Drink full: The TWIN PEAKS 2017 spoiler thread, part 2

dourif chills me to the bone, steven grosses me out

Amanda Seyfried is doing a good job as Becky; as for whether or not I care about her character: most of them are getting a relatively small number of scenes, appearing at the most a couple of times per episode every two or three weeks. It's hard for anyone new to break through when there's so many other questions about the narrative and they're competing with established interest in the older characters.

They've established enough about Becky to make the viewer care if and when the expected horrific thing happens. Also, we definitely care about Shelley and Bobby and anything that happens to her affects them directly.

We rewatched FWWM right before the new season, and then we rewatched it again last night -- this time thru, all kinds of things clicked. Not that elegant plotting has ever been the point of TP, but it's still pretty impressive that they've tried to connect so many threads all the way through the first series to FWWM to TP:TR.

Also, this time thru FWWM I really realized how much of it is made up of these extended freak-out set pieces, with lots of music and lights and little or no dialogue. It's a pretty spectacular film, and very much has its own vibe distinct from either of the TV series.

If anyone is a fan of The Best Show, AP Mike got the guy who plays the drunk in the jail to call in for a few minutes last night. It's Mike's favorite character, which is perfect if you know the show.

― Chris L, Wednesday, August 23, 2017 9:52 AM (three hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Looooooool, of course he is. I clearly need to catch up!

but it's still pretty impressive that they've tried to connect so many threads all the way through the first series to FWWM to TP:TR.

This my big takeaway from the new series, the reveal that every single loose thread in that movie had significant meaning and purpose. It's fascinating to ponder how much of that movie's mythology Lynch knew at the time then sat on for 25 years, versus how much he made up after the fact

Also doing the math in my head, and if it took a 16 hour extrapolation for that 2 and 1/2 hour movie to make complete sense, it'd take about another 115 hours of television to completely explain and tie up the loose ends of this new series

i don't really see what significant things about fwwm have been revealed by the return. am i just being dense?

all the f'n phillip jeffries stuff! the room above the convenience store!

The woodsmen!

Carl!

all the f'n phillip jeffries stuff! the room above the convenience store!

― kurt schwitterz, Wednesday, August 23, 2017 1:19 PM (six minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

The woodsmen!

― a man often referred to in the news media as the Duke of Saxony (tipsy mothra), Wednesday, August 23, 2017 1:24 PM (one minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i still find that stuff really enigmatic though!

But now it has more to go with it, where in the movie it was just kinda out of nowhere.

the main takeaway was that we needed more Carl, and we have received more Carl

Speaking of Surrealist refs in Lynch, a friend pointed out the similarity of Naido's arrival to Étant Donnés by Duchamp - hoping this slight crop will prevent it from being unsafe for the workplace:
http://i.imgur.com/9Go5yE2.jpg

carl seems to have had a big of a change of heart. he was supremely cranky, though not malevolent, in fwwm. seems like a real nice dude in the return

hey woke him up before 9am!!

he's already been places

Yeah, he was only cranky wrt folks ignoring his clearly-posted instructions.

he was also cranky when chester desmond comes back in the evening though. he didn't have a sign about after 9pm

Carl's good to go so long as he has enough Good Morning America

imo the perception that fwwm's mysteries are being explained away just comes from the incongruity of seeing elements like Jeffries, Judy, the ring and the blue rose placed within a more Frostian narrative mode. I think in the end a lot of this stuff will remain pretty inscrutable tho, and we'll get very concrete answers to some old mysteries but in a way that only raises more questions - which is what fwwm itself did.

Given frost's lack of input into the film it is interesting how much they're leaning on things introduced in that film like electricity & all the blue rose stuff & the fat trout, while stuff from the series like the owls & the bookhouse boys recede into the background or are ignored altogether.

I was just thinking this evening that this series could use more Frost. Kinda bathetic that the Man from Another Place's eerie "Eeellhuctriccitty" just referred to exactly that, too. Oh well.

All the dialogue in that scene is incredibly literal!

Wins otm about FWWM

I know! I preferred not knowing :(

Has there been any speculation on why the appearance of the convenience store and the Woodsmen differs so much between FWWM and The Return? Or is it safe to assume that it's just an instance of Lynch deciding 'I want things to look like this now'?

