Why do people leave ILX for good?

*until/unless they say otherwise.

in an ideal social world it would be very obvious at all times who is upset with whom, but we don't live in that world.

I’m not upset at you

Defensive about the sea lioning thing but not mad

omar and karl otm. probably most people here at some point freaked out because of something callous someone said on ilx. no one thinks it's weird that you're upset or whatever. not sure if any of this is helpful at all -- probably isn't

― Trϵϵship, Friday, August 17, 2018 1:09 PM (nine minutes ago)

ehh, I got borderline doxxed by a prominent and beloved ILXor (now long gone)

the only solution I see seems to be to force myself to listen to or say nice things about a song I dislike.

Or to not give a fuck about any of this shit. Life's too short etc etc. You seem like a good egg and I'm just piping in cause I don't like seeing kind people beat themselves up over totally unimportant msg board nonsense.

hmm I think I remember that. If it’s what you’re talking about it was exceptionally shitty.

but I do care about it, I care even more when it's people I know, and I definitely care when it's people I work with. telling someone not to care about something has never caused them to stop caring about it. if anything people in the world need to care about things more, not less

i think that that should not and does not apply to *everything*

but it does and should apply to people someone interacts with on a regular basis.

ok but I'm saying this is def not one of those things that should be cared about. what have you gained from caring about it? what CAN be gained? I'd just log off, go for a walk outside, get some perspective. I'm sorry if this sounds condescending...like I said, just hate seeing someone stress out over something like this.

I don't get to pick and choose what I care about, and I also don't get to pick and choose when people decide to start an unwanted argument with me apparently

I’m mostly a lurker but katherine you seem like a smart and thoughtful person, I think you’re mistaken about the likelihood of people classifying you as “bad person/person I’m permanently mad at” based on disagreement over a song. Me thinking that you’re taking dismissive comments and rude disagreements a bit too much to heart doesn’t mean that I think less of you as a person or writer or that I wouldn’t do the same thing if I ever produced anything worth reading.

"you cannot control what happens in life, but you can control how you respond"
you can also very easily just...log off. go engage in something else.
ok I'm done with the advice, seems like you're determined to keep wallowing.

fwiw, I think you can (and should) care about presenting yourself in the best light possible online –– which you clearly do, and with aplomb. And it's irritating when somebody misattributes your words, or perceives/paints you in a negative light. BUT you can't help the way internet weirdos think about you. There is, and always has been, a contingent of cynical, hard-nosed, merciless ilx/ilm folks who like to score points off others, or advance their own agenda on a hill of previous posts. there's nothing you can do if you wander into their crosshairs, and all you can do is duck/cover. good luck!

xp some of these people are known bomb throwers who are guaranteed to say things in the future that will upset you if you let it. i am with granny dainger -- i don't think it's a good idea to hinge whether you have a good day based on what other people may or may not think unless they are like, family members or close friends

Granny Dainger otm. If you are feeling overly-affected by ILX drama, one of the best things you can do is walk away from it for a while. Staring at all of these words can be counterproductive wrt perspectival realignment, I find.

the people I'm worried about aren't "known bomb throwers," and if they are, I don't understand why I'm the person being told what to do and not them.

like, I don't understand how the takeaway is "you should not care when people throw bombs at you" and not "you should not throw bombs at people"

otm

i mean, i told deej that the way he brought up the blurb was bad

others did too i think. he also gets yelled at like 400 times a day by different people for different reasons

because it's easier for you to stop caring then for them to stop throwing bombs. I mean of course they are the ones who should change their behavior...but while we're waiting on that happening, why not try to find a way to defuse the bombs.

you cant control the discussion on that thread or any thread even if you have written an item that prompted discussion there

you may have some limited control through modding around what ppl post about you, obv this is hazy and if the inference us "does a music writer have control over discussion of their writing on ilm" i think the answer there is a clear 'no'. and i dont think this is in any way the same thing as bringing posters celebrity or personal lives into ilx discussion.

you can engage with the discussion and make yr point or you can disengage

i think thats about it for constructive options

I'm not going to stop caring about whether people are upset with me. there are words for people who don't care whether they upset, harm, inconvenience, exasperate, etc. other people, and those words include "asshole" and "sociopath"

Stripped down and simply put, we only have control over ourselves and our own actions. Take care of yourself first and worry about the external 'shoulds' later.

