennis Rodman WE NEED YOU NOW

we should all tweet pleas at dennis rodman today

― global tetrahedron, Friday, August 11, 2017 10:47 AM (three hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yessssss

http://www.trbimg.com/img-5942a5b4/turbine/la-et-jc-rodman-trump-north-korea-20170615

According to Pauly Shore (ymmv), he's talked to Dennis Rodman and apparently KJU loves Trump - maybe he's just playing hard to get.

i could honestly see them being p good chums in another context

absolutely - they've got a ton in common

otm they would get along great i feel

i think it's sort of inaccurate to say that we don't know what north korea wants. three huge military and economic powers messing around on its borders, it wants to not be rolled over and occupied. the way north korea is being discussed here, it seems to follow the narrative of the american right, which has overblown the threat of north korea to the united states and imagines the kim regime as mentally ill stalinists that hate america for no reason.

this thread has way too much panic imho (note, at least some is okay) and also way too much troping on the ~~~inscrutable~~~ and irrational, mysterious, inexplicable north korean government/people. who knows what they're capable of, these blind and brainwashed puppets and their wacky leaders who do things totally at random for no reason!!?!!... probably not what anybody itt is going for, but it's there and it's a problem imo not just because it's offensive but because it's hilariously ironic. rational actors would probably not structure their worldview around a 'team america' caricature - could lead one into trouble! seems fitting that the awful old threat title still lives on in the bookmark.

I so do not get this whole current hysteria. NK has nuclear ICBMs. We've had them for decades. NK has made no threats to be an aggressor; all have been in name of self-defense. They haven't invaded anyone. They don't have Nazi-esque rhetoric about ethnic cleansing or starting a global takeover. So what exactly is the threat? Leave them be, apply diplomatic pressure and sanctions for them being naughty lil boys or whatever, ok. What am I missing here? Have they threatened to attack SK?? All I've seen is along the lines of "we will not be pushed around and we will defend ourselves if attacked". US has invaded more countries than they have. They view us as evil imperialists and therefore need means (ie nukes) to deter us from fucking with them, as we are prone to do around the globe to those we don't cotton to. Why does the "land of the brave" freak out over something that NKers have been dealing with for 60 yrs or so?

It's not fear of NK, its fear of possible Trump reaction and the literal/figurative fallout from his decision.

yes I have that fear, as I presume everyone else here does. That's a rational one to have. But LOTS of people are scared of NK. Trump supporters for example are scared of NK, not Trump.

odds of a NK first-strike anywhere seem unfounded. odds of Trump going off his rocker and pre-emptively doing some shit in order to make himself look like a big boy are a little too close for comfort imo.

otm - especially after China said they would fuck NK up if they attacked Guam.

right. If you're truly concerned about NK attacking, why would you even consider doing the one thing that is virtually guaranteed to get them to strike out?? If you're worried about a snake you see biting you, you don't go over to it and try to kill it. You ignore it and walk the fuck away.

i could honestly see them being p good chums in another context

also I've been saying this is a best-case scenario for months. it would be his "only nixon could go to China" moment. problem is he is a moron.

I guess part of the problem is USA is still in love with its military might, so it's that guy who thinks he can easily kill the snake w/o it biting him.

Also china said it would stand with NK in the case of a preemptive action by the US so

xp also most Americans have already internalized NK=enemy that millions of dead NKers is just lil bit of "collateral damage".

tbf they're already dead to us

they aren't even on facebook

my brother told me North Koreans have started getting internet & social media, & that the alternate reality/cult of personality of KJU is in jeopardy. i have no evidence or articles to support this

i read somewhere that NK was one of the countries where Radiohead's analytics showed 'In Rainbows' had been downloaded

Trump supporters for example are scared of NK

Trump supporters are afraid of seeing their own genitals if they lost too much weight.

xp also most Americans have already internalized NK=enemy that millions of dead NKers is just lil bit of "collateral damage".

