thread to dis hyped releases that you don't get/don't like/wanna complain about

ok ignore that post and just watch/listen to this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wPanudF7X6I

I don’t think I’m attacking anyone, I’m just wondering whether “poptimism” is still relevant as a critical lens. These things are often circumstantial—no one says they’re a “New Critic” anymore even if they still draw on some of the ideas from that school.

i'll read some of those tom ewing columns.

maybe go do that? you really aren't making much sense, Matt DC otm

Due to its ubiquitousness, pop music doesn't need intelligent critics to lavish their optimism upon it in 2018, other genres do. It's time to move on: less pop music, more of everything else, thanks.

I'll leave it at that, as I've think I've already hit my quota of variations on a single theme for the week.

there may be a generational component to this misunderstanding. I get the sense that older ILMers focus more on its causes whereas younger ones are more interested in its effects.

Fwiw, I'm old enough to have been on the first ILM thread and to have written 30 pages about one Avril Lavigne song in a grad course in 2003 and I think a lot of what you're saying is OTM.

(I'm also pretty sure "poptimism" meant something more than just a synonym for "open-mindedness" btw; that would have been completely uninteresting. It was a critical stance that had actual principles, which can be debated. There are a lot of ideas in the Tom Ewing 'interview with Jessica Simpson': about download/mp3 culture, about 'authentic' vs 'manufactured and fake' and why that is a false binary, about whether the artist's intention and investment does or should matter to the listener or the critic, about whether formal innovation and progress matter, about the relationship of culture to politics and economics and whether that matters, about the aesthetic attractiveness of three-minute songs about romance. To Tom's credit, these were bold and thoughtful ideas, which can be argued.)

sund4r otm

quite pleased that the most vigorous ilm discussion in weeks has served to hide all my various 'hurr x is shit' broadsides in the jump

If I may return this thread to that territory — D0ja C4t seems to me like, idk, the musical equivalent of clickbait or “meme-making,” or something... I don’t get at all why ppl on here (with good taste) hear in her.

The moo song is horrendous

bitch i’m a cow

:P

lol

has anyone made a Moo'd Up mashup yet?

these were bold and thoughtful ideas

Very much agreed. This kind of poptimism, narrowly defined, has greatly influenced my own understanding of music over the years. But since rockism manifestly lost the war, poptimism – in no small part due to the term's suggestive versatility – is no longer 'anti-establishment' in 2018. Quite the contrary, which is why it deserves a bit of a ruffling.

What I do notice, however, is that the most vocal poptimists are almost systematically uninterested in anything that falls outside of their purview (short, accessible, earwormy songs, preferably conducive to a political analysis), barring a woke signifier or two.

it's hard to concentrate on complex songs when you are made of straw

Between the idea
And the reality…

If I may return this thread to that territory — D0ja C4t seems to me like, idk, the musical equivalent of clickbait or “meme-making,” or something... I don’t get at all why ppl on here (with good taste) hear in her.

― underqualified backing vocalist (morrisp), Monday, December 10, 2018 10:46 AM (twenty-four minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lots of people on ILM were raving about the Doja Cat album months before "Moo" dropped.

for what it's worth I love poptimism being widespread because it means I can hang out with non-music critics, tell them what music I like, and have less chance of being sneered at. it's a very useful thing in my life

'Moo' is vaguely amusing, just 3 minutes and 30 seconds too long.

xxp I know! That’s partly what I’m talking about

I don't believe for a second that any of you actually enjoy the 1975. In my mind, it's all an opportunist move to distance yourself from the exaggeratedly earnest middle-brow herd whose disapproval of this album is just a little bit too easy for you to stomach. Can't let them think they've actually got it, can you?

now we're talking

(I have not heard the band)

ah shit, the jig is up. gonna go to the 1975 thread and tell them that 'operation: annoy ninthyoung' has failed and they can stop listening to their favorite band now.

I'm amazed it took this long for the first 1975 challop to emerge in this thread.

oh i'm not annoyed. I actually conquored my aversions evoked by that facial expression the singer does in press photos and found the music ok

nah I hated it

sorry that you're embarrassed

an opportunist move to distance yourself from the exaggeratedly earnest middle-brow herd whose disapproval of this album is just a little bit too easy for you to stomach. Can't let them think they've actually got it, can you?

