Rolling Marvel Cinematic Universe thread (+ a poll: Classic or Dud?)

good self-contained DC GNs - Red Son (Soviet Superman), All-Star Superman

Are you looking for things that your kid can read too, or mainly just yourself?

I've also heard about Doctor Doom for my entire life but know nothing about his origin or powers etc

These can be different every few years depending on who's writing or which editor's in charge or whatnot - part of why DC or Marvel own-brand superhero comics are terrible potentially challenging for casual readers.

The initial few years of Spider-Man, written and drawn by Steve Ditko with dialogue added by Stan Lee, would probably be a really good grounding tbh, but the dialogue is very dated.

(and was a 40-year-old's made-up idea of how hip teens talked at the time, and often hasn't actually read the story closely so contradicts what's meant to be going on, or forgets what he wrote previously etc.)

The closest thing to Spider-Verse that's accessible to a new reader (although just with a white male Spider-Man) might be collections of the Spider-Man's Tangled Web series from the early '00s: these were 1, 2 or 3 issue self-contained stories where individual cartoonists or teams were given a little more free reign to bring their style to Spidey. So you'd get a little of the flavour of the many illustrative and tonal styles that Spider-Verse rolled together so well.

I wouldn't give a pre-teen Venom comics at all btw - not only are they designed to be SCARIiIiIIeeEEr than the stuff the kids have read for years already, they're very lamely gross and violent in a way that's aimed at 14-15 year olds who want to feel transgressive but without actually taking in new ideas.

Carnage is Venom, but for 16 year olds who've burnt out on the transgressiveness of Venom.

Tom King's VISION 12-issue miniseries is wonderful. I have no interest in the character or any real knowledge of his history, but this was clever and sad and great.

The initial run of Kamala Khan as Ms. Marvel is fantastic and would be good if your kid wants to read too.
https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Ms._Marvel_Vol_3

They've recently started issuing this new line of collections (roughly twelve issues for $12, slightly smaller than standard comic size but not quite digest size, presumably optimized for YA bookstore shelves) of all-age titles that are legitimately enjoyable for all ages. They kicked it off with Ms. Marvel, Moon Girl & Devil Dinosaur, Unstoppable Wasp, and Spidey, with Squirrel Girl and Miles Morales collections on the way, I believe. I haven't read Spidey (which is basically just a redo of Peter Parker's early adventures from what I understand) but all of the others are delightful and fun and relatively self-contained. Spider-Gwen is also a safe bet inasmuch as she was just created for the comics Spider-Verse event a few years back and her solo title mostly takes place on an alternate earth and thusly requires no foreknowledge of anything.

The Dennis Hopeless run on Spider-Woman was slightly less self-contained but very good (particularly Shifting Gears Vol. 1 if you're looking for a specific recommendation). Chip Zdarsky seems to be taking off (his Howard the Duck was quite nice).

Immortal Hulk is getting massive raves but I haven't caught up to that point yet so I can only pass along the message at the moment.

Despite sic's slander, Donny Cates's Venom has also been getting very solid reviews (haven't read), and Gerry Conway's recent run on Carnage was the first interesting take I've read on the character.

I could go on but I don't want to shit up the Marvel movies thread with off-topic discussion of Marvel comics.

I second the Spider-Woman rec — but I suggest you start further back, with New Duds. It’s fantastic.

i can recommend about a dozen currently running marvel books but the first one that comes to mind is Immortal Hulk

Milo's recommendation of Hickman's Avengers is quite an undertaking but heartily seconded. Hickman's FF run is also great and probably an easier sell to a neophyte. The first Complete Collection volume was just released a few months back with the second due shortly.

Other recent-ish ones I highly recommend:

She-Hulk by Soule & Pulido

Captain Marvel by Deconnick & Lopez

Gwenpool

Matt Fraction’s Hawkeye series — particularly the L.A. Woman volume, focusing on Kate Bishop

All-New Wolverine, by Tom Taylor & David Lopez

The Unworthy Thor — or really any of Jason Aaron’s Thor stuff, but this in particular

Karnack: The Flaw in all Things, by Warren Ellis

Many of these are light, fairly humorous, and female-focused, which is the mode I prefer. (The exceptions are All-New Wolverine, which is heavy action; Thor, which is Thor; and Karnack, which is totally brooding/bro-y, but a terrific self-contained book, I tore through it in one sitting.)

Also — you do indeed need to eventually read The Dark Knight Returns (though this feels like recommending you watch The Godfather or something).

man, I so wanted to love Karnak...

Ack, I misspelled his name — I can imagine the look the dude would give me, lol

Grant Morrison's Batman Incorporated but it's quite popular and I don't think you need to read other Batman books to get any of it.

