L. Cohen or P. Simon, who is the better songwriter

Paul Simon, obviously.

simon's last album was hella cool

xp - Yes this poll is a little ridiculous I guess. Cohen seems more revered around here but that probably has a lot to do with his being more active this century and then his passing

Cohen’s adherents tend to be particularly... spirited, in my experience

don't make me post that amanda palmer video

I remain blissfully ignorant

two different types, hard to compare, but i prefer Lenny C

possibly because there's more room to improve on the original performances

Kinda like Bob Dylan then.

The fact is cohen is like last among the canonical big singer-songwriters to come out in Dylan’s wake and go huge in the 70s - neil, paul, lou reed - they’re all ahead of him imo.

He never 'went huge' in the 70s. I don't really think Paul Simon is the same thing at all as those others listen, or Dylan - even if that's where he started.

listed not listen

Dylan, Cohen, Neil Young, Lou Reed - their songs are generally pretty simple to play and sing.

Neil paul bob and leonard all came out of the coffee shop folkie milieu ifvthe early 60s, which is really the only common link. Lou is bit of a different beast but even he had a bit of that in him as is evident from VU outtakes and demos.

Leonard wouldve loved to he huge in the 70s if he’d been able to figure out how lol

xp

Be huge

leonard is a superior lyricist, but not as superior as paul is a melodist.

Because of this thread I found out that Simon has a new album coming out in septembe: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_the_Blue_Light It includes rerecorded versions of some of his more obscure songs. He did a couple on the tour, and they were great. My response literally was that I wanted a whole album of that. So yay :)

Strikes me that if Simon were a worse melody writer, or a singer more in the style of Dylan or Cohen then his lyrics would be better thought of. He's been *too fucking good* a songwriter to get the same kind of plaudits for being a poet like those 2, and others.

Either that or people don't like his songs or his records.

People don’t like his songs or records, which is why he’s one of the most popular songwriters of the 20th century

Maybe the sort of people likely to give out plaudits for being a poet might not like be the sort of people who like his songs and or his records? Crrrrrrritics?

It's pretty silly to say he's too good a songwriter to be recognized as a poet, isn't it? Leonard Cohen actually was a poet after all!

I can't think of much worse than a songwriter being called a poet anyway so Paul has done well to avoid the tag!

Cohen better at words, Simon better at tunes, voted Simon because tunes is better than words

voted Simon for that sweet ass

Lenny never blew that room away imho

lmao

only one of these men was a REAL songwriter

Either way Cohen and Dylan are both known as having a lyrical genius or huge gift that Simon doesn't have and i posit that much of it is because he wrote tuuuunes, so the lyrics get ignored half the time. Hardly the most original thought ever expressed about the man i'm sure but there it is.

the idea that Cohen and Dylan get covered more because "there's more room to improve on the original performances" doesn't make any sense to me

they get covered for the same reason Shakespeare's plays get played; partly because of canonization, partly because they wrote v strong material with room for interpretation

to suggest Cohen (or Dylan or Young or Lou or whichever songwriter) didn't write good melodies also completely misses the mark to me

I'm thinking Simon's style of writing doesn't lend itself as much to covers (apart from the early folky stuff)

anyway I still find this a troll poll

That Cohen doc Simon posted upthread is amazing.

See, even Paul Simon is a fan of Lennie.

"Proper" songwriting, yeah, right.

agree with the comment above that the excellence of Simon's songwriting obscures his quality as a poet. (even with sonny getting sunnier.)

half of whatever votes Simon gets should be distributed to Los Lobos

this thread is making me hate paul simon

I hear you.

voted Simon for that sweet ass

― fuck the NRA (Neanderthal), Friday, July 20, 2018 7:08 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

respect

is the Capeman music good

Not really

i'm like an 80th percentile cohen fan and only like a 50th percentile simon fan but it's still simon by a long shot

Cohen for not breaking the boycott of playing South Africa

I've got mad love for the Capeman music myself, but it's probably his most 'love it or hate it' album. It's got latin and doo-wop influenced sounds with Rubén Blades and Marc Anthony singing. If that doesn't sound appealing to you, you probably shouldn't bother with it.

It was so appealing to me that I went to see the show during its original run but I still don’t like the music.

I love Capeman, “Born In Puerto Rico” is top shelf.

Voted Cohen btw

Lenny didn't need Garfunkel to become a star iirc

the posited distinction between "poet" and "songwriter" is stupid stuff I'd've thought we'd all outgrown, they are the same occupation but for different though sometimes intersecting audiences. but solve for "we all" obv, I think most of the world thinks a poet and a songwriter are two different things & I have my own baggage to account for here too (intended to become a poet i.e. writer of books of poetry, began setting my verse to song, ended up being a songwriter). I like Cohen's poetry (=songs) and don't much care for Simon's with a few exceptions; Simon's a superior melodist & is more curious sonically / stylistically than Cohen, though Cohen's songs in the care of others often reveal themselves to be better melodies than they appeared to any but the converted in their original iterations.

This is a Beatles-Stones question, so I'll just say Dylan.

This is a Beatles-Stones question, so I'll just say "klaatu, berata...."

Best to solve this with brackets.

"Celia" vs. "Chelsea Hotel No. 2"

"Bridge Over Troubled Water" vs. "If It Be Your Will"

"Duncan" vs. "The Stranger Song"

"Late in the Evening" vs. "Jazz Police'

i don't know guys, a lot of songs, you can call me al or any number of incredibly popular songs you mentioned and many others. like it's not even close simon has many standards.

but i'll dip out and let simon fans jack themselves off about their really advanced tastes in music

Heard or own is definitely a low bar! I doubt many under the age of, I dunno, 30 know much about either artist, so knowing just one song from one of them might be it!

I mean, Cohen's Various Positions wasn't even released in the U.S. when it came out in the early 80s.

A few years later, Cohen accepted an award and said about Columbia Records "I have always been touched by the modesty of their interest in my work."

Which has nothing to do with quality, just popularity.

Giggling at the conspiracy theories explaining why Simon got robbed.

idk what Simon's most widely known song is. Mrs. Robinson? Me & Julio?

― Οὖτις, Wednesday, August 8, 2018 4:24 PM (two hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

At this point, I'd say 'You Can Call Me Al', actually!

http://simonandgarfunkelnews.web.tv/video/the-sweeney-sisters-paul-simon-bridge-over-troubled-water-webtv__bloizapjrnk

omg watching this again serious lols