Fox analyst dismisses that millions would die in nuclear strike because “they'll be mostly North Koreans”

this is why they don't like Don

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2XVNFzNlZ8

here's Lindsey Graham casually talking about wiping out 100,000s "over there" in Asia pic.twitter.com/uKcnoE2qvl

— Adam H. Johnson (@adamjohnsonNYC) August 11, 2017

Huckleberry's never seen a bombing campaign he didn't like

but just so everybody remembers Asia is "over there". It's not here. so we can bomb them because they're there not here. over there.

Fox analyst, Graham...truly sickening

hmmm... *self lobotimizes* ... yea that checks out

Thx for thread title change

Jeffrey Lewis cohosts a podcast. I've only heard the latest one but it does a good job contextualizing the events this week.
http://armscontrolwonk.libsyn.com/the-donald-and-the-nuclear-goblet-of-fire-and-fury

my brother told me North Koreans have started getting internet & social media, & that the alternate reality/cult of personality of KJU is in jeopardy. i have no evidence or articles to support this

since the late 90s, when kim2 opened basically let the border become v porous to let goods flow into the black market and stop people from getting desperate enough to overthrow him... there were vcds and then dvds and usb drives coming across the river from china. there's a book by jieun baek, north korea's hidden revolution which is maybe too bullish on, like, the ideological threat or the potency of the rays of capitalism that filter down to the black markets of 2nd tier north korea, but at least reports from defectors and people working/visiting, academics--andrei lankov: "markets have proliferated and have largely supplanted the moribund state economy" / North Korea begins journey from feudalism to crony capitalism--all seem to say that the grey/black market is driving the economy.

kim jong un might be shooting off more missiles and testing more bombs but he's also quietly allowed a lot of unofficial or just quiet reform to take place alongside projects like ryomyong road, maybe to outflank unofficial or only officially tolerated but unregulated segments of the economy that could challenge his regime + get a piece of the profits. dprk 2017 is nothing like dprk 1997, '87 etc. even if it looks fucked up, i think most signs point to increasing market reform and openness that will eventually lead to something like prc post-1997 heavy statist authoritarianism/strong military/nationalism/coming down heavy on any threat to central government power but generally improving quality of life for its citizens and growing the economy, even if they're locked in the same perpetual showdown with the u.s. and regional rivals.

i got off track in the first paragraph but i wanted to say, like, i don't think many north koreans are using twitter but they're watching south korean soap operas at least, which might be more of a byproduct of the border being opened up/black market being allowed to flourish because nobody wanted more people to starve and the weakening of the state owned economy--i think the dprk will look about like the prc eventually, where market reforms still allowed for authoritarianism to remain the preferred choice.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/media-smuggling-north-korea/

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/aug/11/north-korea-us-south-korea-huge-military-exercise?CMP=share_btn_tw

US and South Korean militaries will go ahead with massive sea, land and air exercises later this month, despite a spiralling situation in which North Korea has threatened to fire missiles towards a US Pacific territory.

LOCKED AND LOADED

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017/04/12/asia-pacific/north-korea-quietly-reforming-economy-denies-change/

category: satellite imagery

http://www.scmp.com/news/asia/east-asia/article/2103147/satellite-images-identifies-40-mass-grave-sites-north-korea

Witnesses – who include state security officials and prison guards who have defected – have also claimed to have seen mass graves in the hills around towns, while others reported seeing bodies simply dumped by the roadside on the outskirts of villages.

http://www.38north.org/2017/08/sinpo081117/

Recent commercial satellite imagery reveals several developments suggesting that North Korea may be accelerating the development of the sea-based leg of its nuclear forces. Of particular interest in the imagery is that netting or tarps have been suspended above both the fore and aft decks of the SINPO-class submarine obscuring any activity taking place beneath them.

Whenever new information comes out about NK that paints it as a growing existential threat to the world and piles up new atrocities to lay at its doorstep, it is good to ask oneself whether this is part of a campaign to create a war hysteria that would allow the US government to justify a preemptive attack on NK.

History has proved that the NK regime cannot be dislodged or dissuaded from its course by any external force short of all-out war and annihilation. Reason would conclude that the global & human cost of an all-out war FAR outweighs any imaginable benefits. Perpetuating the status quo is really the only reasonable course. However scary Kim Jong Un might be, a preemptive attack would be x1000 times worse than just letting him stay in place.

Only Denis Rodman can save the world now.