Batman Incorporated is pretty much the SpiderVerse of Batman, actually - this might work well for joygoat.

(Of course, because it's corporate superhero comics, some of the characters stopped existing between pages because the entire DC universe got rebooted, and if yr library has it, it might be as Batman Incorporated Volume 1 (published 2011), followed by Batman Incorporated Volume 1 (published 2013), followed by Batman Incorporated Volume 2 (published 2014).)

Focus on a particular villain or that villain's origin or motivation is good, like I find it interesting when someone finds a way give a character who seems like a gimmick from 1967 a sense of gravitas.

oooh, here's a good one: Garth Ennis' run on the "Marvel Max" version of The Punisher.


(Which might be in your library as ten paperbacks, or as 5 hardcovers with larger pages, or as three regular hardcovers that are so thick that the pages don't open. Also, the regular Marvel Punisher series by Garth Ennis is something else that doesn't fit with these. Also, there are some pretty racist cod-blaxploitation, or set-in-the-future, or set-in-the-past Max miniseries by Ennis that were only collected in separate paperbacks afaik.)

I find it interesting when someone finds a way give a character who seems like a gimmick from 1967 a sense of gravitas.

They're all DC but...

Animal Man and Doom Patrol by Grant Morrison
Swamp Thing by Alan Moore

...are pretty much the gold standard for that kind of thing

Frank Millar's Daredevil, #168-191 is genuinely still good, for all that the writer has turned into a mad old coot in his later years - like Immortal Hulk, it's definitely not 5-year-old suitable.

(and also qualifies under the same criteria! xp)

Marvel universe, with a sense of colour and fun and silliness that gels with the Spider-Verse movie, and requiring no continuity knowledge: Peter Milligan and Mike Allred's run on X-Force, followed by X-Statix and several spinoffs.

(X-Force collected in three paperbacks or one hardcover that turned into a $150 ebay item a few months after it came out in 2004; X-Statix, but not the spin-offs, was collected in a huge hardcover at some point. The main series and one of the spin-offs were collected in five paperbacks.)


good self-contained DC GNs - Red Son (Soviet Superman), All-Star Superman

agree, this one should work for you.


She-Hulk by Soule & Pulido

can't speak to this, but the first year-long run of She-Hulk by Dan Slott, with Juan Bobillo & others on art, is a legal sitcom with superhero fights and space gods: two paperbacks, Single Green Female and Superhuman Law. (There was a longer second run that wasn't as good, nor as self-contained.)

Matt Fraction’s Hawkeye series — particularly the L.A. Woman volume, focusing on Kate Bishop

yeah, from what I've read this is like the tone of the good bits of the decent Marvel movies, except better

which reminds me - Keith Giffen, JM DeMatteis and Kevin Maguire's Defenders miniseries is like a goofy, sillier version of Thor: Ragnarok or the first Guardians Of The Galaxy movie. Collected in one paperback.

Animal Man and Doom Patrol by Grant Morrison
Swamp Thing by Alan Moore

...are pretty much the gold standard for that kind of thing

True.

They're all somewhat deconstructive (each in different ways) of the tropes and principles of superhero comics, too, not just the characters, if that's a point either in favour or against.)

(Though nb that nearly every reprint of Alan Moore's Swamp Thing ever has dropped out significant captions and artwork.) (Plus as far as I know, there's never been a reprint of the Frank Miller Daredevil which Andrew recommends that doesn't have hideous garish "re"colouring, though this also applies to nearly any current editions of 1940s-1990s Marvel.)

All Star Superman is a great rec too

Has a similar sense of fun to Spider-Verse, beautiful art, and is self-contained and doesn't require any knowledge of continuity

and I'd say Batman: Year One over Dark Knight Returns

I would not read X-Force/X-Statix to a five-year-old if that is part of the selection criteria.

FYI, if you're willing to wait a bit, they're recollecting all of Milligan's X-Force/X-Statix run starting early next year. It's worth the wait.

None of these suggestions, bar the all-ages omnibi, are suitable for five-year-olds.

Except Garth Ennis’ Punisher, where he cuts thumbs off of Russian heroin smugglers who are human-trafficking prostitutes in shipping crates and whatnot.

One last pipe bomb thrown at the thread's remit before I suggest moving the conversation elsewhere, but if you're looking for a (non-Marvel) comic five-year-olds will enjoy, you could do much worse than Axe Cop (a comic written by a five-year-old and which is, thusly, amazing).

Perhaps going forward, we can use this thraed: Recommend me some essential graphic novels to acquire!

