Also, the 'lost boys' schtick is recycled wholesale from laurie penny isn't it? (Who herself, etc)
― But doctor, I am Camille Paglia (Bananaman Begins), Sunday, 19 November 2017 13:58 (six years ago) link
It’s not a schtick it’s an analysis.
There are a lot of things she says that I agree with. First off, her insistence that this new right is qualitatively different than the conservatism of the past, because of its fundamentally anti-establishment, “transgressive” character. They’re more against liberal society — and its keystone virtues of equality and tolerance — than they are for any other regime, which is why their rhetoric is so nihikistic and flamboyantly offensive. Racism isn’t new — it’s embedded in the fabric of American society — but this movement is, and it doesn’t make sense to try to understand it as just another flowering of older hate movements. These people aren’t protecting an old order, they’re like cornered rats lashing out violently. Obviously they are despicable but they must also be seen as symptomatic of a deeper dysfunction in society — the idea that such an ugly, antisocial philosophy could hold any appeal at all. I think that’s what she is trying to understand in her work and people just react by turning around and saying she is being too easy on the alt right or too hard on the left or whatever
― treeship 2, Sunday, 19 November 2017 15:35 (six years ago) link
that just makes it sound like she's been reading this thread tho
― gimme the beet poison, free my soul (Doctor Casino), Sunday, 19 November 2017 15:54 (six years ago) link
Bananaman I was skeptical at first but you deserve a thanks/'you were right' for highlighting how much Nagle is mixed-up with Spiked/LM Network shenanigans. She's now been on not 1 but 2 Battle Of Ideas panels! Time to stop feeding and move on I think - there's plenty of others out there doing a better job of analyzing the alt-right (including on this thread/board).
― Unbreakable Kim Jong-Un (Mr Andy M), Sunday, 19 November 2017 16:02 (six years ago) link
wtf, treeship has gotten even dumber
― sleeve, Sunday, 19 November 2017 16:26 (six years ago) link
the right being transgressive isnt new—the radical right has always been more willing to use indecency/puerility in their discourse than the left, fascism *was* a form of vanguard politics, 'accelerating' paleoconservatism just like communism accelerated social democracy, and you could see that in avant-garde art too, with futurism and vorticism tilting right more often than left.
They’re more against liberal society — and its keystone virtues of equality and tolerance — than they are for any other regime, + These people aren’t protecting an old order,
this is the premise I really disagree with bc "being against everything and for nothing" is also true of the student left since 1968, and basically a feature of youth politics in general. young ppl arent good at positive proposals.
but also these alt-right guys seemed pretty satisfied with Trump's ideas—a glance at /pol/ during the election would suggest they really liked the idea of protectionism + bashing mexicans and muslims, for example. and thats the thing. these guys are basically edgy racist republicans, and not really a proto-fascist menace threatening to overturn politics as we know it. the american left, bumbling as it is, has more dynamic ideas than the young right does. they also have the disadvantage of their politics being based around excluding anyone who isnt white (or at a stretch, asian) while the left wants to win over as many ppl as possible
also I like the idea of a dispassionate, fact-based account of internet politics, but Nagle does a shit job at it. it's not the feedback loop theory I'm against—for example, I noticed that before 2013, the /pol/ board on 4chan had so little traffic that the admin suggested that it should be deleted, but from 2013 as the "campus SJWs" and "crazy tumblr" clickbait stories began, /pol/ grew immensely with threads mocking these ppl and posting conspiracy theories about 'cultural marxism'. Nagle doesnt do much beyond recycling the same article 10 times though, and there is way better scholarship on culture wars out there. also I dont really care but this whole genre of tweet is so tired and insidious:
Socialist men to cute girls with insane tumblr opinions pic.twitter.com/Mm4oU37SRH— Angela Nagle (@AngNagle) November 9, 2017
― epigone, Sunday, 19 November 2017 16:27 (six years ago) link
idk I think her project is very limited but I also think that tweet is funny
― Simon H., Sunday, 19 November 2017 16:29 (six years ago) link
booming post
― imago, Sunday, 19 November 2017 16:30 (six years ago) link
You’ve done a better job explaining your point than she did explaining hers. I don’t know if I buy that there is really anything new under the sun here, though. There are echoes here in every right wing ethnic nationalist movement ever. Those have never been for or by the establishment - they don’t need all that ruckus.
