Is the Guardian worse than it used to be?

there's some good stuff there sure, the energy company is particularly interesting (though the policing record seems sus, doesn't scotland have the worst stop&search record in the uk by a margin?), but that's fairly small (& easily reversible) stuff.

it's a question of ambition. independence will be a hard battle and, like brexit, take up a huge amount of attention, time and resources, and it should surely be for more than baby boxes and extra nursery provision. if you want to address the major long term structural issues in the country you need to tackle the dominant interests, and as far as I can see a democratic labour party is the only thing that has a shot at ending tory hegemony and having the power to implement major reform. an independent scotland would ofc be more susceptible to being bullied and played off other weaker nations by international capital, will still be vulnerable to being hobbled and thwarted by the tory-run country south of the border. as with the uk and europe post-brexit, you'll just have less of a say in what goes on. do you really want to give the tories an easier ride?

there's some insistence upthread that it's not an us and them thing, but then what's the plan for sunderland? how are you not just fucking off the majority of poor ppl in the uk to protect a small slice? I was pro independence in the ref bc the national situation looked absolutely hopeless and if someone could escape then good on them! no one thought the change in rules in the labour party would be big deal but it totally opened it up and a huge, democratic organised movement has flourished that is in the process of completely transforming the party and beyond. if we're just judging things as they stand without looking at how they're likely to change then much of the country would have little cause for optimism. the labour council in manchester have been shocking for years, someone I used to work with is on it and she backs dan jarvis ffs. scotland seems like the most interesting & politically crucial part of the uk atm, and a scottish labour movement could have a crucial influence on the rest of the uk and it just seems pessimistic and defensive to sack all that off, to declare the problem unsolvable and decide to insulate yourself against it instead of fighting it.

ironic that the quality of debate on this thread this week has been better than the usual level of the Graun

Esther McVey's idea of a baby box would be: some Richard Scarry illustrated story about why Huckle Cat jr must tell mummy not to birth them a third sibling (unless she gets raped), and a list of local abortion clinics.

see that's practical philanthropy

doesn't scotland have the worst stop&search record in the uk by a margin?

Stop & Search is a completely different kettle of fish in Scotland, where the police and the people they're stopping look the same, talk the same etc.

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44658000/jpg/_44658036_fan_clash_ap226.jpg
"the people they're stopping look the same, talk the same etc"

"A'm aff tae stoap 'n' search ye richt noo ye doss fud"

that search is not gonna take long

I'm guessing they support the same team though.

<spiderman-pointing-at-himself.img>

we got our baby box a few weeks ago and it's fucking great - it's a nice bonus for us but for i can see it making a real difference to the quality of life of lower-income families

we'll of course be trying not to set it down near any open flames because it comes pre-doused in gasoline iirc from the hysterical negative coverage of them over the last week or two

Stop & Search is a completely different kettle of fish in Scotland, where the police and the people they're stopping look the same, talk the same etc.

Even in the ten plus years I've been living in Glasgow, the city has visibly become more racially and culturally diverse, so I'm guessing that the number of minorities subjected to stop and search has also increased in that time.

Indeed, but there's no doubt about what increased stop & search powers means in London.

race obv not the only way of profiling, stop&search wld suck even in a world of identical ppl, it's the most superficial sort of policing

then what's the plan for sunderland? how are you not just fucking off the majority of poor ppl in the uk to protect a small slice?

this is, in a nutshell, my moral problem with independence

I understand why people support independence - Westminster is fucked and people deserve better. But I think you can create more and better change from inside a system, than from walking away and setting it up your own and hoping it will work better

an important point to note: the scottish contingent of MPs almost never determine which way the government goes at westminster. labour need to win england to beat the tories.

also EVEL exists now

But surely if Labour had a decent number of MPs (pre-2010) Corbyn would've been PM by now?

Meanwhile here is a better publication than The Guardian. Click on the link below for a sample of their work:

https://www.teenvogue.com/story/who-is-karl-marx/amp?__twitter_impression=true

But surely if Labour had a decent number of MPs (pre-2010) Corbyn would've been PM by now?

― xyzzzz__, Friday, May 11, 2018 9:16 AM (fifty minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

the tories have 13 of scotland's 59 seats. whether the remaining, majority of teh seats are held by snp, labour, or the post-coalition lib dems they would not be voting to prop up this government.

What I mean is if Labour had returned to more robust numbers in Scotland at the expense of Tories (and maybe some SNP) then perhaps we would not be where we are rn.

they won 70 less seats than the tories in england

The current coalition would not have been on.

the only seats that labour had any meaningful chance of winning are ones that went to the SNP.

some of the *check wikipedia tab* 41/59 seats that went to Labour in 2010, Jim?

All I am saying is that Scotland can shape the direction of the UK government.

Gotta hear both sides:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/may/25/yes-irish-pro-abortion-side-politial-class-media-illiberal-view

fucking hell

i guess the grauniad is jealous of all the hate-clicks the new york times' rightwing shithead commentators have been generating recently

celestial brain what if hate is the real love what if bad was good what then, sjws?

good work Melanie McDonagh i totally hope god doesn't kill you

the john grace article about his heroin addiction was bloody good earlier this week.

Link or you made it up

for every 1 item of "high-quality journalism" in the Graun they seem to need to plumb the same depths as The Times over + over again, arseholes.

Crace, not Grace.

Hilarious piece:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/may/23/venezuela-dictator-democracy-nicolas-maduro-venezuelans

john crace vs heroin :

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2018/may/22/patrick-melrose-captures-heroin-addiction-perfectly-it-brought-my-memories-flooding-back

Wow, never would have guessed. But then, how could I?

Aye same here, it's at least 6 weeks since I tooted some brown :p Nah but seriously, I've known a few people over who you'd never guess used to have a raging smack habit by their demeanour and appearance etc, and others where you'd suspect they are still bang at it!

-over the years-

Yes, liked the Crace piece a lot. And the photo of him skating.

https://imgur.com/a/EJcnf37

oh shit folks:

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2018/may/29/online-forums-musical-culture-messageboards-social-media-music-essay

Haven’t had a chance to read that properly yet, but there’s a nice symmetry to the fact that the starter of this very thread gets a namecheck

Turrican's name in lights at long last.

Also LOLz @ Is the Guardian worse than it used to be? thread being possibly the oldest thread on ILX in permanent use.

He wasn't a troll he was a werewolf >:(

screenshotted!!

yawn at the fucking beatles being the top thread

I think the article really needs some Alizée gifs for illustrative purposes.

nice to see good ol’ barbelith namechecked there, that site used to be v important to me

I had a soft spot for it too.

https://media3.giphy.com/media/NB2Wp158kieGI/giphy.gif

Tom clearly never truly crossed over to ILE, as he would've mentioned groovypanda.gif instead