I know! I preferred not knowing :(

― albvivertine, Thursday, August 24, 2017 6:01 AM (forty-eight minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

do you really know that much more

But I mean the electricity motif was firmly established in the film itself, with the character of the electrician and the many shots of power lines accompanied by the whoop of the little man/arm. "Electricity!" is one of the least enigmatic lines of dialogue ever uttered in the lodge pretty much from the off.

Has there been any speculation on why the appearance of the convenience store and the Woodsmen differs so much between FWWM and The Return? Or is it safe to assume that it's just an instance of Lynch deciding 'I want things to look like this now'?

― Always Be Cropdusting (Old Lunch), Thursday, August 24, 2017 6:32 AM (one hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah i'm guessing he wanted them to have a more sinister aspect. before the new season i thought the woodsmen in fwwm were fbi agents trying to blend into the lodge

They used to simply employ glaringly-fake beards, but they're now utilizing state-of-the-art techniques to transform themselves into kitchen appliances.

But I mean the electricity motif was firmly established in the film itself

Not just in the film but throughout Lynch's work.

Yeah I guess I mean it's given an overt plot significance in fwwm that wasn't there before

Rewatching the second half of this episode I got choked up all over again at the log lady scenes, and also at the final roadhouse scene which is amazingly cathartic. One thing I really appreciate about the scene in the conference room is the way it's lit so that you can clearly see the tears streaming down Lucy's face but the faces of Andy and Bobby, two of the characters most associated with spontaneous weeping, are almost completely hidden in darkness. It's a nice acknowledgement that the usual twin peaks approach to displays of grief, much as we all love it, is not appropriate here (goaz's mugging particularly would detract from the gravity and quiet dignity of the scene)

Andy reminds me so much of a silent film comedian

not convinced the woodsmen became a significant image and theme for TP until the return started and lynch decided to revisit the look of that dude.

i've really been thinking a lot about jeffrie's monologue though from FWWM lately. one line I forgot isn't even in the original film was "they sat silently for hours" after "and then there they were"; I guess that's only on the unedited missing pieces scene, but it seems very important now.

I'd assume it's something along the lines of: you sense only what the presences in the Black Lodge allow you to sense.

not convinced the woodsmen became a significant image and theme for TP until the return started and lynch decided to revisit the look of that dude.

― akm, Thursday, August 24, 2017 2:13 PM (twenty-six minutes ago)

The woodsmen got a makeover courtesy of the Mulholland Drive monster.

Lynch's next show about extreme makeovers

Re: FWWM, I'm thinking about it through a deep fog of memory and will probably leave it there, like a barely-remembered dream. Loved it so much when I saw it.

I don't think Lynch had anything planned back in 1992 that's been continued into The Return. he said in 2001 that Twin Peaks was "dead as a doornail" and as recently as 2013 wasn't interested in revisiting that world. I think there's just a lot of latent imagery and symbolism in all of his movies that can be drawn upon again and expanded upon - that applies to the abundant references to his filmography throughout the new series.

I saw a 00s interview with him in which he said he would like to do Twin Peaks again. I think it was after Inland Empire.

did he ever follow up on it

yeah him and badalamenti are doing a collab with beats by dre

Andy reminds me so much of a silent film comedian

― Robert Adam Gilmour, Thursday, 24 August 2017 17:15 (yesterday) Permalink

https://nenaghsilentfilmfestival.files.wordpress.com/2013/08/stan_laurel___sons_of_the_desert.jpg

Pretty sure lynch & frost were writing the return in 2013 so any declared lack of interest in revisiting it from around then would be bullshit

I mean, he made it but maybe he's just not that into it.

Now I want to see the alternate universe version of The Return as made by an unengaged Lynch who's only in it for the $$$.

Pretty sure lynch & frost were writing the return in 2013 so any declared lack of interest in revisiting it from around then would be bullshit

I saw an interview w/ Lynch where he said he hadn't been thinking about Twin Peaks and was hesitant about revisiting it before he met with Mark Frost, whenever that was (I thought 2014).

The announcement of the new season was in 2014, according to frost it took them two years to write the script before taking it to showtime

Just hard to imagine episode 8 as something he came up with during a productive writing session. That mythology felt like something he'd been chewing on for a long time