― El Tomboto, Sunday, 19 November 2017 17:02 (six years ago) link
Lol wtf so many xposts
― El Tomboto, Sunday, 19 November 2017 17:03 (six years ago) link
I don’t understand that tweet. What do I win
― El Tomboto, Sunday, 19 November 2017 17:06 (six years ago) link
these guys are basically edgy racist republicans, and not really a proto-fascist menace threatening to overturn politics as we know it. the american left, bumbling as it is, has more dynamic ideas than the young right does. they also have the disadvantage of their politics being based around excluding anyone who isnt white (or at a stretch, asian) while the left wants to win over as many ppl as possible
I think this is mostly true so far — these are not people with actionable ideas — but i will say that i think there is a serious danger in the way they have polluted the discourse. In mainstream spaces online now (reddit, twitter), you can find people calling for things like a “white ethnostate” or, on the gender side, propagating extremist views that already seem to have contributed to two mass shootings. The normalization of these kinds of ideas as “one side of the argument” strikes me as a tragedy. Young men online becoming politically conscious for the first time are going to stumble across this stuff, which is designed to appeal to their insecurities. I’m not sure if I can really measure the potential harm this could cause but it concerns me a lot. Fascism isn’t compatible with liberal democracy the way conservativism or libertarianism are (in theory... as a ideology—i recognize the republican party has been undermining our democracy for decades)
― treeship 2, Sunday, 19 November 2017 18:31 (six years ago) link
Then again, the fact that many of these people are nihilistic in outlook and seem to have picked up their racism from virtual communities might be their ultimate weakness. It’s hard to know how many of them seem committed to this cause, which is comprised of shapeless, angry people.
― treeship 2, Sunday, 19 November 2017 18:34 (six years ago) link
I think you have to be way more Twitter/Tumblr-involved to get that tweet (I don't).
― louise ck (milo z), Sunday, 19 November 2017 18:51 (six years ago) link
I think she's saying that socialist men will profess to believe whatever they think will get them into a pretty girl's bed, isn't that obvious?
― "Taste's very strange!" (stevie), Sunday, 19 November 2017 19:43 (six years ago) link
Thanks for pointing out Angela Nagle is a spikeder - I'd added her book to my wishlist under the impression that it was basically a timely 2017 update of The Rebel Sell, but reading her Twitter feed it's pretty much non-stop trolling challops. A shame as I do want to read the book that I imagined this would be.
― mfktz (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Sunday, 19 November 2017 20:22 (six years ago) link
^ Same here, thanks ILX
― Gavin, Leeds, Sunday, 19 November 2017 21:38 (six years ago) link
a spikedera what? i googled and found no satisfying answer
― weird woman in a bar (La Lechera), Sunday, 19 November 2017 22:34 (six years ago) link
http://www.spiked-online.com/
― Number None, Sunday, 19 November 2017 22:36 (six years ago) link
online came a spikeder
― fake pato is kind of racist, dude (darraghmac), Sunday, 19 November 2017 22:40 (six years ago) link
Yes, but I don't know the context - like, where is this actually happening on Twitter/Tumblr. Without that it's just a "men drive like THIS" joke.
― louise ck (milo z), Sunday, 19 November 2017 22:43 (six years ago) link
Meanwhile, a new development appears
4Chan /pol/ users are eating onions in an effort to increase their testosterone, and it's not going well pic.twitter.com/jSX9MD4Oyo— Will Sommer (@willsommer) November 20, 2017
(Several pics)
― Google Murray Blockchain (kingfish), Monday, 20 November 2017 05:16 (six years ago) link
Is this a global right wing nutter thing - Tony Abbot is famous for eating onions like apples.
― American Fear of Pranksterism (Ed), Monday, 20 November 2017 06:00 (six years ago) link
also fred west
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/1507773.stm
West, an uncouth man whose personal habits included munching raw onions as if they were apples, recounted in grim detail how he ...
― 𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Monday, 20 November 2017 17:00 (six years ago) link
pic.twitter.com/cvIC2vRu42— Ken Klippenstein (@kenklippenstein) November 20, 2017
― Monster fatberg (Phil D.), Monday, 20 November 2017 21:44 (six years ago) link
Mocking the Gorka loadout special:
http://taskandpurpose.com/gorka-edc-guns-pocket-constitution-lol/
― Google Murray Blockchain (kingfish), Tuesday, 28 November 2017 19:59 (six years ago) link
fuck me look at that waistcoat
http://49m47r1ce5b927clot3yajgk.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/GorkaLede-840x420.jpg
― hi i’m darren and i’m a bouncer from bendigo (bizarro gazzara), Tuesday, 28 November 2017 20:25 (six years ago) link
dad jeans / skinny belt is chefkiss.jpg
― hi i’m darren and i’m a bouncer from bendigo (bizarro gazzara), Tuesday, 28 November 2017 20:26 (six years ago) link
(Via @ericswerdlin) pic.twitter.com/Osp2mPZnOh— Kevin M. Kruse (@KevinMKruse) November 25, 2017
― Moodles, Tuesday, 28 November 2017 20:36 (six years ago) link
genuine lol
― hi i’m darren and i’m a bouncer from bendigo (bizarro gazzara), Tuesday, 28 November 2017 21:14 (six years ago) link
All foreign revenue is untaxed after one year.
