Another fucking spree shooting. Great.

fuckin' a

BREAKING: President Trump says he’s directed AG Sessions to clarify if bump stocks are illegal and to propose regulations to “ban all devices that turn legal weapons into machine guns.” pic.twitter.com/cnZ2mc08TF

— NBC News (@NBCNews) February 20, 2018

that's sweet, go kids (be safe) xp

Right on

awesome

But it did/has. There are no more cigarette machines and the age to buy (and taxes) keeps creeping up.

― Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, February 20, 2018 12:55 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

cigarette machines aren't "gone", just there are less of them because they're banned in establishments where people younger than 18 are allowed in. the bar near me in Sanford still has one cos you have to be 18 or older to enter.

Likewise, the federal minimum age to purchase tobacco is still 18 and though many indeed have increased the age, many states (like mine) have kept the tobacco purchase age at 18. smoking is declining nationwide but 258 billion cigarettes were still sold in the US in 2016. and it's hard to tell how much of the decline is the rising costs/regulations or the rise of popularity of vaping.

― fuck the NRA (Neanderthal), Tuesday, February 20, 2018 3:00 PM (eighteen minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i have no seen a cigarette machine in 10 years at least

smoking was in decline WAY before vaping c'mon, i guess i don't know what argument you are trying to make so probably the ol' extremely useful "devil's advocate" role

oh man, it's been so long since I've seen a cigarette machine

come to think of it I still call the car charger the "cigarette lighter" even though it's been at least a decade since I've seen anyone light a cigarette with one

saw one in a bar three weeks ago.

THey're around, just uncommon.

In Florida you can still buy cigs at bars if the bar has a patio.

Alfred and Neanderthal are both from FL. Mystery of the extant cigarette machines solved probably.

could be...I'm from Wisconsin, we have lots of bars and we love to smoke, even if we have to stand in -5 degree weather

(btw, this is primarily the reason why I don't smoke - if you could smoke in bars still, I probably would have picked it up at some point)

this is from 1990 i'm sure they have to be banned at least in minneapolis if not statewide by now (the city was gonna ban menthol cigs a while back don't know if that went through)

http://www.nytimes.com/1990/04/05/us/minnesota-moves-to-curb-cigarette-machines.html

bars in Oregon have cig machines

saw somewhere that ~4 million current high school students will be eligible to vote in 2020

how do you pay?? amex?

(cig machines i mean)

cash

how do you pay?? amex?

― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand),

you blow your dragon breath into the slot

p sure i saw a cigarette machine somewhere in new mexico recently, but it was the first I'd seen in close to a decade

BREAKING: MoCo Police located the following items in home of Clarksburg HS student who allegedly brought handgun to class last week:

•AR-15 style rifle
•Multiple grenades
•Detonator for C4 land mines
•Additional guns
•Tactical vest
•List of grievances re: students/school pic.twitter.com/oBo71QoFVH

— Kevin Lewis (@ABC7Kevin) February 20, 2018

great which local GOP congressman is going to give away C4 at their next fundraiser

this is the sort of thing that church was supposed to deal with, that and desperate alcoholism and tainted food. GET ON THE CASE EVANGELICALS

i mean i'm sorry wtf are you for, if you are a religion in america and you are not addressing the spiritual disconnect that underlies school shootings, oxycontin and trumpism

blaming shit on the gays and the hippies and modernity while doing absolutely fuckin nothin

Oh, is that what xtian religious leaders are supposed to do!? I thought they were just supposed to unquestioningly support whatever leaders oppose abortion! Huh! Weird!

you can put all the blame on "degradation of society" or w/e and STILL think gun control is a good idea! I mean they should sort of go hand in hand right? Like "while we wait for society to turn back to the Lord, let's try to keep these immoral heathens away from guns".

smoking was in decline WAY before vaping c'mon, i guess i don't know what argument you are trying to make so probably the ol' extremely useful "devil's advocate" role

― It's not delivery, it's Adorno! (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, February 20, 2018 4:21 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

jesus fuck, dude, the point I was making is that using the smoking restrictions in various states as well as the federal cigarette machine "ban" aren't a good analogy for gun control (even though I believe in the latter) and that I also doubt that the decline in the % of people who smoke (which has been consistent since 1965) had much to do with that (hell it actually increased in 2008).

but you have a boner for shitting on me lately so idk

gun control is a good idea, gun bans a better idea, and yet we'll still fight the same rhetoric for another ten years.

hoping the bump stock ban becomes a reality, it's not the be-all solution, but at least it's at least a needle move.....

just as gun laws would be a symbolic flag in the ground saying society as a whole does not approve of gun violence and those who love guns should at the least be stink-eyed, anti-smoking laws have effectively made smokers personas non-grata

I’d do a teach-in too. Are there resources / suggested content?