Also linked from there and with more recent recommendations: recommend me some essential graphic novels to acquire

Ah, I knew there was a fresher thread. I've posted some stuff in Andrew's link.

sic — does this volume contain all the good Dan Slott material you mentioned?

Ah, NM, I guess that’s the first one you linked to

Slott's entire run is encompassed by the two complete collections.

slott's long run on amazing spider-man is also really, really good fyi

But okay so see the problem with recommending that one is that, although they started doing comprehensive reprints just a couple years ago, at least one of the collections is already out of print and fetching ridiculous prices.

Probably the best bet is for newbies to sign up for Marvel Unlimited and poke around until they find something they like. Trying to deal with Perlmutter's printing policies is more hassle than it's worth (which is specifically why I recommended stuff that was recently reprinted and thusly still in print in the other thread).

ahh see marvel unlimited is where i do all my reading nowadays so thankfully i don't have to worry about negotiating the insane world of marvel's reprints

Reasonable approach. I'm living proof of the toll those negotiations can take upon the fragile human mind.

(Plus as far as I know, there's never been a reprint of the Frank Miller Daredevil which Andrew recommends that doesn't have hideous garish "re"colouring, though this also applies to nearly any current editions of 1940s-1990s Marvel.)

ugh, I hate this re-coloring so much

Axe Cop is hilarious, second that rec for kids

sic — does this volume contain all the good Dan Slott material you mentioned?

Ah, NM, I guess that’s the first one you linked to

It isn't, it just has the same cover, because Marvel always want to make it as hard as possible for people to figure out what they're trying to read.

But okay so see the problem with recommending that one is that, although they started doing comprehensive reprints just a couple years ago, at least one of the collections is already out of print and fetching ridiculous prices.

Yes, I was keeping in mind what joygoat's library is most likely to have with my specific book references.

Probably the best bet is for newbies to sign up for Marvel Unlimited and poke around until they find something they like.

imo this is an extremely terrible idea for newbies, even newbies who have not specifically expressed a 100% preference for print volumes that they don't have to pay money for.

Look, there are no good options here, just a handful of less bad options. I'm coming from a position of 'just go ahead and read and buy everything' so I'm trying to view the problem through a sane person's eyes, with limited success.

A pal of mine has been buying these $1 priced Marvel 'True Believer' reprints for his nephew, and I think that's a great idea - classic Kirby FF eg for next to nothing. And they're sticking to movie familiar characters and storylines, on the whole, so you couldn't get a better way into the foundational stories of the MU.

If borrowing from the library, you might check out their electronic borrowing systems. Here in WA, Hoopla has been keeping me current with Saga and The Walking Dead. Though less complete/current on the Marvel & DC lines, they do carry a lot of the classic runs.

xpost Yeah, the coolest thing Marvel could do right now is to reinstitute spinner racks in grocery stores et al and fill 'em up with their True Believer one-offs.

For those who aren't aware of what Ward is talking about, every month Marvel puts out an array of about a dozen themed one-issue reprints for a buck. Like a bunch of key single issues featuring the Hulk pulled from throughout the character's publication history. I'm sure they'd be an awesome entrée into the Marvel U for those curious-yet-unfamiliar but I suspect they're only available in comics stores, which seems to undercut that eventuality somewhat.

marvel unlimited is $10 a month; if you or your kids are okay reading on a tablet or desktop, it's an easy and cheap way to riff through the stacks without putting out a ton of money.
https://www.marvel.com/comics/unlimited

Giancarlo Esposito being eyed for a major role, rumors aswirl that it may be Norman Osborn. As rumors that may have zero basis in fact go, this is pretty killer.

Was rewatching Zodiac and realized it stars Iron Man, the Hulk and Mysterio. Wonder Boys stars Ant Man, Spider-Man and Iron Man. Can we think of any other non MCU movies with a similarly large number of MCU actors?

Given that 50% of actors in Hollywood will have soon starred in an MCU flick, it shouldn't be hard.

This was actually a recurring feature at a local movie trivia night: "What non-superhero movie stars (comics character), (comics character), and (comics character)?" They weren't restrictive to Marvel characters, though, which does open things up, e.g. LA Confidential starring Vicki Vale, Lex Luthor, the Penguin, and Jor-El. And I guess Aldrich Killian, but I don't think they mentioned him. The category was fun when you could solve it, but absolutely maddening when you couldn't, mainly due to combinatoric excess re: the number of possible Batmen and Jokers.

Giancarlo Esposito being eyed for a major role, rumors aswirl that it may be Norman Osborn. As rumors that may have zero basis in fact go, this is pretty killer.

he's got the hair for it!