(that was not directed at anybody in particular, just the general concept of someone who doesn't care whether they upset people)

This sure is a lot to come out of Soto's pathological habit of linking his every offsite thought to ILX

haha

xp you did not upset anyone

I think that ppl trying to advise you itt because you seem to be taking more from this than is wise should not be mistaken for ppl who agree that you should have control over what ppl say to you on ilm

there's a LOT of space in between sociopath and extremely thin-skinned. At the risk of making you even more upset and self-critical than you are already, I'd say you could stand to swing away from the thin-skinned end of the spectrum. It's good to care, it's good to consider how you're affecting other people and how they view you. But too much of a good thing...

also everyone on that thread is like 30 or something they can stand to hear someone saying something critical about a thing they like

treeship u have no concept of 30 u whippersnapper

also everyone on that thread is like 30 or something they can stand to hear someone saying something critical about a thing they like

but... doesn't that... go both ways

I don't understand what you mean but I value your opinion and am truly sorry if I upset you over this

i mean, saying the lyrics of a song are shallow is different than telling a poster that they, personally, are a troll

xp

not that calling someone a troll is truly *that* out of line, but it bothered katherine, and it was a kind of sideswipping kind of way to deal with someone's commentary

I mean if we're being really honest I'm more concerned with my stance on the song being "insane"

This sure is a lot to come out of Soto's pathological habit of linking his every offsite thought to ILX

― 5th Ward Weeaboo (Whiney G. Weingarten)

I have some thoughts on the matter.

I’m not really involved in this though and should bow out—i’ve got a thing where i vocalize too many of my opinions

(and that isn't to be like "OMG YOU SAID AN ABLEIST THING" -- although sure, it'd be great if people would not do that -- and more that this is a fundamental, core part of how I engage with music, writing, or any other piece of art)

calling someone a troll is a very nothing event in ilm or ilx or anywhere else tbh

im sorry that you feel otherwise katherine, but

in virtually every forum I have ever participated in, not to mention the current discourse about twitter trolls, calling someone a troll is saying that they are doing something just to upset people and that in an ideal world they should be banned, silenced, or ignored.

i immediately corrected & said to read that post as 'makes me feel insane'

but even in its original form that phrasing is mere message board hyperbole, obviously i don't literally feel insane nor do i think you are insane

ironically the exact thing i was protesting was the kind of literalism that insists a song's lyrics can only ever be interpreted as endorsing the thing they say

except that isn't what I did at all, my argument was more along the lines of "it is very difficult to make a war movie that doesn't inadvertently glorify war, and even if you do, don't be surprised if people don't like or want to watch it based on their experiences with war"

this is the *idea* that you argued I was critical of, which again, was an idea, not you personally

anyway i don't think this conversation is at all helpful, at the risk of 'throwing bombs' there's a lot of unhelpful "man up" type advice being thrown her way but i think justin3's pt is fair...this convo should probably just end i think we've wrung enough faux drama from this stone! its also being blown out of proportion bc bored office workers on ilx need something to do

except that isn't what I did at all, my argument was more along the lines of "it is very difficult to make a war movie that doesn't inadvertently glorify war, and even if you do, don't be surprised if people don't like or want to watch it based on their experiences with war"

― aloha darkness my old friend (katherine), Friday, August 17, 2018 12:57 PM (twenty-eight seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

well i dont disagree w this point so it sounds like it's largely a misunderstanding of each other's position

or as a great artist once said, hardening positions based on miscommunication

i def ain’t got shit to do today in the office

katherine you didn't 'upset' me, i am more extremely confused as to what outcome might satisfy you here. the best way to get people to stop talking is to not respond! which sucks but that's asynchronous communication for you. as for other outcomes, we can't go back in time and excise the word 'troll' and its variants from earlier posts (although rereading makes one realize that despite k3vin's post, multiple people said explicitly they were not referring to you as a "troll" and were affording you a respect far apart from that thread's no. 1 menace – this was even before everything blew up.

it's hard having your work in the public eye, but saying "whatever, difference of opinion" and moving on is the only way to go when you're dealing with lower-stakes stuff like message board posts (obviously increased threats to your personhood etc are different – and before you object and say this is among them, i seriously doubt that anyone with one of the dwindling editorial jobs out there marked your name down as a result of an argument on a - let's be honest - dwindling message board). saying "i don't want to discuss this" and then spending hours of your day doing exactly that is extremely counterproductive for everyone, but ESPECIALLY for you, because it just winds up being a lot of wasted energy. unless you have, like i said above, a desired result here? if so, what is it?

xp