Is this a list of the track titles? I can't parse it as an argument

I saw The 1975 back in 2013 when they first came out and it sounded precisely like Hot Hot Heat and a pretty singer yelping "she's got a boyfriend anyway / she's got a boyfriend anyway" and I just figured they were throw-back-to-2003-landfill-indie and would be heard as such. Surprise! it's 2018 and they hybridized that landfill-indie sound with the DNTEL begat Postal Service begat Owl City sound and... I'm glad the music consuming population have figured out what they like and are saying so!

Me, I really appreciate the graphic design on their albums, excellent font choices.

I think you might want to listen to "Mine" or "Lostmyhead" or "Tootimetootime..." to see how that's a woefully inadequate description of Their Thing

"sex" is the only 1975 song that sounds like "sex" otherwise they've barely made anything resembling landfill indie

people keep comparing the album to owl city which is just beyond me

unless you'd like to point me to the owl city record with the garage track on it

i understand they are unbelievably easy to dislike but generally want more precision about it thanks

xp I'll take any excuse to link this: https://youtu.be/ECN7C1QQyqk

an opportunist move to distance yourself from the exaggeratedly earnest middle-brow herd whose disapproval of this album is just a little bit too easy for you to stomach. Can't let them think they've actually got it, can you?

Is this a list of the track titles? I can't parse it as an argument

― I Accept the Word of Santa (Noodle Vague), Monday, December 10, 2018 4:37 PM (twelve minutes ago)

Think the bit in italics is the title of the next album.

In all honesty the last 1975 sounds to me like what landfill indie was supposed to sound like. It's not weird that there's a garage track on it, it's weird that Bloc Party made an album called 'A Weekend In the City' without a garage track on it.

lmao fred otm

I didn't say I disliked them! I don't really like or dislike anything anymore. I do like their fonts! I'm not being dismissive! I saw a poster announcing their recent album and snapped a photo of it and texted it to my design-y friend to ask why I liked the font so much

OK so the song "Sex" was the song I was thinking of. I don't know why I thought it sounded like Hot Hot Heat when it's a very transparent "All My Friends" lift. And DNTEL and that genealogy of production choices isn't really that off-base I don't think... (though to be honest it all sounds like Ariel Rechtstaid to me, all the 1975 tracks I've flipped through over the last half hour could easily be Sky Ferreira songs)

oh sorry fgti i kinda went on a tangent about more general responses to the record lol

I guess I dislike it for the same reasons I dislike shows like Bojack Horseman. They want to make these trenchant comments on society at large but at the same time package it such a way, that if anyone calls them out on the lacking substance or coherence, then it's totally besides the point, because it's about having a laugh.

I guess they sorta address this themselves. "saying controversial things just for the hell of it", but self-awareness about it only makes it come off as more dishonest to me.

Ah, I see. I don't dislike this band! I don't dislike DNTEL or landfill indie either though. I just hear, when I listen to 1975, an amalgamation of things that were roundly excoriated five, ten years ago, (i.e. latter-day Bloc Party! Frederik otm!) But the 1975 make it work somehow (and I myself think it's because of the excellent choices in fonts)

xp

I guess I just don't hear even the teensiest traces of any of the touchstones being thrown out here on the last two records tbh

the fonts are good it's true

Very onion-esque to insist that you like them just fine by emphasizing how much you like the fonts they choose

...why wouldn't that be a valid reason to like a band? OMD are one of my favourite bands and largely for the same reason

And tbf I have only listened to the singles from the new 1975 album and it sounds like the NME did not actually fold but rather manifested itself as a band

the 1975 definitely succeeded in doing the "we're not that interested in being a Rock band anymore" thing where bloc party dramatically failed

my first reaction to them, on hearing some of the singles from the s/t, was "oh this is the latest version of shitty british indie pop like two door cinema club" (which was pretty unfair of me) but then a few years later i heard some of the sublime EP tracks like "me" via the thread here and that made me willing to love them