― reggie (qualmsley), Wednesday, 29 November 2017 04:40 (six years ago) link
Who remembers “Liberality for All?” (Key quote: “Is that my man Hannity?”)
Milo Yiannopoulos sells an extensive line of comic book-themed T-shirts about himself pic.twitter.com/OLHgKLkzih— Will Sommer (@willsommer) November 29, 2017
(There’s at least 6 here. One wonders how Steranko would react.)
― Google Murray Blockchain (kingfish), Wednesday, 29 November 2017 18:18 (six years ago) link
Steranko is a MAGA chud, sadly.
― cosmic brain dildo (Sparkle Motion), Wednesday, 29 November 2017 18:22 (six years ago) link
xpostSteranko is a Trump supporter fwiw
― Ward Fowler, Wednesday, 29 November 2017 18:23 (six years ago) link
Ah rats, now I’m depressed
― Google Murray Blockchain (kingfish), Wednesday, 29 November 2017 21:51 (six years ago) link
He triggered the libs...but at what cost? pic.twitter.com/drhaZSTsZe— Will Sommer (@willsommer) November 29, 2017
The Gateway Pundit updates on Lucian Wintrich's arrest are incredible pic.twitter.com/6B2o6kXrb5— Will Sommer (@willsommer) November 29, 2017
Other noteworthy thing about the Lucian Wintrich brawl video is that the guy in red wading in on his behalf is Sal Cipolla, a former top Proud Boy who left the group because he went to Charlottesville / was too alt right for them— Will Sommer (@willsommer) November 29, 2017
― Google Murray Blockchain (kingfish), Wednesday, 29 November 2017 21:52 (six years ago) link
Nevermind Steranko, can't Marvel and DC force a cease & desist? Where are giant evil corporations when you need them?
― Daniel_Rf, Thursday, 30 November 2017 10:45 (six years ago) link
Am guessing they can't for the same reason Mad can parody things. But yes, I wish they would.
What is wrong with all these fucking choads that they see people like Milo and this Lucien shitrag and don't see horribly broken, failed human beings, but heroic figures instead?
― "Taste's very strange!" (stevie), Thursday, 30 November 2017 11:18 (six years ago) link
Sort of answers itself
― El Tomboto, Thursday, 30 November 2017 12:38 (six years ago) link
My god this story is pathetic http://www.courant.com/news/connecticut/hc-news-lucian-wintrich-uconn-national-reax-20171129-story.html
― El Tomboto, Thursday, 30 November 2017 12:43 (six years ago) link
― hi i’m darren and i’m a bouncer from bendigo (bizarro gazzara), Thursday, 30 November 2017 13:10 (six years ago) link
it never occurred to me before, but Steranko looks kind of like an elderly version of Milo
https://cache.wizardworld.com/files/guests/_350x350_crop_center-center_100/Screen-Shot-2017-08-18-at-11.34.05-AM.png https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/41dc1601a35d0f5c8e892b73a2db0b722f17ca41/0_186_6016_3608/master/6016.jpg?w=300&q=55&auto=format&usm=12&fit=max&s=2fb8e255a61b03dce17b5fce0aab656c
― soref, Thursday, 30 November 2017 13:51 (six years ago) link
gahhh
― hi i’m darren and i’m a bouncer from bendigo (bizarro gazzara), Thursday, 30 November 2017 14:00 (six years ago) link
Steranko looks like a character from Dan Pussey, which makes sense, because he is.
― dan selzer, Thursday, 30 November 2017 14:04 (six years ago) link
woah, if you'd asked me five minutes ago i'd have sworn jim steranko was dead.
― 'cause there's always been an it i can't truss (Doctor Casino), Thursday, 30 November 2017 14:26 (six years ago) link
Making my way through the rest of this piece on the normalization of H!tler. But no, sorry, I'm told its just a meme or somesuch.
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 30 November 2017 15:38 (six years ago) link
tag yourself. i'm this guy pic.twitter.com/2jDykw5rLG— Stefan Heck (@boring_as_heck) November 30, 2017
― Google Murray Blockchain (kingfish), Friday, 1 December 2017 02:16 (six years ago) link
lol white ppl going to college! how fucking white can you be!
― sleepingbag, Friday, 1 December 2017 02:21 (six years ago) link
find other hobbies
― Men's Scarehouse - "You're gonna like the way you're shook." (m bison), Friday, 1 December 2017 02:32 (six years ago) link
Wait are ppl actually surprised re steranko cuz um
― Οὖτις, Friday, 1 December 2017 02:42 (six years ago) link