― rb (soda), Tuesday, February 20, 2018 1:59 PM (three hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i teach this every year in my government class and i will teach it again march 14

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2014/05/nra-guns-second-amendment-106856

With all due respect, after years spent reading this sort of thing, what amendments "intend" has nothing to do with what empowered political movements can do. The Due Process and Equal Protection clauses of the Fourteenth Amendment didn't intend to protect homosexuals facing marriage discrimination yet those on my side made the more compelling legal argument that dovetailed with an evolving society.

I read Waldman's book several years ago -- terrific.

well, that's kind of the point. kids are going to hear messages about the 2nd amendment protecting the individual's right to own a firearm. we can teach them that is a modern interpretation that is different from its original intent. this is not to teach them that we ought to revert to the original interpretation, but that interpretations change with years of political organization and pressure. the message from the article is that the NRA, over the course of several decades, used activism to change how the courts see the 2nd amendment. we can do the same, only yknow in a direction that is not hellbent on social destruction.

xp to aimless

do you mean me?

oh pfft yeah

NRA goon got pwned on ABC Radio National. He clearly didn't expect to come up against an interview with an ability to refute his 'facts' on the fly.

http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/breakfast/gun-bans-dont-work-says-nra-member/9469126

gosh, it would be nice if just for once Trump's all-consuming need to be praised by the teevee men led him to actually doing something good, re: bump stocks. of course I'm highly dubious this or any other measure will ever actually see the light of day as policy, especially since it was almost taken for granted that something would happen with bump stocks after Vegas and then nothing did.

even if it did, it seems like the most token gesture of "gun control" imaginable. granted, if they were passing bills every week to ban stuff like bump stocks it would be great - the gun problem is really complicated and it would help to chip away at it from all sorts of angles. but they won't. even if they manage to pass something on bump stocks (probably after democrats compromise by raising the age of social security benefits to 85 or something), that'll be the only thing. it means nothing.

this is so sad

WATCH: At Southwestern High School in Indiana, the classroom doors are bullet-resistant, cameras are everywhere, and the Sheriff’s department -- only 10 miles away -- can track an intruder in real-time pic.twitter.com/mOchmdS7ol

— NBC Nightly News with Lester Holt (@NBCNightlyNews) February 21, 2018

a teacher explains that a red piece of tape on the classroom floor delineates the zone where students can hide from a gunman without being seeing from the door, while the students demonstrate by huddling up in a corner with books covering their faces. the reporter breathlessly adds that this is a low-cost measure that could be implemented in all school immediately

Banning bump stocks seems like the single most purely symbolic measure he can do, without doing even one iota about the problem. He can infinitely point back and say he didn't horse around, he actually did something! It changes nothing, it means nothing.

US gun policy is like having firefighting banned. House after house burns down and kills people because it's illegal to fight fire. After much outrage, the president has now shown his bravery and decisiveness by allowing every street one (1) bottle of water to fight fire. What a gesture, it's yuge, I have the best measures etc etc

Huddle and cover. Has a familiar ring.

Ok that analogy sucks balls. But so do guns, y'know, those things that will kill people without bump stocks just as well. xp

Trump and Congress will pass legislation banning bump stocks as soon as their friends in the NRA let them know that a new and more efficient technology has made bump stocks obsolete.

That video is absolutely nuts. Only thing missing is an AK-47 over the teachers shoulder.

xp Old Lunch otm

Great job on replicating the logistics and mechanics of the surveillance state and the prison in public schools, America

that video is dystopian

speaking of congress, i realize it's an uphill battle but i'd love to see every single democract get behind the reinstatement of the ban on assault rifles that feinstein periodically introduces in the wake of new massacres. it currently has 25 co-sponsors. the last time (i believe) it was introduced in 2013, a month after sandy hook, it was voted down 60-40. even if it's futile, they need to at least voters know what they stand for so that when we all go to the polls there's an understanding that a vote for a democrat is a vote for a ban on assault rifles.

xpost it's dystopian as fuck, i don't know how that segment was produced in the way that it was, with the reporter responding to what was happening in that way, with that presentation. so fucked up.

If you make public schools dangerous/terrible enough, people will only send their kids to non-public schools, or none at all which is...OH, HEY

that's my brother's conspiracy theory